Muslim Separation

[Hugh Jampton]

Yup, There was been a mosque in Douglas since 1993 at the back of Kingswood Grove next to Paul Milne's Garage

[haX0red_Account]

Yup, There was been a mosque in Douglas since 1993 at the back of Kingswood Grove next to Paul Milne's Garage

don't think that is actually a mosque. More of an islamic study or social group building. A bit similar to a christian prayer room or something but not officially consecrated. Think the jewish people here have somehting similar, but no synagogue. Shalom!

[John Wright]

Never let it be forgot that the first mosque in England was built in Liverpool by a manx man in the 19th century

[Topaz]

William Abdullah Quilliam.

[John Wright]

The very same.

 

Shame our good realtionship with islam is at an all time low.

 

The aussies have always been racist, I don't want to do what they do.

 

I am happy for the sikhs to wear their turbans, the muslims their veils, the scots their kilts etc whilst in IOM or anywhere in the west. After all didn't the brits wear their own clothes when out creating and ruling empire. Wouldn't have done to go native.

 

What is imperative with all the moving around, including Brits to Spain, and anyone to the IOM, is that the immigrants are given proper induction on arrival, introduction to local language, history, culture. Integration isn't just something they do, it is something we have to offer.

 

We need to be a bit better at promoting Manx.

 

But education must be secular, not religious. No crosses, stars of david, muslim crescents or veils or sikh headdress. Likewise no exemptions in the every day world, sikhs must wear motor cycle crash helmets etc etc but when something is not compulsory then its a matter of choice.

 

Lets not kid ourselves most of the anti veil stuff is racial/religious intolerance. There is no evidence of terrorists, male or femaile, muslim or non muslim adopting the veil to bomb. They might, but then pigs might fly.

 

If young muslim women as a reaction to some of the less pleasant things in our society wish to adopt the veil as a comment good on them for having the moral fibre.

 

If I were muslim I'd be pissed off with America and the west. If I was second generation Pakistani or Bangladeshi with a degree and amongst the 40% in that category unemployed, whatever my religious outlook, I might start turning somewhere else.

 

The clue is in recent pronouncements, "the war on terror wil last a generation", Tony Blair. Well we fought wars on terror in Malaya, Kenya, Cyprus, Ireland. Didn't win one of them. Eventually had no negotiate and find political solutions.

 

The iron curtain and red menace is gone, the politicos and their secret service masters have to have an enemy to focus upon to keep our freedoms down and to keep their powers up.

 

Shame the best they can do is women in black coveralls.

 

If there is muslim separation we only have ourselves to blame, we did it all the other immigrant groupsd over the years, we still don't learn. Separatism is nothing more than apartheid. It is our attitude that creates ghettoes,not choice of those discriminated against.

 

No more ghettoes, integrate, not separate.

[Ean]

William Abdullah Quilliam wasn't actually Manx though.

[John Wright]

no, 2 generations removed. His grandfathers brother was capt Quilliam of the Victory

[Albert Tatlock]

I am happy for the sikhs to wear their turbans, the muslims their veils, the scots their kilts etc whilst in IOM or anywhere in the west. After all didn't the brits wear their own clothes when out creating and ruling empire. Wouldn't have done to go native.

 

But education must be secular, not religious. No crosses, stars of david, muslim crescents or veils or sikh headdress. Likewise no exemptions in the every day world, sikhs must wear motor cycle crash helmets etc etc but when something is not compulsory then its a matter of choice.

 

No more ghettoes, integrate, not separate.

Fine words...but the two paragraphs are not compatible - that is the current problem.

 

You have a generation, and now probably another, who are even more unwilling to integrate as we have isolated and demonised them even more over the past five years. Moreover, as islamic politics and culture are so intertwined, the reality is that integration on the current path is a fallacy. We are actually on diverging paths in the same country, which will only lead to serious problems such as future riots etc.

