Declan Posted January 16, 2007 Share Posted January 16, 2007 I went up to have a skeet (as no doubt did a number of you) plus bumped into the team on the town & one thing I would say is that it would appear non of the 'character' is affected - unless they are extremely good in staying in role all weekend, even in offsite hours! So Tony Robinson is an obnoxious little prat in real life as well? I agree with the comments about the way they deal with human remains. It is necessary for historical research but autopsies are needed for scientific purposes - doesn't mean they need to be accompanied by some actor squealing like a school girl. ("Ooh this is really exciting we've found a pancreas.") Saw one where a WWII plane was dug up, complete with crew member. Although an interesting programme, I wish they'd show more respect, cut out the wild speculation and seemed less slap dash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snaipyr Posted January 16, 2007 Share Posted January 16, 2007 Am I the only one to feel uncomfortable that graves were desecrated in the name of entertainment? In fact I was disgusted with the way that newly discovered graves were greeted with whoops of childish excitement, reminiscent of little children opening christmas presents. One of the presenters even shouted that he could see a skeleton in one of them - what else would he expect? The graves were then ripped open and the bones yanked out and slung in plastic bags "for carbon dating". One poor lady who had lain undisturbed for nigh on 1400 years even had her remaining hair scooped out unceremoniously on the end of a trowel, for no reason other than to tell us that Manx girls used to plait their hair all those years ago. Perhaps Andy Johnson and his side-kick Nick Johnson (the "Keeil expert") ought to be slung out on their backsides and people with more respect for our past be employed - after all it is public money that pays them. You are, of course, entitled to your view - unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted January 16, 2007 Share Posted January 16, 2007 I thought it was an excellent programme, even if I do think Tony is a complete pratt at times. IMHO the graves were dug with respect, they were very careful with the remains. If he's/we're lucky he might be in the next Celebrity Big Brother house. Are you serious??? Give the man a break, he's got a real job, he seems to have a talent - even if he has a 'quirky accent' - WTF would anyone with a real job & some talent ever be doing on a programme like Big Brother??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posters Posted January 16, 2007 Share Posted January 16, 2007 I heard that Tony Robinson gets paid more per episode than any of the rest of the team get paid per year. I thought it was a very good episode. I, for one, was glad and proud to find out more about our Island. There are a few other places I'd like to see them dig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempus Fugit Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 There are a few other places I'd like to see them dig. I have a feeling there's something interesting under my spud patch, do you think they would dig there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 I heard that Tony Robinson gets paid more per episode than any of the rest of the team get paid per year. No surprise. Apparently Ann Robinson has £50 odd million in the bank - mainly from the BBC. Good to see licence payer's money being spent efficently Watch out for the next 'richest people in Britain' list! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minxie Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 I finally got round to watching this last night as had it on Sky Plus. I thought it was great episode and also felt quite proud of our Island. As the Time Team only have 3 days to excavate, and during that time they found a bounty of archaeological evidence. After their 3 days was it all covered over again for future generations to dig around in, or will Manx National Heritage investigate it for further finds themselves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manxman In Exile Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 Am I the only one to feel uncomfortable that graves were desecrated in the name of entertainment? In fact I was disgusted with the way that newly discovered graves were greeted with whoops of childish excitement, reminiscent of little children opening christmas presents. One of the presenters even shouted that he could see a skeleton in one of them - what else would he expect? The graves were then ripped open and the bones yanked out and slung in plastic bags "for carbon dating". One poor lady who had lain undisturbed for nigh on 1400 years even had her remaining hair scooped out unceremoniously on the end of a trowel, for no reason other than to tell us that Manx girls used to plait their hair all those years ago. Perhaps Andy Johnson and his side-kick Nick Johnson (the "Keeil expert") ought to be slung out on their backsides and people with more respect for our past be employed - after all it is public money that pays them. You are, of course, entitled to your view - unfortunately. Why "unfortunately"?