Someone To Look Forward To

[Juan Kerr]

You are so wrong.

 

(Minor point) Blair did not say that God ordered him to go to war. He said that he looked to his conscience to see whether he thought he was doing the right thing. And that ultimately God would judge whether he is right or wrong. Very different to your interpretation.

 

(More serious point) Lacking a party political system is very bad for the Island. When we vote, we don't know really, what we are voting for. Nobody declares who they'll support for Chief Minister and therefore we don't know if we are voting for or against the current regieme.

 

It also means there is prescious little opposition because everybody gets brought into the Government.

 

 

It was also interesting to see that "To pay less tax" was priority number one in moving. Not "To enjoy a more liberal life" or "To get out of the rat race".

 

I would take that out of any manifesto also.

[Politician]

You are so wrong.

 

(Minor point) Blair did not say that God ordered him to go to war. He said that he looked to his conscience to see whether he thought he was doing the right thing. And that ultimately God would judge whether he is right or wrong. Very different to your interpretation.

 

(More serious point) Lacking a party political system is very bad for the Island. When we vote, we don't know really, what we are voting for. Nobody declares who they'll support for Chief Minister and therefore we don't know if we are voting for or against the current regieme.

 

It also means there is prescious little opposition because everybody gets brought into the Government.

 

 

It was also interesting to see that "To pay less tax" was priority number one in moving. Not "To enjoy a more liberal life" or "To get out of the rat race".

 

I would take that out of any manifesto also.

 

Agreed! But I like to be upfront and honest, and tax was definitely a major consideration.

[Juan Kerr]

You are so wrong.

 

(Minor point) Blair did not say that God ordered him to go to war. He said that he looked to his conscience to see whether he thought he was doing the right thing. And that ultimately God would judge whether he is right or wrong. Very different to your interpretation.

 

(More serious point) Lacking a party political system is very bad for the Island. When we vote, we don't know really, what we are voting for. Nobody declares who they'll support for Chief Minister and therefore we don't know if we are voting for or against the current regieme.

 

It also means there is prescious little opposition because everybody gets brought into the Government.

 

 

It was also interesting to see that "To pay less tax" was priority number one in moving. Not "To enjoy a more liberal life" or "To get out of the rat race".

 

I would take that out of any manifesto also.

 

Agreed! But I like to be upfront and honest, and tax was definitely a major consideration.

 

I'm sorry if I am giving you a hard time, but essentially all I am saying is that I really think you need to reconsider your approach to PR.

 

One thing that you get to know about the Island is that there is an old colloqialism known as a "When-I"

 

A "When-I" is basically someone who rolls uo on these shores and then proceeds to try to convince you of their expertise by telling you about "When I did this" and "When I did that" and to be blunt you do come across as a bit of a "When-I" in some of the statements you make, and there's nothing that gets a Manxmans backk up more than a lecture from a When-I.

[Politician]

You are so wrong.

 

(Minor point) Blair did not say that God ordered him to go to war. He said that he looked to his conscience to see whether he thought he was doing the right thing. And that ultimately God would judge whether he is right or wrong. Very different to your interpretation.

 

(More serious point) Lacking a party political system is very bad for the Island. When we vote, we don't know really, what we are voting for. Nobody declares who they'll support for Chief Minister and therefore we don't know if we are voting for or against the current regieme.

 

It also means there is prescious little opposition because everybody gets brought into the Government.

 

 

It was also interesting to see that "To pay less tax" was priority number one in moving. Not "To enjoy a more liberal life" or "To get out of the rat race".

 

I would take that out of any manifesto also.

 

Agreed! But I like to be upfront and honest, and tax was definitely a major consideration.

 

I'm sorry if I am giving you a hard time, but essentially all I am saying is that I really think you need to reconsider your approach to PR.

 

One thing that you get to know about the Island is that there is an old colloqialism known as a "When-I"

 

A "When-I" is basically someone who rolls uo on these shores and then proceeds to try to convince you of their expertise by telling you about "When I did this" and "When I did that" and to be blunt you do come across as a bit of a "When-I" in some of the statements you make, and there's nothing that gets a Manxmans backk up more than a lecture from a When-I.

 

Also a very fair point, and good, constructive criticism - thanks! And let's be honest, my political career in the UK was hardly meteoric - I was involved in training MPs (probably including David Cameron, although I don't remember him), but they point blank refused to have me on the national candidates list because I didn't play the game.

[Juan Kerr]

I'm surprised that you can't recall whether you trained David Cameron or not. According to the Manx Indy bit on you, and his profile on the Tory Party website, your almost exactly the same age. On this basis I thought he might have stood out.

[Politician]

I'm surprised that you can't recall whether you trained David Cameron or not. According to the Manx Indy bit on you, and his profile on the Tory Party website, your almost exactly the same age. On this basis I thought he might have stood out.

 

The seminars - organised by the now disbanded Association of Conservative Parliamentary Candidates - had around 30 to 40 delegates each time, so individual people didn't tend to stand out. Being an advertising copywriter by profession, I was responsible for the module on communications. I certainly don't remember Cameron, but I did the seminars for the 2001 election, and that is the election at which he entered parliament, so there is a fair probability that I trained him.

