[BBC News]Race issues group visits bishop

[Newsbot]

A high level Anglican committee investigates Manx attitudes to ethnic minorities.

 

Source : http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/rss/-/1/hi/world/...man/5378420.stm

[keyboarder]

Not much of a report this is it? Can anyone flesh it out a little?

[Tuna Sandwich]

Since the Manx people are actually a minority on the Island, I wonder if institutional racism against the Manx will be raised? I doubt it some how.

[keyboarder]

Since the Manx people are actually a minority on the Island, I wonder if institutional racism against the Manx will be raised? I doubt it some how.

Mmmm, I can sort of see why they're coming now. Are Manx people really a minority?

[Tuna Sandwich]

Mmmm, I can sort of see why they're coming now. Are Manx people really a minority?

 

I believe the number of people who can claim to be totally Manx (i.e. do not have the right to live and work in Europe stamped in their passports) is less than 10,000. That is far less than the number of UK immigrants.

 

As I said though I am sure this is not why they are here.

[BigDave]

Collectively there are more non-Manx on the Island than there are Manx, but the Manx are still the largest single group. I think the last figure I saw (granted a couple of years ago) was 51% of the Island's population non-Manx, which includes English, Irish, Scottish, Welsh, Italian, German etc etc.

 

Only 10,000 true Manx out of 80,000? That just doesn't sound right. Are you going by actual population or passports issued?

[Tuna Sandwich]

I believe it was a figure calculated at the last census (or the one before that) where the number of people who had both parents, and both sets of grand parents all Manx born was something like 10,000. The number seemed surprisingly low to me as well, but then it only takes one of the 6 people mentioned above to not be Manx to affect the statisitc.

[BigDave]

Ahh, right. I was looking at the figures for Manx born, which at the 2001 census was around 36,500 people. I was trying to work out where 26,500 people had gone!

[Charles Flynn]

Tjhe Committee which looks into the position of Ethnic Minorities is really a committee of the Church of England which is primarily concerned with the welcome and support or inded any issue which arises for black people i.e. people from the Caribean mainly. It monitors and makes recommendations to the Archbishops' Council, the General SYnod and Boards and Councils of the CoE.

 

Ony 2.2.% of clergy were from minority ethnic backgrounds in 2005, compared to 7.9% of the working population in the UK 2001 census and 3.2% of electoral roll members in 2002.

 

Minority ethnic candidates accounted for 4.7% of all those recommended for training for ordination in 2005.

 

So there is proportinately fewer people of Black and Black British backgrounds among the clergy than among the population or omn Church electoral rolls. Black and Black British people account for 2.3% of both the population and the electoral rolls, they account for 0.9% of its clergy.

 

The lady who is leading the group told Clergy and Readers of the Diocese today that out of 113 Bishops in England and Wales and the IOM only 3 were black out of a total of 113. The current Archbishop of York is one of them.

 

I t was felt that in the IOM there is work to do not only about the small number of black people who attend Angican services but also about the numbers of young people.

 

There will be a Report in this weeks Manx papers about the visit. I understand the Tynwald members will also be consulted on ways in which integration and best practice can be achieved.

[Hugh Jampton]

Sounds like the Race Relations Industry is getting into gear to create jobs for itself over here.

[Charles Flynn]

No I don't think so. Quite frankly the visit to the Isle of Man is only because Sodor & Man is one of the Dioceses of the Church of England and they are obliged to include us.

 

No real issues were raised in our meeting as there are so few black people attending Anglican services here - possibly one or two families here and there amongst the Parishes who are very welcome.

[Tuna Sandwich]

What amazes me is that the C of E are surprised by the low figures. But, why should they be any higher? C of E does not have that high an attendance by black people in the Caribean so why should it be different here?

 

As far as attracting younger people is concerned the C of E has only it's self to blame.

[Charles Flynn]

What amazes me is that the C of E are surprised by the low figures. But, why should they be any higher? C of E does not have that high an attendance by black people in the Caribean so why should it be different here?

 

As far as attracting younger people is concerned the C of E has only it's self to blame.

 

 

I believe the main problem is a clash of cultures. Young people need to be able to relate with what is going on. They have to be fully involved. This is a major problem for many organisations apart from the churches.