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartT Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 So Tony Robinson is an obnoxious little prat in real life as well? Not sure, I've never considered him to be an obnoxious little prat, so I couldn't really comment. I didn't speak to him anyway, though I understand he apologised to someone he nearly walked into - so maybe not so obnoxious. Just that the rest of the team did not seem to affect any accents that they did not use away from the site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copycat Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 as a labour party leftie I'm surprised he didn't take the opportunity to make some comment about the IOM being used by extreme right wing political groups for fund raising or a derogatory one about the IOM being used as a tax haven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponderer Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 I have just been reading both the 'Manx Forums Time Team Find' thread and comparing it with Channel 4's own forum thread on their Isle of Man Time Team programme. How sad is manx forums dot com! Channel 4 Time team forum: http://community.channel4.com/eve/forums/a...11/m/7040076507 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 1500 year old hair!!! That's awsome!!!! I'm only 37 and my hair hasn't lasted anywhere near as long as that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted January 21, 2007 Share Posted January 21, 2007 Warning! I think I may have gone overboard in this linguistic squabble with Frances - but you did ask for it! . The word - Keeill - (not keill) is the general word for a church in Manx, probably from keyll - meaning grove, and is in many Celtic names and palcenames (Kildare, Kilmarnock, Balley Keeill Pherick, Killey etc) and gives us the English word - cell - (via Latin and the English softening of Latin C) - and from the air it did indeed look like a cell. slight problem - according to my Latin dictionary (smith's shorter 3rd ed 1933) cella is the latin - one meaning (as found in Cato) is 'mean apartment esp of slaves' which is the usual derivation of keeill "The word cell comes from the Latin cellula, a small room. The name was chosen by Robert Hooke when he compared the cork cells he saw to the small rooms monks lived in."[Wikipedia] From Online Etymology Dictionary: Cell - c.1131, "small room," from L. cella "small room, hut," related to L. celare "to hide, conceal," from PIE base *kel- "conceal" (cf. Skt. cala "hut, house, hall;" Gk. kalia "hut, nest," kalyptein "to cover," koleon "sheath," kelyphos "shell, husk;" L. cella "store room," clam "secret;" O.Ir. cuile "cellar," celim "hide," M.Ir. cul "defense, shelter;" Goth. hulistr "covering," O.E. heolstor "lurking-hole, cave, covering," Goth. huljan "cover over," hulundi "hole," hilms "helmet," halja "hell," O.E. hol "cave," holu "husk, pod"). Earliest sense is for monastic rooms, then prison rooms (1722). Used in biology 17c., but not in modern sense until 1845. Meaning "small group of people working within a larger organization" is from 1925. Cellphone is from 1984. The oldest suggested root of cell is Proto Indo-European "kel" - conceal. The Manx for 'conceal' is 'keil', a concealed place; cooyl, a grove; keyll, a monastic cell/church; keeill, (of a) keeill; killey (pron. killya, You are suggesting that these words came into Manx via Classical Latin? It seems to me that 'keeill' came into Manx via Old Irish, Common Celtic, proto-Celtic and Proto-IndoEuropean, in other words, as far back as we can go. And when did cella come into Latin? My guess is that this word, like many Latin words connected with building, transport and manufacture, came into Latin from Common Celtic (yes, sorry Monty Python fans) during the period of Roman expansion beyond Itallic speaking areas. If Cato is your first source this seems right as Cato was only born in 234BC - a time when Celtic dialects were spoken from here to Turkey, including Cisalpine Gaul - North Italy. Remember this was only 150 years after the Celts sacked Rome and that he lived through the Second Punic War when Hannibal's army of Celts almost crushed Rome. But, if I am wrong and cella did not come into Latin via Celtic then we must assume that cella and keeill come from a common Indo-European root, and that it must have been around long before Cato used it. There are loan words from Latin in Manx but 'keeill' is not likely to be one of them - it has probably been used by our ancestors since the Bronze Age - although the Christian connotation obviously only dates from early Celtic Church era. Why do I care so much? Well, Time Team talking about the Vikings coming here and teaching the locals how to write Gaelic in Ogham about three hundred years (at the very least) after it had been used at Ballaqueeney, seems as strange to me as if they were saying the Vikings went to Normandy and taught the locals Norman French. It is, however, indicative of the emphasis on imperial legacy in Mannin and the tendency for Gaelic language and culture to be sidelined. To suggest that a Manx word can't be older than a Latin word is just as annoying. When will people accept that culture is not neccessarily a product of imperialism? <http://www.gov.im/mnh/collections/archaeology/earlychristians/oghamstone.xml> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted January 22, 2007 Share Posted January 22, 2007 no the usual derived root is via early Irish Christianity which adopted Roman nomenclature - there are many terms connected with church usage that seem to have such Latin roots - it may well be possible that there was an earlier pan-Celtic usuage but I'm no expert here - maybe worth seeing what the experts have to say (eg possibly George Broderick in his Placenames (too expensive for me to own a set) and Thomson) - it is also possible that as the two words were very similar that the two paths 'merged' - I only have the shorter Latin dict the larger volumes may well have more usages but another usage by Cicero is 'the part of the temple in which the image of the god stood' - this predates christianity and thus is likely to be taken over into christian use. I missed the TV show (not owning a box !) but I'm surprised that they claimed the Vikings intoduced Oghams as their usage is usually Irish celtic from 5th C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted January 22, 2007 Share Posted January 22, 2007 Just to throw a spanner in. From Manx Note Book These recluses known as Culdee's (from Cele De servant of God) from the 8th Century would build his own cell or oratory ('Keeill') and act as spiritual father to the local families. A little research shows that the word 'Cele' means 'Conceal' in French. Cele - also has a Latin, meaning of sky, heaven. In the days when people could not write much you could probably see how 'Cele' (pronounced 'seel') could become Keeill. Is this just coincidence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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