 

The UK has gone too far and been too tolerant with minorities in the name of political correctness. The time to say 'no' to veils and 'no' to ghettos past more than 30 years ago. To obtain integration, we will have to force it by ammending educational (as you have inferred) and human rights legislation. We need to go back and ammend so called 'human rights' legislation so that it effectively reads: 'you have every human right - but when in Rome, the Romans have the right to insist you do it on their terms, and not to try to undermine them or destroy their culture'.

 

Human rights can be both liberal and democratic, in the sense that majority wishes should take precedence when they conflict with the wishes of any minority group. Where there is room for manouvre, and a commonsense solution, all the better.

[Lonan3]

Perhaps as well as 'human rights' legislation, there should also be a 'human responsibilities' one?

[Juan Kerr]

Shame our good realtionship with islam is at an all time low.

 

The irony of this is, of course, that this is exactly the position that Bin Laden and the others behind Al Quaida knew they would be in after 911. They guessed that the attacks would send a wounded USA off around the world bombing the crap out of anywhere that possibly housed Muslim terrorists (creating new oppressed and injured), and they knew through the London and Madrid bombings that Western countries that had been tolerant to Muslim immigrants would start to get vocal against the rights of Muslims in their communities.

 

They are all about creating chaos and martyrs, and are happy to use and abuse their own people to achieve this.

 

Its laughable how stupidly the West have played directly into their hands through the farsical occupation of Iraq, and more importantly how decent honest Muslims have been betrayed by their own who through extremism and bombing campaigns have successfully ostracised the more Western Muslims from the communities they've lived in for years.

 

This is the real problem. Its the Muslim extremists who are reaping pain and hardship on their fellow Muslims who just want to live in peace. Now there is no such thing as a good Muslim or a bad Muslim - the terrorists have seen to that. The West is now sick of everyone because of a well orchastrated terrorist campaign specifically designed to create religious friction.

[manxchatterbox]

just received this as an SMS from a friend as a joke:-

 

A muslim woman knocked on my door last night,

I never opened the door

I just talked through the letterbox -

just so she could see what its like talking to a woman in a veil.

 

(edited this to make it clean)

[The Old Git]

(edited this to make it clean)

 

No need, and posted it here a few days ago

[manxchatterbox]

I just don't get that much post or many Muslim women knocking at the door and also need to invest in a new set of bottle ends 'cos didn't see earlier posting...

[Tuna Sandwich]

There was an interesting letter in Tuesday's daily express. I cannot remember the verbatim content bu it was along the lines of:

 

"It has come to light that during Ramadam, police in muslim areas were banned from arresting muslim people for fear of being labeled 'racist' or 'anti-muslim'. Does this mean that at Christmas and Easter Christians can now run amock without fear of arrest and prosecution?"

 

Assuming it is true, this is typical of the current problem with the UK.

[elle1980]

I just caught an interesting documentary on channel 4 entitled "women only jihad" women only jihad

 

very interesting. certainly supports the notion of a 'backward society' hell bent on oppressing females.

 

I agree with Albert, whilst I agree with thieawin, what you are saying is mired in idealism, the same way the clerics of islam are mired in their religion ...I applaud Australia's assertiveness on the matter-let it never spiral to the ghetto extents of Londonf and Birmingham and all the rest-in Australia there is mulitculturalism the Brits could only dream of (the Queensland jokes are old-hat in my opinion, pretty much ignorant remnants of the pauline hanson debacle).

 

The fact is the values espoused do not currently gel in some crucial capacities and this is causing friction-their apparent desire to do what they please leads to the same cultural isolation they hypocritically lament- that the Government would put their foot down (in the case of Australia) is admirable, in the face of OTT liberal espousations of "Freedom of expression" and all this tosh (politically correctness that has certainly gone over and above what is necessary). I believe in an integrated society, yes. But a line must be drawn somewhere.

 

Another query, how are we to have secular schools/integrated schools when many Muslim men not only dont want their daughters in school beyond the age of 13 (after which they MUST be separated by boys if they are to continue on), they dont want their daughters in school at *all*? Perhaps I'm not discussing so much the moderate Muslims here, but there are a great many new immigrants who believe in these traditional values...now do you see their need not only for their OWN schools, but separate boys and girls-and to be paid for by the average tax payer! wow!