The Election. Does Anyone Care?

[sgollob]

You always come across, on here, as a person of some intelligence, Chinahand.

 

Why the hell don't you stand against Noel?

 

My gut instinct tells me that a no-contest should be a non-result. Stand against him.

 

 

*ahem* stand against Tony.

 

 

Whilst he has been mentioned, Noel Cringle, President of Tynwald, was ousted from his seat in Rushen only to make a return the following election, so they are all in fact as dispensable as anyone else. Its worth letting them know that sometimes

 

Please someone, stand in Castletown.

 

. . . and Malew and Santon

[Addie]

Why the hell don't you stand against Tony?

 

Fixed my post

[Lonan3]

I accept that local politics appear boring to most people but, even though civil servants may make the legislation work, elected (and unelected) politicians set the agenda and therefore have a great deal of influence over what is to happen in our lives over the next 5 years.

The combination of alleged corruption and utter blandness has succceeded in driving people away from any interest in the doings of Tynwald - but this is the only chance we'll get to actually make any difference.

If we really want things changing, we have to encourage people to come forward who will be prepared to intiate those changes - and encourage others to vote for them

Personally, I want to see a Legislative Council that is elected by universal suffrage rather than the votes of the MHKs; I want to see the Local Government reform proceeding sensibly and consensually - without overcentralising matters that are best dealt with on a local level.... and so on and so on.

I only have one vote - so I'll use it, and hope that everyone who has any interest whatsoever in the future of our small society will do the same.

[Ripsaw]

Personally, I want to see a Legislative Council that is elected by universal suffrage rather than the votes of the MHKs

I agree that the current method needs changing.

 

How would MLCs be voted in by the public? All in one go either at time of Genearl Election, All in one go at fixed terms irrespective of Keys Elections or on an ad hoc basis as each serves a term, retires, deaths, etc.? Would the public have a right to call for Votes of no Confidence?

 

At the very least members of CoMin should be illegible to take part voting in MLC members as there is the potential for a conflict of interest when you take into account the original purpose of there being an LegCo.

[Ushtey]

He was commenting that the number of people who were likely to vote in the November general election was extremely low.

 

I don't know where he found this information but I seriously would like to find out his source. Was it in a local paper or on the radio?

 

Could anyone please point me towards any on-line articles/features that gave an indication as to how many people are likely to vote?

 

The details of the last elections are listed on the Government site here http://www.gov.im/cso/election/historical.xml

 

Reading through this thread reminds me a lot of a time when I complained that things weren't the way I wanted them and I moaned that they were only likely to get worse. Hence I decided that it was time to stop waiting for someone else to resolve the problems and put my name forward to try to do something about them directly. I'm trying not to sound patronising or beat my own drum, just simply saying that until the right people are elected who will change things, then it's unlikely things will ever change and you can't keep waiting for someone else to change it for you.

 

I do think we need an elected MLC, but as it stands, I can't see the MLC voting that in themsevles, and I can't see many long standing MHKs spoiling their chance at "promotion" by voting that in. So it's down to new members and and the electorate pressuring existing members.

 

Personally, I think Tynwald is competing with the finance sector for good managers. Why put yourself through an election campaign, if you can have an easier life and equal if not better pay and benefits by staying in the private sector? That plus forcing senior civil servants to resign, I feel discounts a lot of potentially very good candidates.

 

I also think that serious consideration should be given to introducing a re-open nominations or none of the above for uncontested elections. But again, this kind of policy change is unlikely to be made voted for by people who were elected uncontested.

 

Ultimately it comes down to if you want to change things either stand yourself, or work with a candidate who will challenge those policies if elected (even if that candidate isn't in your area). If you don't want to vote, do something to make public why you choose that, things like writing to the press and other candidates explaining why you chose not to or signing a petition calling for alternatives in uncontested elections and a fully elected House. But don't spend the next five years complaining things are bad without trying to change them, that's a missed opportunity and a waste.

[Charles Flynn]

Steve,

 

I agree with most of what you are saying. However two points:

 

1. New members may well decide to keep Legco unelected for self protection.

 

2. I would hope candidates do not stand primarily for the pay. If that is all they want, it is surely better for the public that they remain in the private sector.

[sgollob]

There are eight available positions within the Legislative Council that are voted in by the House of Keys for a term of 5 years.

 

To allow for continuity the 8 positions are in two blocks of 4 and the terms overlap.

 

The block of 4 that was elected Feb/March 2003 sit until Feb 2008 (MLCs Crowe, Christian, Lowey, Singer).

 

The other block of 4 seats terminated in Feb 2005 and so will run until 2010 (MLCs Downey, Waft, Gelling, Butt).

 

There has been much controversy over the voting in of MLCs. Under the present often quite farcical system it can take many ballots over a number of consecutive House of Keys sittings to force the system to select a successful candidate. Some MLCs get in on the very first ballot and others can get in after a dozen or so attempts. I will write a few lines on the subject elesewhere but it is significant to note that one exasperated MHK once proclaimed that the House of Keys were "scraping the barrel". In some cases I would agree.

 

So considering the General Election is November 2006 there is room for a popularly elected Legislative Council in the calendar.