 

As far as 'black' people are concerned, there are far more black people within the Anglican comminion than whites but they are under represented in England and Wales. There are serious issues in England because of the perception of institutionalised racism which were discussed in the Stephen Lawrence Inquiry. As the IOM has such a low population of black people it hasn't reared its ugly head as yet on this Island but we need to be aware of potential issues which may arise.

[Shadey Burger]

I remember this interview, it caused a great deal of satisfaction amongst

ordinary Aussies.... Greg.

 

 

 

.....................

 

Subject: Subject: Australia and Muslims, a little long but worth it.

 

Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on Wednesday to

get out of Australia, as the government targeted radicals in a bid to head

off potential terror attacks.

 

A day after a group of mainstream Muslim leaders pledged loyalty to

Australia at a special meeting with Prime Minister John Howard, he

and his ministers made it clear that extremists would face a crackdown.

 

Treasurer Peter Costello,seen as heir apparent to Howard, hinted

that some radical clerics could be asked to leave the country if

they did not accept that Australia was a secular State and its laws

were made by parliament.

 

 

"If those are not your values, if you want a country that has Sharia

law or a theocratic state, then Australia is not for you", he said

on national television.

 

 

"Immigrants, not Australians must adapt. Take it or leave it. I am

tired of this Nation worrying about whether we are offending some

individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we

have experienced a surge in

patriotism by the majority of Australians.

 

 

However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when

the"politically correct" crowd began complaining about the

possibility that our patriotism was offending others. I am not

against immigration nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is

seeking a better life by coming to Australia.

 

 

However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to

our country, and apparently some who were born here, need to

understand.

 

 

The idea of Australia being a multicultural community has served

only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. As

Australians we have our own culture, our own society, our own

language and our own lifestyle.

 

This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles,

trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought

freedom. We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese or Arabic,

Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you

want to become part of our society, ...learn the

language.

 

 

Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right

wing, political push but a fact because Christian men and women, on

Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly

documented. It is certainly appropiate to display it on the walls of

our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider

another part of the world as your new home, because God is part of

our culture.

 

 

We will accept your beliefs and will not question why, all we ask

is that you accept ours and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment

with us.

 

 

If the Southern Cross offends you or you don´t like a "Fair Go" then

you should seriously consider a move

 

to another part of this planet.

 

 

We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change and we

really don´t care how you did things

where you came from. By all means, keep your culture but do not

force it on others.

 

 

This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE and we will allow

you every opportunity to enjoy all this. But once you are done

complaining, whining and griping about our Flag, Our Pledge, Our

Christian beliefs or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you to take

advantage of one other great Australian freedom:

 

THE RIGHT TO LEAVE.

 

 

If you are not happy here then LEAVE. We didn´t force you to come

here. You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted.

 

 

"I´d be saying to clerics who are teaching that there are two laws

governing people in Australia, one the Australian law and another

the Islamic law. That is false. If you can´t agree with

parliamentary law, independent courts, democracy and would prefer

Sharia law and have the opportunity to go to another country, which

practices it, perhaps, then, that´s a better option" Costello said.

 

 

Asked whether he meant radical clerics would be forced to leave, he

said those with dual citizenship could possibly be asked to move to

the other country.

 

 

Education minister Brendan Nelson later told reporters that Muslims

who do not want to accept local values should " clear off "

 

"Basically, people who don´t want to be Australians and they don´t

want to live by Australian values and understand them, well then they can

basically clear off" he said. Separately Howard angered some Australian

Muslims on Wednesday by

saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation´s mosques.

 

 

USA, EUROPE an CANADA....ARE YOU LISTENING ??

[localyokel]

It was felt that in the IOM there is work to do not only about the small number of black people who attend Angican services but also about the numbers of young people.

 

Has it occured to the geniuses in the Church that there are not many black people here. Hence I suppose its entirely reasonable that only a small number could possibly turn up for your services?

 

As for encouraging the young. What does the Anglican church offer anyone, young or not? Its just not relevant to most peoples lives anymore, and why should it be? Dull churches, dull people, and you don't even get a good sing-song (which is one thing you can say about the Afro-Caribeans - they know how to have a good time in church).