the stinking enigma Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 (edited) the hypocritical poodle receives a boot up the arse https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jul/19/british-tanker-iran-capture-fears-stena-impero-uk-ship-latest there'll be serious repercussions once the yanks tell hunt what to say next Edited July 20, 2019 by the stinking enigma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted July 23, 2019 Share Posted July 23, 2019 Rock and a hard place. They can protect our shipping by not only patrolling the straits but put armed contingents on the ships. They do that and the Pasdaran will deliberately try and board to turn it into a shooting war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 So, the ship that was seized off of Gibraltar (Grace 1), the incident that started this whole shit show... You know, the one we took illegally under some bullshit about Syrian embargos, but was in actual fact on the request of the Americans... I know the Iranians are being tit-for-tat, but "we" started it. When will the UK learn not to do stupid shit in the Middle East as a proxy for the Americans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 I don't know the legality of seizing the Grace 1, however, I do agree that the UK and the USA need to learn not to do stupid shit in the Middle East. The whole fucking area is a mess after years of western interference and intervention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 1 minute ago, manxman1980 said: I don't know the legality of seizing the Grace 1, however, I do agree that the UK and the USA need to learn not to do stupid shit in the Middle East. The whole fucking area is a mess after years of western interference and intervention. As far as I can tell, the Grace 1 was seized under EU embargo rules, however, neither Iran or Syria are members of the EU, so not quite sure where the EU rules apply or why the Royal Navy got involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 32 minutes ago, RIchard Britten said: As far as I can tell, the Grace 1 was seized under EU embargo rules, however, neither Iran or Syria are members of the EU, so not quite sure where the EU rules apply or why the Royal Navy got involved. Why do you think Iran or Syria would have to be in the EU for the EU to have sanctions against them? It’d be bizarre. The EU has a common ( United ) foreign policy and sanctions regime about Syria, which specifically includes oil. Prior to the agreement about nuclear matters with Iran there were also sanctions against Iranian oil exports. The US has unilaterally reneged on that agreement, but the EU has not. So, under EU law the Grace was seized as the cargo was oil, no matter where from, going to Syria in breach of sanctions. Indeed, U.K. and Gibraltar authorities have repeatedly made it clear that the ship and cargo can be released as soon as Iran confirms the oil won’t go to Syria. Sanctions were renewed as recently as 17 May. The boat was in Gibraltar, and thus EU, waters. Yes the straits have to provide free international passage, just like Hormuz, but not if they are in breach of sanctions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 32 minutes ago, RIchard Britten said: As far as I can tell, the Grace 1 was seized under EU embargo rules, however, neither Iran or Syria are members of the EU, so not quite sure where the EU rules apply or why the Royal Navy got involved. A bit lacking in knowledge of how an international embargo works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 47 minutes ago, John Wright said: Why do you think Iran or Syria would have to be in the EU for the EU to have sanctions against them? It’d be bizarre. The EU has a common ( United ) foreign policy and sanctions regime about Syria, which specifically includes oil. Prior to the agreement about nuclear matters with Iran there were also sanctions against Iranian oil exports. The US has unilaterally reneged on that agreement, but the EU has not. So, under EU law the Grace was seized as the cargo was oil, no matter where from, going to Syria in breach of sanctions. Indeed, U.K. and Gibraltar authorities have repeatedly made it clear that the ship and cargo can be released as soon as Iran confirms the oil won’t go to Syria. Sanctions were renewed as recently as 17 May. The boat was in Gibraltar, and thus EU, waters. Yes the straits have to provide free international passage, just like Hormuz, but not if they are in breach of sanctions. Except it wasn't going to Syria... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 Apparently not as clean cut as we led to believe: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/gibraltar-changed-its-sanctions-laws-to-impound-iranian-ship-lc5vm59bh "Gibraltar updated its sanctions enforcement regulations 36 hours before Royal Marines impounded an Iranian tanker when it stopped for supplies in the territory, lawyers have said. The seizure of the Grace 1 earlier this month, which prompted Iran to threaten reciprocal actions, is at the heart of the crisis unfolding the Gulf. The legal changes, reported by the blog EU Sanctions, suggest both that the operation was meticulously planned and that the authorities feared it would need a clearer legal basis." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 9 minutes ago, RIchard Britten said: Apparently not as clean cut as we led to believe: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/gibraltar-changed-its-sanctions-laws-to-impound-iranian-ship-lc5vm59bh "Gibraltar updated its sanctions enforcement regulations 36 hours before Royal Marines impounded an Iranian tanker when it stopped for supplies in the territory, lawyers have said. The seizure of the Grace 1 earlier this month, which prompted Iran to threaten reciprocal actions, is at the heart of the crisis unfolding the Gulf. The legal changes, reported by the blog EU Sanctions, suggest both that the operation was meticulously planned and that the authorities feared it would need a clearer legal basis." Somewhere between 17 May and 20 July they had to update, as the old ones were due to expire. IoM ones also got updated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 28 minutes ago, RIchard Britten said: Except it wasn't going to Syria... So, easy peasy, the onboard paperwork would show this and Iran would be able to get it released. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 There are ways of spinning the mundane to indicate the suspicious. It's a well used craft. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 1 minute ago, woolley said: There are ways of spinning the mundane to indicate the suspicious. It's a well used craft. Oh well nothing to see here. Lets ignore the engineered conflict with yet another Middle Eastern state which wants to ditch the Petro-Dollar... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the stinking enigma Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 It was seized in the hope Iran would go tit for tat. A precursor to more warships to the region 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the stinking enigma Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 Anyone that thinks America is stumbling into war by accident or incompetence is severely deluded. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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