dooahhdoo Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 I voted yes. Maybe the Government will forget to fix this one and we will finally get the speed limit the majority want. Do you not know the results of the last consultation Declan? The majority are against a speed limit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripsaw Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 Mr Shimmin's own words... The most contentious of our proposals was the introduction of a maximum all-Island speed limit. We have listened to the public and due to the strength of opposition and lack of support from many local Authorities, we do not propose to introduce this measure at this time. Many people will share my disappointment at this decision. However, we set out to consult with our people and it would be insincere if we then ignored the overwhelming view of those who expressed an opinion. We are committed to monitoring these initiatives and will come forward with a speed policy by December 2005. In the meantime we will be implementing many of the initiatives identified in this report, which we hope will begin to have a beneficial effect. If there is no significant improvement in relation to the quality and speed of driving, the issue of an Island-wide speed limit will have to be revisited. Hon J P Shimmin MHK Minister for Transport Source: The Department of Transport’s Response to the Results of the Public Consultation : Initial Report October 2004 "Revisiting the issue of an all Island Speed limit" does not mean blowing thousands more pounds of tax payers money knocking on every single door on the Island. Of 408 letters submitted in the public consultation, 281 (69%) were firmly against this proposal. Of those opponents, 42 were from off the Island. Source: DOT Highways Division Press Release 281 (less the 42 from off Island) is not the majority of the public, 408 is however representative of the number who were opinionated enough to bother contributing. Declan is probably correct in that most people (given the oppotunity to respond without raising their butts from the sofa) would not be opposed to the introduction of a speed limit. They maybe not be in favour, but not opposed. It depends on how the "new" question is asked and how the replies are eventually presented. Having the oppotunity to learn from the previous consultation, I have no doubt that the results of the next one will differ somewhat. Edit:typos (/makes note to use "preview post" botton more) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 I voted yes. Maybe the Government will forget to fix this one and we will finally get the speed limit the majority want. Do you not know the results of the last consultation Declan? The majority are against a speed limit. The last consultation was a joke. The Government got the answer it wanted. What I don't understand is why they don't just come out and say that they are against the speed limit and we just have to lump it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
=^..^= Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 Hey Declan - the 'funny' thing is that I feel the govt are Pro Speed limit. Aah well it all depends on your perspective. I personally want safer roads but I believe that it will be achieved through education not legislation. One figure that is never published in all the reems of statistics we see is how many people were killed in accidents where an existing piece of legislation was being broken. If people are not being saved by existing legislation either because its not relevant, not working or simply not being enforced then surely another bit of legislation which does not work and is not being enforced is not going to make a difference.... If the reason people are being killed is because laws are not being enforced then give the police more resources and the priority to tackle the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dooahhdoo Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 109 people wrote in to the DOT and said they wanted a speed limit. 281 people wrote in and said they did not. Is that not a majority? It is about people getting off their arses and doing what they believe in I agree. I cannot see how you suppose those who did not bother are for a limit? Edited as I forgot to add over 3100 people signed our petition for no blanket speed limit. If people feel so strongly about introducing one then why has nobody started a petition for a limit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 I voted yes. Maybe the Government will forget to fix this one and we will finally get the speed limit the majority want. With all due respect - which majority? Your majority? the government's sampled consultative majority? the majority of Tynwald? or what the majority of people really think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 I voted yes. Maybe the Government will forget to fix this one and we will finally get the speed limit the majority want. With all due respect - which majority? Your majority? the government's sampled consultative majority? the majority of Tynwald? or what the majority of people really think? The majority of people, not that I've made an exhaustive survey or anything, so it may just be the majority of people I know. I believe that the majority of the Government are against the speed limit because they are running scared of a very vocal lobby (who to be fair have run a very good campaign). