Smoking Ban - The Isle Of Man

[puddy]

So did it all kick off at the forum get-together when somebody lit up a fag?

[Albert Tatlock]

Whatever people might say, the fact is that people's civil liberties have been eroded, with no simple compromise from the government, business, or the anti-smoking fundamentalists. We all have the right to where and with whom we associate with. That free choice has been taken away from a third of the population.

 

Smokers, or rather the power of nicotine, have brought this on themselves by their self-centred needs, particularly over the past 20-30 years.

 

Many of us remember a room in the public house designated as the 'Smoking Room'. The smoker soon realise that his addiction needs were far greater than polite rules in pubs and decided that everywhere was a smoking room. and if you don't like smoke then tough. For those of us who don't go back that far, the simple and well publicised rule of 'no smoking at the bar' very soon got the two fingers from the generic smoker.

 

Which was a pity really, because I am sure that if the rule had been adhered to (although I see that when it comes to smokers and their addiction, there simply are no rules) then the Isle of Man, would probably have made its own laws perhaps more liberal laws.

 

If only the smoker had shown a bit of consideration to others (an impossibility it seems) then we would doubtless not have to bring in these laws.

Smokers don't generally go around demolishing walls and smoking rooms in pubs.

[Stu Peters]

I have a couple of Irish pals who LOVE coming to the Isle of Man - they marvel at our ability to sit in a pub and smoke, or go out for a curry and enjoy a Bensons with the coffee.

 

I'm with Albert on this one - by the Government's own figures at least a quarter of us are smokers, and we're being bullied and marginalised in a way that any other minority would be up in arms about. And it WILL eventually lead to a ban at home - already many landlords forbid smokers, as they know they have the zealots behind them.

 

Interesting about tobacco tax income vs. NHS cost of smoking. A year or so ago one of our public health consultants got the hump with me because I suggested that the reason tobacco sales weren't outlawed outright was the income from fag taxes. He blatantly insisted that income pretty much equalled expenditure. No wonder I don't trust 'official statistics' much...

[%age]

Stu, what your Irish pals were experiencing is the submissiveness of the Manx.

 

You talk about bullies, but in this game, the only bullies are the ones that selfishly insist on smoking wherever they like.

 

The ....."and what are you going to do about it" attitude seems to come free with every pack of fags.

[Albert Tatlock]

Stu, what your Irish pals were experiencing is the submissiveness of the Manx.

 

You talk about bullies, but in this game, the only bullies are the ones that selfishly insist on smoking wherever they like.

 

The ....."and what are you going to do about it" attitude seems to come free with every pack of fags.

Hollyhocks! That's like saying all non-smokers are fervent anti-smoking fanatics - and they are not either.

[Slim]

I'm with Albert on this one - by the Government's own figures at least a quarter of us are smokers, and we're being bullied and marginalised in a way that any other minority would be up in arms about. And it WILL eventually lead to a ban at home - already many landlords forbid smokers, as they know they have the zealots behind them.

 

Bullied and marginalised my arse. If smokers were only harming themselves nobody would give a fuck, but you can't go around killing other people and accept that as normal.

[Mr. Sausages]

If I was a wasp I would fly around stinging smokers all day long. And if I was a bee I'd sting a smoker right in the eye when s/he was asleep. I'd die of course, but it would "bee" worth it.

[Lost Login]

Similar thing happens as Chinatown which is a non smoking restaurant at the tables. All the smokers go to the waiting area and the smoke blows straights into the smaller dining area.

 

The question is who should have priority, the smokers to enjoy a smoke or the non smokers to enjoy a meal without smoke. Both are mutually exclusive. Previously it was tipped in favour of the smokers now it is tipping or has tipped in the favour of the non smokers

 

Ever think about the people on the table next to you, still trying to eat their main course, who might not appreciate being choked by your fag smoke?

 

I remember going for a (probably....) delicious meal in La Piazza with my wife when she was about seven months pregnant. We'd barely started our main course when a group of women were sat at the table next to us, all of them smoking like chimneys and completely fucking up our meal, not to mention my wife didn't want to be passive smoking whilst pregnant. (Not that she does at any other time either.)

