[BBC News] Calls for review of airport plans

[Newsbot]

An Onchan MHK calls for a reappraisal of the scheme for a runway extension at Ronaldsway Airport.

 

Source : http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/rss/-/1/hi/world/...man/6581137.stm

[%age]

 

This is a mighty expensive project. I understand that the engineering Consultant is the same as carried out or rather is still carrying out, the IRIS project.

 

It is a pity that it is Peter Karran who is raising these points because so many establishment politicians feel they can simply ignore him. They forget that he has been made an MHK and is effectively speaking for, a lot more people than any of them. 2600 at the last election. In the case of MLCs the number of people that have placed them in politics is usually about 13 - the number of pals in the House of Keys that eventually voted for them.

 

I often wonder do we need to bring 737s and the like onto the Island? I suppose so. Maybe we could become a service centre for big aircraft? Amusing threadt on the subject

 

 

I wonder if a similar extension to the land could be carried out on the West coast to prevent the sea from eventually claiming all those new houses that have been built off Shore Road in Kirk Michael.

[mojomonkey]

I think the problem with Peter Karran is that he crys wolf too often. He comes across as being anti everything that government does. I'm all for people trying to solve things but simply shouting about them doesn't strike me as the proper answer.

 

I don't know much about this runway extension, especially why its needed, but I do know that the planning application is currently the subject of an appeal against its approval. Apparently Mr Karran didn't raise any comment during the initial consideration of the planning application, so why is he suddenly so interested?

 

As for the level of votes I would suggest that its down to a combination of the population of Onchan and human nature being such that negativity attracting interest.

[%age]

Could you give some examples of what he has cried wolf over? (It seems to me that much of what he says has a strong basis although his style of presentation may be lacking somewhat).

 

With the fiascos of the New Hospital (still unresolved and probably forever will be) and the MEA (ditto) and a number of other issues, I am thanking that there is someone willing to put in place a check on how the Government squander our money. There are too many of our politicians on the gravy train and willing to become nodding dogs.

[mojomonkey]

I'm not having a specific go at Peter Karran, personally I wouldn't trust any politician. The problem is a lack of a party system and therefore you never know what MHK's intentions are.

[sarahc]

Peter Karran's party is bankrolled by a couple of people based in Liverpool. Wonder if they have an interest in the runway not being extended?

[John Wright]

Oh who? Please name names

[sarahc]

I would, but I don't know their names. I just wondered if that explained why he hadn't mentioned it much before.

[Utah 01]

Leaving aside the political merits or otherwise of Mr Karran, the document that appeared as a supplement in the Courier a few weeks ago that voiced the arguments for the extension project was nothing short disgraceful. It was a diatribe of spurious and groundless arguments to justify the spending of (another) £23M of the taxpayers money. The extensions to the runway end safety areas are 'desirable', nothing more than that, and the argument that operators would not use Ronaldsway without them is utter rubbish. Unfortunately, there are those in government who still fantasise about shiny 737s and 757s jetting in from all over Europe. The simple truth, that may be unpalatable to some and ignored by others, is that the Island has a finite 'flying' demand that is best met by a small number of niche airlines flying to viable destinations using economical aircraft - and for the foreseeable future those are turboprop aircraft that will continue to happily operate from the runways currently established at Ronaldsway.

[Albert Tatlock]

Leaving aside the political merits or otherwise of Mr Karran, the document that appeared as a supplement in the Courier a few weeks ago that voiced the arguments for the extension project was nothing short disgraceful. It was a diatribe of spurious and groundless arguments to justify the spending of (another) £23M of the taxpayers money. The extensions to the runway end safety areas are 'desirable', nothing more than that, and the argument that operators would not use Ronaldsway without them is utter rubbish. Unfortunately, there are those in government who still fantasise about shiny 737s and 757s jetting in from all over Europe. The simple truth, that may be unpalatable to some and ignored by others, is that the Island has a finite 'flying' demand that is best met by a small number of niche airlines flying to viable destinations using economical aircraft - and for the foreseeable future those are turboprop aircraft that will continue to happily operate from the runways currently established at Ronaldsway.

£23 million quid across 40,000 working tax payers is £575 each.

 

Such an extension could allow for the cheaper airlines like Ryanair to land their jets. But what happens if companies such as that come here, put the smaller airlines out of business, and then don't get the volume and close or restrict the route? I agree that we have a finite flying demand, and that people should think very carefully about the longterm consequences of such a decision. Other than TT week I can't ever see such flights flying full. Smaller regular (daily) flights are surely better than larger irregular (say, Mon, Wed, Fri) flights.