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxchatterbox Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 If people are not being saved by existing legislation either because its not relevant, not working or simply not being enforced then surely another bit of legislation which does not work and is not being enforced is not going to make a difference.... Five already pulled up for speeding on he Ballamodha......did the speed limit stop them from speeding? NO In the last three years 20(?) people have died in accidents in already restricted areas...did the speed limit save their lives? NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arronc Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 I actually had the "pleasure" of analysing the UK data on speed/fatalities once, and the detail in the correlation between speed and severity is all below 50mph on minor roads. Above 50mph, the correlation between speed and level of injury from accidents is random noise, meaning that statistically the outcome of collision and accidents above 50 mph on minor roads is down to factors outside speed, such as type of vehicle, road conditions , traffic desnity etc. It should be noted that on dual carridgeways, and motorways, the detail extended into higher speed brackets, but as we dont have any, its not relevant. Bottom line : if you crash at 50 ,60, or 70 mph on a minor road, you are as likely to die at 50 as you are at 70. So if the speed limit is capped at 70, it seems unlikely that the fatality rate will change, statistcly. Unless I did it all wrong of course , but it seems to make some sense when you think it through. It would interesting to know if anyone from the government had to type the reports into excel and do the analysis.... you would expect they would ? Edited to add : like this : http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/dft_...tats_041315.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripsaw Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 Edited as I forgot to add over 3100 people signed our petition for no blanket speed limit. If people feel so strongly about introducing one then why has nobody started a petition for a limit? I saw reference to your online petition in the October 2004 document that I linked to. Did any of them say why they didn't take the oppotunity to add to the official figures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 Perhaps they should just ban driving altogether - and the effects of passive driving (death of pedestrians, passengers and the environment). It would also probably cure obesity, as we'd all have to walk everywhere...hey! I feel a consultation coming on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dooahhdoo Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 Edited as I forgot to add over 3100 people signed our petition for no blanket speed limit. If people feel so strongly about introducing one then why has nobody started a petition for a limit? I saw reference to your online petition in the October 2004 document that I linked to. Did any of them say why they didn't take the oppotunity to add to the official figures? They did if you read the document you quoted above correctly :- 5. REASONS QUOTED AGAINST/NOT IN FAVOUR OF RSI PROPOSALSThere were 281 letters received by the Department opposing the proposal to introduce a maximum speed limit on the Isle of Man. The No Limit petition of 1325 Manx residents should also be taken into consideration at this stage. Unfortunately they seemed to ignore the other 1800 off Island residents who thought it was important enough to visit a website and enter their name, email address and postcode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 [unfortunately they seemed to ignore the other 1800 off Island residents who thought it was important enough to visit a website and enter their name, email address and postcode. That's no bad thing - otherwise we'd have Bush in charge over here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 Thanks arronc, there is much more to road fatalities than just speed. Any car moving above, say, 20 could seriously injure someone, at 30/40 they will probably be killed. It's an easy panacea for the Govt to clamp down on speed when the real killer is the awful standard of driving; which is more to do with enforcing good standards of driving. You see drivers here doing manouevres that just would not be contemplated in the UK. An example: I was driving last Sunday through Farmhill to go to the St Marks road that takes you onto the Spring Valley roundabout. Moving up to the junction and indicating to turn right, a car came down and instead of sitting on the junction decided that the best thing to do would be to go on the other side of the road (and traffic island) and scoot right down. What chance do you have with idiots like that and how can good standards of driving be achieved if there is no enforcement! He would have been doing around 25/30 but he would make a great big dent in my side of the car, let alone the damage to my son and me! The best thing for road safety on the Island is to have lots of policemen out pulling dumbwits over and telling what they did wrong, giving them a mark towards losing their licence and ENFORCING it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneWolf Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 An example: I was driving last Sunday through Farmhill to go to the St Marks road that takes you onto the Spring Valley roundabout. Moving up to the junction and indicating to turn right, a car came down and instead of sitting on the junction decided that the best thing to do would be to go on the other side of the road (and traffic island) and scoot right down. What chance do you have with idiots like that and how can good standards of driving be achieved if there is no enforcement! Heck ..hope that wasnt me. Power steering belt snapped at roundabout below farmhill on vicarage road on Sunday. Must have looked a wild manouvre for a second or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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