[BBC News] Plans to view parliament online

[Lost Login]

PAG have a meeting on Monday 22nd October at the Claremont covering webcasting with a webcast presentation by Keith Young, Chief Executive of 'public-i' followed by a Q&A session.

 

Now a may be going out on a limb here but I would wager a fair amout that the guy who is the chief executive of one of the companies operating system is going to give the sell.

 

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Now why don't sceptics take time out from the keyboard and listen to what she has to say before making your mind up? Don't want to sound too much like a MHK do you.

 

See you there.

 

I read the PAG documents and web site before commenting. Apparently though you believe that I should also listen to what she (sic) has to say before making my mind up. Presumably you have a similar issue therefore with PAG as their letter to the government was obvioulsy written prior to listening to what she has to say. I presume you will now be requsting the letters withdrawl until after that meeting?

[Cronky]

I would wager a fair amout that the guy who is the chief executive of one of the companies operating system is going to give the sell

 

Precisely. The issue is the slow promulgation of Hansard. A sales executive from a technology company is hardly likely to advocate the better distribution of paper records. He'll be there to make money out of the Isle of Man and ultimately the taxpayer.

[Guest ravabelli]

Of course public-i have an interest! They aren't exactly hiding it, and there is a Q&A session for any info or criticisms of what they say or simply the principle of doing it. That's what a public meeting is all about. Would you completely ignore cooking advice on food because the manufacturer had an interest?

 

Job-wise I take opinions from suppliers virtually very day, but think i'm bright enough to separate the sell from the facts.

 

Paper records have limits to their usefulness, as you'd know if you had tried to decipher the SP User Agreement recently - 300 pages and addendums only accessible if you don't have a fulltime job and can call in when it suits tynwald staff. Hardly much use really.

 

A proper indexed system would allow you to find who said what when, and spot the blather and inconsistencies that are perpetuated in Tynwald by some MHKs.

 

My only concerns are quality of indexing and the cost to us. If it fails on these let's see about just audio recording and indexing. If this too is not viable fine, but lets have a public meeting where anyone with a voice can get up and speak.

 

 

 

I would wager a fair amout that the guy who is the chief executive of one of the companies operating system is going to give the sell

 

Precisely. The issue is the slow promulgation of Hansard. A sales executive from a technology company is hardly likely to advocate the better distribution of paper records. He'll be there to make money out of the Isle of Man and ultimately the taxpayer.

[Lonan3]

If the proceedings were broadcast immediately it may make the participants more likely to tell the truth and think about what they are saying.

 

[Lost Login]

Of course public-i have an interest! They aren't exactly hiding it, and there is a Q&A session for any info or criticisms of what they say or simply the principle of doing it. That's what a public meeting is all about. Would you completely ignore cooking advice on food because the manufacturer had an interest?

 

No but if I was aware that advice was going to come out by way of presentation I would not stop cooking until I had been to that presentation. Especially if I could read about it elsewhere. That in effect is what you requsted in your earlier post as your suggestion was that until and unless we went to the presentation we would be ill informed. De facto your suggestion was only thoise that went to the meeting would be suitable informed to make comment

 

Paper records have limits to their usefulness, as you'd know if you had tried to decipher the SP User Agreement recently - 300 pages and addendums only accessible if you don't have a fulltime job and can call in when it suits tynwald staff. Hardly much use really.

 

They are also more useful in some ways as you can skim read 300 pages quickly and be sure you have not missed something relevent. Audio or visual is only as good as the indexing unless you are going to listen to or watch the whole debate which would be very much slower than reading it. In general as in many of these systems it will be as good as the indexing.That will require a bright knowledable individual to do. It is not a juniors job. It will also take time so we may still be on the X days or weeks before they are available.

 

Finally I will not be attending the public meeting as I do not thing that it is a matter of earth shattering importance to me or the majority. I have never had reason to refer to Hamsard and whilst have listened to the odd debate when of interest, I have never had the urge or wish to revisit. That is unlikely to change if it becomes web based.

 

I would guess that view would match many on the Island and many will have absolutely no interest in the subject at all. Ultimately to me this seems to me to be a system that really will only be of interest to political anoraks and lobbyists.

[Lonan3]

If there is a debate that is of particular relevance/importance to me, then I will listen to it. If that isn't possible, then I will check Hansard.

The idea of our collection of over-inflated egos posing and posturing for the cameras (some of them will probably have more experience applying the correct make-up than others) is one that fills me with considerable apprehension. Rather than encouraging intelligent debate, it will become a matter of point-scoring opportunism - just as it has in the UK's House of Commons.

[Moghrey Mie]

In a nutshell, it's a gimmick. The vast majority of people are not even going to bother once never mind on a regular basis. A small minority of political anoraks will delight in replaying the pieces that annoy them and use this to blow certain debates out of proportion. Some politicians will be aware of this and play to the internet gallery.

 

Good point, however, about the three week delay in publishing Hansard. That is the real issue to address. How about making it availble in public libraries the next day ot even publishing it in the paper?

 

 

Be reasonable it has to be transcribed from the spoken to written form.Even the proverbial room full of monkeys couldn't do that overnight.

And unless you want a newspaper the size of the phone book you can't really expect it all to be published in the paper.

[Guest ravabelli]

Hey I don''t suggest you aren't informed if you don't go, just that it is an opportunity to hear another opinion and perhaps pick up more. I'll continue to learn until the day I die by keeping my ears open. Some I'll take note of some I'll discard but don't know which until I have heard it.

 

Agree completely on your points on indexing. However that is missing the point I made. As a full-time worker I do not have the time during business hours to 'skim' through it like some 'political anoraks' can. Any view of it on the web or by email would have been better than the paper record, indexed good, bad or not at all.

 

Answering point made elsewhere, I can't believe cameras will make the MHK's any worse. Have you read Hansard recently? Could almost be any boy's club. The standard of debate is piss poor now. I pay their salary, i want to see what they do for that money.

 

 

 

Of course public-i have an interest! They aren't exactly hiding it, and there is a Q&A session for any info or criticisms of what they say or simply the principle of doing it. That's what a public meeting is all about. Would you completely ignore cooking advice on food because the manufacturer had an interest?

 

No but if I was aware that advice was going to come out by way of presentation I would not stop cooking until I had been to that presentation. Especially if I could read about it elsewhere. That in effect is what you requsted in your earlier post as your suggestion was that until and unless we went to the presentation we would be ill informed. De facto your suggestion was only thoise that went to the meeting would be suitable informed to make comment

 

Paper records have limits to their usefulness, as you'd know if you had tried to decipher the SP User Agreement recently - 300 pages and addendums only accessible if you don't have a fulltime job and can call in when it suits tynwald staff. Hardly much use really.

 

They are also more useful in some ways as you can skim read 300 pages quickly and be sure you have not missed something relevent. Audio or visual is only as good as the indexing unless you are going to listen to or watch the whole debate which would be very much slower than reading it. In general as in many of these systems it will be as good as the indexing.That will require a bright knowledable individual to do. It is not a juniors job. It will also take time so we may still be on the X days or weeks before they are available.

 

Finally I will not be attending the public meeting as I do not thing that it is a matter of earth shattering importance to me or the majority. I have never had reason to refer to Hamsard and whilst have listened to the odd debate when of interest, I have never had the urge or wish to revisit. That is unlikely to change if it becomes web based.

 

I would guess that view would match many on the Island and many will have absolutely no interest in the subject at all. Ultimately to me this seems to me to be a system that really will only be of interest to political anoraks and lobbyists.