 

Why is it that money seems to burn a hole in some MHK's pockets? If they do want to spend it, spend it on the roads that we all use and which are currently a disgrace. Personally I think the £23m is best left in the reserves, because there will soon come a time when we will need it, especially with the lowly effort that is being put in by the government to expand the islands economy at present.

[Moghrey Mie]

Leaving aside the political merits or otherwise of Mr Karran, the document that appeared as a supplement in the Courier a few weeks ago that voiced the arguments for the extension project was nothing short disgraceful. It was a diatribe of spurious and groundless arguments to justify the spending of (another) £23M of the taxpayers money. The extensions to the runway end safety areas are 'desirable', nothing more than that, and the argument that operators would not use Ronaldsway without them is utter rubbish. Unfortunately, there are those in government who still fantasise about shiny 737s and 757s jetting in from all over Europe. The simple truth, that may be unpalatable to some and ignored by others, is that the Island has a finite 'flying' demand that is best met by a small number of niche airlines flying to viable destinations using economical aircraft - and for the foreseeable future those are turboprop aircraft that will continue to happily operate from the runways currently established at Ronaldsway.

£23 million quid across 40,000 working tax payers is £575 each.

 

Such an extension could allow for the cheaper airlines like Ryanair to land their jets. But what happens if companies such as that come here, put the smaller airlines out of business, and then don't get the volume and close or restrict the route? I agree that we have a finite flying demand, and that people should think very carefully about the longterm consequences of such a decision. Other than TT week I can't ever see such flights flying full. Smaller regular (daily) flights are surely better than larger irregular (say, Mon, Wed, Fri) flights.

 

Why is it that money seems to burn a hole in some MHK's pockets? If they do want to spend it, spend it on the roads that we all use and which are currently a disgrace. Personally I think the £23m is best left in the reserves, because there will soon come a time when we will need it, especially with the lowly effort that is being put in by the government to expand the islands economy at present.

 

 

Have RyanAir or Easyjet expressed any interest in coming to the IOM?

If visitors came here there would not be enough hotel accommodation for them.

[asitis]

I'll bet this'll cost a lot more than 23m. Research for a business project suggests that for one low cost carrier to operate one route requires 80,000 passengers per year on that route. I agree with 'Albert' the islands interests are best served by niche operators using smaller aircraft whose occupancy figures can support the route they operate. Lets face it the island will never be any sort of European hub for travel or freight or are we spending a huge amount of taxpayers money to provide longer runways for the larger corporate jets due to be Manx registered ?

 

I applaud Peter Karran, undoubtedly he fires the bullets for others but he is not afraid to do so. I think the islands health service, social services and transport infrastructure could all do with a cash injection rather than servicing a market which may not exist. There are many ways to tailor the aircraft serving the island to the runway length and as you say it is not mandatory contrary to the impression being given in many quarters.

 

The island should seek to recover from the profligate waste of resources of the past few years and make sure that the best use of taxpayers money happens for the benefit of all.

[Albert Tatlock]

I agree with 'Albert' the islands interests are best served by niche operators using smaller aircraft whose occupancy figures can support the route they operate.

To be fair that was Utah's point.

[Albert Tatlock]

If the runway extension could be used to support an aircraft maintenance facility here, then there is an additional argument for that. As an advocate for bringing in high tech jobs onto the island I would be supportive of that, provided that:

 

1. there would have to be enough tax made back to pay for the extension, so effectively it would be financed by an expansion of the economy.

 

2. even with such a facility, very careful consideration still needs to be given as to who gets the routes to the island - with niche operators on the bread and butter routes given certain guarantees that will protect them, and protect the people of the island by maintaining the same amount of journeys/routes for the population. Otherwise we could end up with a fantastic facility with only half of the services we currently have.

 

3. If people are expected to come from the European continent to the island, (or even further afield) the government need to expand the economy to give them reasons for coming here. Just brainstorming here..what expansion of the finance sector would encourage this? Planes don't have to be full of passengers, they can include cargo planes full of parts, so perhaps consideration could also be given to how the freeport area could be expanded (in terms of high tech manufacturing facilities) to prepare and then export high value finished equipments. Surely there would be companies interested that could be attracted to the island for this purpose, particularly if the island was presented with an export opportunity that avoided landing in the European Union

[Max Power]

I think we can be pretty confident that neither Easyjet nor Ryanair would consider the I.o.M. route using 737's.

 

Their businesses are profitable due to quick turnaround of aircraft which are full to nearly full on every flight. They could never fill a 737 (the standard aircraft used along with the airbus to reduce maintenance and parts costs) for both legs of a journey to even London I would have thought, and if they could we would be limited to one flight per day!