 

Of course, this table of incredibly rude heffers all stubbed out their fags as soon as their starters arrived, and then all lit up again between their starter and main course, just as our desserts were arriving.

 

We haven't been back since.

 

%age is spot on that a smoker seems to be immediately empowered with a "and so fucking what?" attitude every time they light up.

[lectro]

There is quite a lot of places that now have a ban. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smoking_bans_by_country

 

Some countries have opted for the smoking room idea but obviously it's expensive to implement. In Italy which has the option of smoking rooms - Only 1% of all public establishments have opted for a smoking room.

 

Why anyone would want to continue to smoke (never mind not care if others breathe second hand smoke) is really beyond me. I've never understood why intelligent informed people continue to smoke.

If any food that you got from Tesco contained even a fraction of the following people would be up in arms and the stock recalled for health reasons.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemicals_in_a_cigarette

 

Some fine ingredients there...

 

Acrylonitrile is highly flammable and toxic.

 

Arsenic and many of its compounds are especially potent poisons.

 

Benzene exposure has serious health effects. Breathing high levels of benzene can result in death, while low levels can cause drowsiness, dizziness, rapid heart rate, headaches, tremors, confusion, and unconsciousness. Eating or drinking foods containing high levels of benzene can cause vomiting, irritation of the stomach, dizziness, sleepiness, convulsions, rapid heart rate, and death.

 

Beryllium and its salts are toxic substances and potentially carcinogenic. Chronic berylliosis is a pulmonary and systemic granulomatous disease caused by exposure to beryllium.

 

The major effect of benzene from chronic (long-term) exposure is to the blood. Benzene damages the bone marrow and can cause a decrease in red blood cells, leading to anemia. It can also cause excessive bleeding and depress the immune system, increasing the chance of infection.

 

Cadmium and several cadmium-containing compounds are known carcinogens and can induce many types of cancer

 

Ethylene oxide is toxic by inhalation. Symptoms of overexposure include headache and dizziness, progressing with increasing exposure to convulsions, seizure and coma. It is also an irritant to skin and the respiratory tract, and inhaling the vapors may cause the lungs to fill with fluid several hours after exposure.

 

Formaldehyde is classified as a probable human carcinogen by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, and as having sufficient evidence that formaldehyde causes nasopharyngeal cancer in humans by the International Agency for Research on Cancer.

High amounts of formaldehyde can be toxic. Because formaldehyde resins are used in many construction materials, including plywood and spray-on insulating foams, and because these resins slowly give off formaldehyde over time, formaldehyde is one of the more common indoor air pollutants. At concentrations above 0.1 ppm in air, formaldehyde can irritate the eyes and mucous membranes, resulting in watery eyes. If inhaled, formaldehyde at this concentration may cause headaches, a burning sensation in the throat, and difficulty breathing, as well as triggering or aggravating asthma symptoms.[3] The United States Environmental Protection Agency USEPA allows no more than 0.016 ppm formaldehyde in the air in new buildings constructed for that agency[4]

 

Large formaldehyde exposures, for example from drinking formaldehyde solutions, are potentially deadly. Formaldehyde is converted to formic acid in the body, leading to a rise in blood acidity (acidosis), rapid, shallow breathing, blurred vision or complete blindness, hypothermia, and, in the most severe cases, coma or death. People who have ingested formaldehyde require immediate medical attention.

 

In the body, formaldehyde can cause proteins to irreversibly bind to DNA. Laboratory animals exposed to large doses of inhaled formaldehyde over their lifetimes have developed more cancers of the nose and throat than are usual, as have workers in particle-board sawmills. However, some studies suggest that smaller concentrations of formaldehyde like those encountered in most buildings have no carcinogenic effects[citation needed].