[simon]

The point you made about the boundaries. I sort of see what you're saying. I think.

 

But does this mean that you think that some people or groups of people are still inherently more Labour or Conservative?

 

Suppose that you had the chance to gerrymander a boundary for either of the significant parties (and I'm not suggesting that you would).

 

But if you did - well who would choose as potential or likely Labour or Conservative voters?

[Politician]

The point you made about the boundaries. I sort of see what you're saying. I think.

 

But does this mean that you think that some people or groups of people are still inherently more Labour or Conservative?

 

Suppose that you had the chance to gerrymander a boundary for either of the significant parties (and I'm not suggesting that you would).

 

But if you did - well who would choose as potential or likely Labour or Conservative voters?

 

Gerrymandering of boundaries - in the sense you mean - isn't possible inasmuch as the Boundaries Commission is strictly non-partisan and apolitical. However, they have still arrived at a very biased solution due to their insistence on aligning constituencies, where possible, with council and county boundaries. The only fair way to create equalised constituencies would be to start in one corner of the country and work outwards, with no regard as to where constituency boundaries fell.

 

Nowadays, it seems that inner city voters are much more likely to vote Labour and rural voters to vote Conservative, resulting in this imbalance. Half a century ago, the reverse was true (to a lesser extent) and the bias went the other way - the Conservatives "won" the 1951 general election with a slightly lesser vote share than Labour.

 

At the last election, things were looking interesting, however - as the Liberal Democrats move increasingly leftwards they are starting to pick up urban seats from Labour and lose rural seats to the Tories. If that trend continued, Labour could find the middle of the road is a dangerous place to be.

[nipper]

Worthing Borough Council - Isle of Man Government

 

There are a number of similarities here.

 

Number of Councillors in Worthing Borough - 36

 

Number of (well paid) Tynwald MHK/MLCs - 24+12 = 36

(except there are loads of Councillors and Commissioners knocking about, but let's not get complicated just yet)

 

Population of IoM - 75,000 approx (more including transient?).

Population of Worthing Borough - 95,000 approx.

 

Of course we have a huge overhead having to run a 'country' having it's own government and so this isn't fairly comparing like with like.

 

Some interesting numbers to compare Worthing with the Isle of Man:

 

The Isle of Man has over 140 solicitors (or advocates as they call themselves here, who remarkably have a dual role as solicitor and barrister but charge barrister rates when doing solictor type work!!)

Worthing - ?

 

The Isle of Man has 2,171 (Oct 2005) Civil Servants. (+ Corporation/commissioners employees?)

Worthing - ?

 

There may be other useful parallels to attempt to draw - such as Law and Order or drug and drink matters, employment figures, etc.

 

I would welcome a politically minded person from UK to the Island - and although we don't like being told, we may even be enlightened in the world of politics.

 

Although I am sure that there are lots of nice things the Isle of Man compares favourably. We have 8 brass bands and two castles and a fairy bridge with lots of litter on it.

 

Any others comparisons?

[Lonan3]

A Victorian pier that needs a lot of work doing to it!

 

(This could get spooky!)

[Juan Kerr]

Apologies as everyone seems to think I am having a go unnecessarily and I am not. I'm just trying to hear what you have to say. It is important that new and interesting people come to live here and I'm not having a go because you've not been here long. But another article I read after I read the Argus story (which I was not going to refer to) inferred that you moved only a year after being elected for a 4 year term; and even if you moved for tax reasons you must have had an inkling at the time usless you simply decided that "enough is enough". That is what I found curious.

 

http://www.wor-ld.org.uk/wor-ld/wor_news.php?src=1&item=10

 

At least you have not had as much stick as the other guy how moved to Qatar!

 

http://www.eco-action.org/porkbolter/yule05.html

 

As I said we need interesting people here and your views are certainly as valid as anyone elses and you certainly defend them well!

[Politician]

Apologies as everyone seems to think I am having a go unnecessarily and I am not. I'm just trying to hear what you have to say. It is important that new and interesting people come to live here and I'm not having a go because you've not been here long. But another article I read after I read the Argus story (which I was not going to refer to) inferred that you moved only a year after being elected for a 4 year term; and even if you moved for tax reasons you must have had an inkling at the time usless you simply decided that "enough is enough". That is what I found curious.

 

http://www.wor-ld.org.uk/wor-ld/wor_news.php?src=1&item=10

 

At least you have not had as much stick as the other guy how moved to Qatar!

 

http://www.eco-action.org/porkbolter/yule05.html

 

As I said we need interesting people here and your views are certainly as valid as anyone elses and you certainly defend them well!

 

Well, I believe all politicians (and aspiring politicians) should have their views challenged and their actions subjected to scrutiny, so I don't have a problem with anything you've said.

 

It's quite correct that I moved to the Isle of Man just over one year into a four year term of office. However, the decision to move was certainly made after being elected and not before. Tax was definitely a consideration, but the clincher for me was realising the pointlessness of the party political system, after seeing it from the inside.