 

The public would need to understand the role of the Legislative Council though and it is this that is also not clear. I have heard it said that it is a bit like the Home of Rest for Old MHKs, except it is well paid and you get to sit on a hill once a year but I don't really think this is a fair description.

[Albert Tatlock]

People fought and died for us to have our vote and we should never waste it.

 

If you don't feel like voting for particular candidates and are unhappy with the way things are or the choice of candidates, I would suggest still turning up to vote but perhaps instead spoiling your ballot paper by writing 'no confidence' or something similar on the paper. Candidates (and the press) often get to see spoilt papers especially if several of them send a message, and 50 spoilled papers in any IOM constituency would stand out.

 

Not turning up solves nothing.

[Cake]

Can you share your reasons for not caring? In what way don't it matter to you who is voted in? What if a close friend or a family member had reason to vote for a particular candidate, wouldn't you even vote to support that friend/relative?

 

Same questions to anyone else in the 'Don't Care' camp

 

The politicians in the IoM have absolutely nothing to do with the formation of any of the important government policy they are just there to vote in what the senior civil servants tell them is necessary.

 

I very much doubt a former taxi driver or shop owner has the first clue what they are voting for when deciding on the corporate tax strategy for the next decade or some other such piece of legislation.

 

Any important changes in laws are pretty much copy and paste from UK legislation so what difference does it make who votes them in?

 

 

You know they say if you don't vote, you can't complain. That said I do agree that it always seems a pointless exercise to vote but I still do it.

[Charles Flynn]

There is a "dullness" in Manx politics and politicians these days. This is what we get when we elect career politicians who are afraid to put a foot wrong.

 

The electorate don't vote because no one has the charisma to make Tynwald really exciting. Most of them churn out the same boring mantra - open, transparent, accountable government - is the current one.

[Addie]

People fought and died for us to have our vote and we should never waste it.

 

If you don't feel like voting for particular candidates and are unhappy with the way things are or the choice of candidates, I would suggest still turning up to vote but perhaps instead spoiling your ballot paper by writing 'no confidence' or something similar on the paper. Candidates (and the press) often get to see spoilt papers especially if several of them send a message, and 50 spoilled papers in any IOM constituency would stand out.

 

Not turning up solves nothing.

Albert, I agree with all you say.

 

Sadly, spoiling a paper seems the only option when faced with an unsatisfactory selection of candidates. So, a "none of the above" or "no confidence" neatly printed on each paper might eventally send a message.

 

Maybe even those standing alone in an area could eventually be open to a vote. At least we'd know what size mandate they had.

 

That's the important thing about finding someone to stand against these people. Then, and only then, are votes counted.

 

Steve Babb. It's not that simple for anyone to be suitable to be an MHK. I can't for many reasons.

 

I do complain about some but just because, say, I think someone can't sing, doesn't automatically give me a voice like Elisabeth Schwarzkopf.

 

But I have assisted others and still would aid those I thought merited a place in the Keys if I could.

[Deejay Denzel]

IOM Elections website

[Pat Ayres]

Yes I care.

Why do we give space to people that take great time and effort to point out they don't and won't vote on any point?

If they don't care then SHUT THE FUCK UP and let those of us that do carry on and hopefully help decide policy by electing people that can do just that. If you know sod all about politics isn't it about time you did find something out. An abstention is a vote in favour of the status quo, not voting just endorces the attitudes of those we feel aren't worthy.

if you genuinely don't care then you are happy with price rises of power, changes in postal rates, over development of the green belt and changing Douglas prom into an elongated dog toilet.

Get real folks, they're coming for you next.

[Ushtey]

Steve Babb. It's not that simple for anyone to be suitable to be an MHK. I can't for many reasons.

 

I do complain about some but just because, say, I think someone can't sing, doesn't automatically give me a voice like Elisabeth Schwarzkopf.

 

But I have assisted others and still would aid those I thought merited a place in the Keys if I could.

 

I wholly appreciate what you say regards not being that simple to be suitable to stand and I applaud your efforts to help out others who are standing. My aim was to suggest there are alternatives to simply walking away from the elections. And to remind people that they can think outside their own constituency.

 

You don't need to be a soprano to have a voice though. There have been plenty, and some would argue there still are, who have been elected who perhaps weren;t the cream of the crop, but who gave it a go. And there are a lot more who work very hard at community level. I just hope enough people find a way to express their opinions and concerns in a productive way. And that there are enough in Government to listen and have the guts to try to change things.

 

I am sure there are many first time candidates, like myself, who would welcome any support from people, even if it's just discussing policy and giving an opinion on manifesto letters. Often, the newwer voices find it difficult to compete against sitting candidates because of the support base those people have in place and the time they have now that Tynwald is in recess, to canvass.

 

I know there is at least one other person on these boards seriously considering standing, am I am certain they would welcome any support people can offer, no matter how small it may seem.

[hboy]

Steve Babb. It's not that simple for anyone to be suitable to be an MHK. I can't for many reasons.

 

Name them. That is the lamest excuse ever against someone who has decided to risk it and stand.

 

Do you "earn too much money" (bollocks)

 

Or are you worried about risking it all and not getting in?

 

If you WANT to stand and feel you have the qualities to get in, and you don't agree with what is going on you HAVE to stand (assuming you have integrity of course)