 

 

Hydrazine is highly toxic and dangerously unstable, especially in the anhydrous form. Symptoms of acute (short-term) exposure to high levels of hydrazine may include irritation of the eyes, nose, and throat, dizziness, headache, nausea, pulmonary edema, seizures, and coma in humans. Acute exposure can also damage the liver, kidneys, and central nervous system in humans. The liquid is corrosive and may produce dermatitis from skin contact in humans and animals. Effects to the lungs, liver, spleen, and thyroid have been reported in animals chronically (long-term) exposed to hydrazine via inhalation. Increased incidences of lung, nasal cavity, and liver tumors have been observed in rodents exposed to hydrazine.

 

Lead is a poisonous metal that can damage nervous connections (especially in young children) and cause blood and brain disorders. Long term exposure to lead or its salts (especially soluble salts or the strong oxidant PbO2) can cause nephropathy, and colic-like abdominal pains. The concern about lead's role in mental retardation in children has brought about widespread reduction in its use (lead exposure has been linked to schizophrenia).

 

And my favourite...

 

Vinyl chloride depresses the central nervous system, and inhaling its vapors produces symptoms similar to alcohol intoxication. These include headache, dizziness, and loss of coordination, and in severe cases may progress to hallucination, unconsciousness, and death by respiratory failure.

 

In laboratory animals, exposure to vinyl chloride during pregnancy has produced miscarriages and birth defects. Its effect on human reproduction is unknown.

 

Long-term exposure to vinyl chloride can cause chronic skin irritations and has also been linked to a painful inflammation of the extremities called Raynaud's syndrome. Vinyl chloride is considered to be a carcinogen and has in particular been linked to certain cancers of the liver— particularly, angiosarcoma and hepatocellular carcinoma.

[Albert Tatlock]

I'm with Albert on this one - by the Government's own figures at least a quarter of us are smokers, and we're being bullied and marginalised in a way that any other minority would be up in arms about. And it WILL eventually lead to a ban at home - already many landlords forbid smokers, as they know they have the zealots behind them.

 

Bullied and marginalised my arse. If smokers were only harming themselves nobody would give a fuck, but you can't go around killing other people and accept that as normal.

Well in that case - with a 1 in 85 lifetime chance of being in a car accident (1 in 400 of running into a pedestrian) then perhaps you'd better hand in your driving licence and scrap your car.

 

Or is that risk you pose to me somehow different?

[Slim]

It's just a fucking disgusting and anti-social habit. I'm not sure what kind of selfish idiot you have to be to be in that quarter of the population who wants to make the rest of us miserable and ill when we go out for a drink just because you're too lazy and to be considerate and smoke outside.

[Slim]

Well in that case - with a 1 in 85 lifetime chance of being in a car accident (1 in 400 of running into a pedestrian) then perhaps you'd better hand in your driving licence and scrap your car.

 

Or is that risk you pose to me somehow different?

 

Yes, driving is a necessary risk, not some optional recreational disgusting habbit.

[Mr. Sausages]

If I saw a giraffe smoking I'd get a rope, hop on my BMX, and take it down with the Hoth manoeuvre. Then I'd kick the floored beast in the neck until it apologised.

[Miss Take]

I'm with Albert on this one - by the Government's own figures at least a quarter of us are smokers, and we're being bullied and marginalised in a way that any other minority would be up in arms about. And it WILL eventually lead to a ban at home - already many landlords forbid smokers, as they know they have the zealots behind them.

 

Bullied and marginalised my arse. If smokers were only harming themselves nobody would give a fuck, but you can't go around killing other people and accept that as normal.

Well in that case - with a 1 in 85 lifetime chance of being in a car accident (1 in 400 of running into a pedestrian) then perhaps you'd better hand in your driving licence and scrap your car.

 

Or is that risk you pose to me somehow different?

 

If you were driving on the pavement or driving dangerously, then your comparison here would have some meaning and yes, I'd take measures to stop you from doing it again and buggering up the lives of other road users.

[Miss Take]

If I saw a giraffe smoking I'd get a rope, hop on my BMX, and take it down with the Hoth manoeuvre. Then I'd kick the floored beast in the neck until it apologised.

 

How would it light the fag - it's hooves don't reach its mouth? Plus, no opposable thumbs.