 

Two incidents in particular stick in my mind, and I was only involved in them because the Conservatives won such an overwhelming majority in the 2004 local elections - meaning a couple of us had to sit with the Liberal Democrat opposition due to the lack of seats on "our" side of the chamber.

 

In one case, the Leader of the Opposition, Bob Smytherman - whom I rather like as a person - stood up and delivered a coruscating attack on our policies before sitting down, turning to me with a huge grin and quietly asking me "Was that all right? Did I do OK?". I suppose I'd always known deep down that party politics was partly a game, but this really brought it home.

 

During another debate, I voted with my Conservative colleagues in refusing funding to a local charity because its accounts were in disarray and it could not provide an audit trail of what it did with its money - the Lib Dems were backing the charity's bid, mainly, I think, in an attempt to embarrass the Council's cabinet. Lib Dem councillor Robin Rogers - whom I also like - leaned over and said to me, "Richard, you should be ashamed of yourself." I promptly shot back, "Robin, this is just mischief making and you know it."

He looked pained. "No, I really care about this one," he said. I realised then and there that in party politics it's almost impossible to tell whether anyone is being sincere or playing to the gallery in order to score political points.

 

I did upset poor old Robin on another occasion too. He was attacking local arrangements for refuse collection, and was arguing about whether dustmen should be collecting bins from people's alleys and back yards. Unfortunately, his exact wording was "Some of us require a dustman in our back passage", and I burst out laughing - followed by the rest of the Council. Robin was completely thrown off his stride and forgot what he was supposed to say next. It wasn't until he sat down that he realised what he had said.

 

I must say, I feel really sorry for the negative coverage Alan Whiteley has received - he's a great bloke, and unlike me does not have the choice of where he works. The Qatar contract is paying him a lot of money, but with work as specialised as his, had he turned it down he might not have earned a penny for six or twelve months. In any case, he did absolutely the right thing - knowing he would not be able to attend Council meetings regularly, he disclaimed his allowance and (so far as I know) will not be standing again this May when his seat comes up for re-election.

[Pat Ayres]

Richard, or 'politician' as you are now!

Again I welcome you to the island, I know I was one of the first to do so last year.

We have similar backgrounds, politically, but from different sides of the debate so to speak.

I moved here to avoid the decline of English politics.

Blair has indeed lost the plot recently.

I do not believe Brown will be the next PM.

I like to answer questions truthfully.

I prefer the tax regime here as well. (although the difference in our incomes is vast) it sure helps.

There, I agree with a member of the Conservative Association, never thought it could happen.

A tip to you, resign from your political party, as I did, and fully engage in the IOM politics. Forget Durrington, often said not to be twinned with anywhere but in a suicide pact with Wapping. Keep your friends but make some here, it is well worthwhile.

I made a decision when moving here, do not ever say "when I was in England we----------".

[Politician]

Richard, or 'politician' as you are now!

Again I welcome you to the island, I know I was one of the first to do so last year.

We have similar backgrounds, politically, but from different sides of the debate so to speak.

I moved here to avoid the decline of English politics.

Blair has indeed lost the plot recently.

I do not believe Brown will be the next PM.

I like to answer questions truthfully.

I prefer the tax regime here as well. (although the difference in our incomes is vast) it sure helps.

There, I agree with a member of the Conservative Association, never thought it could happen.

A tip to you, resign from your political party, as I did, and fully engage in the IOM politics. Forget Durrington, often said not to be twinned with anywhere but in a suicide pact with Wapping. Keep your friends but make some here, it is well worthwhile.

I made a decision when moving here, do not ever say "when I was in England we----------".

 

Thanks, Skrappey! I think Blair's behaviour in office has indeed united many people of completely different political backgrounds and outlooks, all angry at the constant lies and spin and the warmongering foreign policy of the present UK government. And you're absolutely right - my commitment now is to my life in this country, and my interest is in its political system.

[P.K.]

my commitment now is to my life in this country, and my interest is in its political system

I'm no longer resident on the island. But something about this thread nagged at me. The last post made me realise what is was - the use of the word "commitment".

 

It takes a while to organise moving, sometimes it seems to drag on forever. Especially "overseas" (well, maybe) but more importantly to somewhere that requires you to have a work permit.

 

You are elected in Worthing in June 2004 and only 13 months later move to the IOM - makes me wonder.

 

Coun Falk said the Isle of Man was a wonderful place to live and he planned to stand as an independent for the Manx Parliament in 2011.

You're on the island for only 2 months and that's already your gameplan? I'm presuming here that The Argus didn't make it up and are quoting you.

 

The plan is to continue until April to avoid the considerable expense of a by-election, which isn't the best use of public money.

IMHO it's not your decision to make and it is absolutely no longer your money.

 

Since I was elected, I haven't had a lot of constituents ringing me needing my help.

Well Mr JRG Falk, what do you think the constituents you have left behind think of your "commitment" to your new life in your new country? I can give you some pointers if you like, based around the amount of commitment you have shown to those who elected you compared to the amount you give to yourself.

 

Also check out the 9/11 thread. For all those conspiracy nuts you're not a Freemason are you?