Mlc Rebukes Senior Civil Servant

[Frances]

the idea behind parking schemes is not to give rights to any party but to arbitrate between competing demands - where I live in S E England the balance has moved more in the favour of residents as the council built several large carparks as well as free out-of-town park-and-ride schemes to cater for visitors. Though one can live without a car (I did for many years) current provision of public transport is not always suitable nor possible for many families - if the council wants to keep town centres attractive for a mixed range of incomes then residents parking schemes would appear to be essential. Any illogicallity is generally in their mode of operation (again rather like work permits)

 

edited to add - I quoted 'unfair' - you are agueing from the false premis of 'rights' (from falsehood any conclusion is possible) - it is like many other regulations a balance between demands

[Mr. Sausages]

No it wouldn't. What part of "public road" do you not understand?

 

I'm afraid it's a sad reflection on today's society that people find it acceptable to benefit to the detrement of others

 

I understand every part of "public road". Your whole argument up until now has been about the "unfair advantage" that people living in disc zones have - now it's about not being able to park on public roads. So which part of "I have no problems with disc zones" didn't you mean?

 

The "unfair advantage" is being able to park in one street, that I happen to live in. It makes it a bit easier to get the shopping in, but living in a disc zone is a real pain in the arse because friends and family can't visit during the day. IT'S NOT FAIR!

 

Your previous argument of "If people want guaranteed parking they should purchase a house with garage/drive." is absolute bollocks. For starters, a parking permit does not guarantee parking, but most importantly, my house has been here since before the street was a disc zone. Before so many people commuted to Douglas that they started to park in residential areas. And before there were even cars on the road. They put the disc zones in partly to protect the lifestyles of those who already lived here.

 

How would you react if your street was turned into a disc zone, and then no permits were dished out to residents? I seriously doubt you'd think "that's unfortunate, but at least it's fair on everyone!"

 

"Fairness" would mean disc zones all round (but you've now backtracked and said you wouldn't be happy with that) or no disc zones at all. But that's not workable in this day and age. What would most definitely not be fair, would be to install disc zones on some streets, and then not give permits to those who live there.

 

Also: I hope your username is supposed to be ironic.

[sarahc]

Frances, thanks for your sensible post. You agree that the system is unfair to visitors. My stance is that residents and visitors alike both have the same basic human rights and one group should not have an unfair advantage over the other when it comes to public roads (which both groups contribute to the building and maintenance of).

So whilst I sympathize with Owen, no neither he or anyone else (with the exception of the disabled) should get a permit.

 

I don't object to disc zones (time limits) in residential area as they can be a useful traffic management tool.

 

I'm sure the Human Rights Act left out the right to park one's vehicle by accident.

[The Voice of Reason]

Mr Sausages,

I think that you have confused my writings re disc zones and parking permits. One is a traffic management tool the other is discriminatory (unfairly so in my opinion).

I don't recall advocating disc zones all round I said that in any particular street everybody should be afforded the same oppotunity to park.

Regarding the scenario you put forward re my street becoming a disc zone yes I would think "that's unfortunate but at least it's fair on everyone"

Why should anyone's lifestyle be "protected"? The urban environment is constantly changing and we all have to adapt (but not by handing out unfair advantages)

There is no irony in my username. I certainly on think my comments on this issue justifies it.

[cheeky boy]

Disc and permit zones were created because of commuters leaving their cars in residential areas all day, making it difficult for residents to park near their homes

 

Before Derby Square was zoned I used to take the kids to school and by the time I got back every vacant space in the square was taken, mostly by office workers from Governors Hill and Onchan

 

If your paying Douglas rates the least you should be entitled to is a permit to park outside your own home

[The Voice of Reason]

I appreciate that people would wish to park outside/as near as possible to their house but I think that's what's happened here is people see their cars as an extension of their house. They are not. Once you take this concept on board logic prevails.

[The Voice of Reason]

I appreciate that people would wish to park outside/as near as possible to their house but I think that's what's happened here is people see their cars as an extension of their house. They are not. Once you take this concept on board logic prevails.

 

Don't be stupid. I lived in central Douglas when the disk zones came in and before they came in I was sick of people paying cheap rates in Onchan or Governors Hill etc and driving in to dump their cars in my street for free.

 

 

 

 

Your street ?

 

In Douglas domestic rates are paid to Douglas Borough Council to fund the services they provide. Residential parking permits are issued by the Department Of Transport, a government department. Can't quite see the connection.

[nipper]

["Mr Lowey says it's not Mr Hannay's place to comment on the decisions of politicians. He says civil servants should remember their job is carry out the wishes of parliament."

 

There are too many civil servants on the island that think things should be the other way around. I'd like to hear more politicians (all preferably elected by the voters) asserting their authority in this way.

 

A thread starts with a point about our (highly paid and highly pensioned) Civil Servants apparently carrying out their duties autocratically and ignoring the political will - and then bangs on for another 3 pages about disc parking!

 

When we have gotten tired of debating parking discs we could go on to dog mess in the streets.

[sarahc]

Smoking first!

[Lonan3]

Smoking first!

Smoking dog mess?

[cheeky boy]

I appreciate that people would wish to park outside/as near as possible to their house but I think that's what's happened here is people see their cars as an extension of their house. They are not. Once you take this concept on board logic prevails.

 

Don't be stupid. I lived in central Douglas when the disk zones came in and before they came in I was sick of people paying cheap rates in Onchan or Governors Hill etc and driving in to dump their cars in my street for free.

 

 

 

 

Your street ?

 

In Douglas domestic rates are paid to Douglas Borough Council to fund the services they provide. Residential parking permits are issued by the Department Of Transport, a government department. Can't quite see the connection.

 

 

The connection is simple : if you pay the highest rates on the Island for the privelige of living in Douglas you are going to be pissed off when someone who pays half that amount parks for free outside your house all day

 

By the way, I now own the patch of land outside my house and the next time that twat in the blue Polo parks on it they will be towed home with four flat tyres and a building block on the front seat

[nipper]

When did this M.L.C. last stand ? for a vote to be a M.H.K . It seems along time ago

1981

Thank you, I can say no more.

 

Well there is perhaps a little more that can be said.

 

Eddie Lowey got in on a by-election in 1975 and fought the following two General Elections. He significantly topped the poll at both of them beating Myles Walker (later to become Sir Miles Walker Chief Minister) and Noel Cringle (later to become Speaker of the House of Keys and now President of Tynwald) into 2nd and 3rd place respectively, at both of them.

 

George Edmund Lowey was elevated to the Legislative Council in November 1982 and has been re-elected onto LegCo. by the House of Keys ever since.

[cheeky boy]

When did this M.L.C. last stand ? for a vote to be a M.H.K . It seems along time ago

1981

Thank you, I can say no more.

 

Well there is perhaps a little more that can be said.

 

Eddie Lowey got in on a by-election in 1975 and fought the following two General Elections. He significantly topped the poll at both of them beating Myles Walker (later to become Sir Miles Walker Chief Minister) and Noel Cringle (later to become Speaker of the House of Keys and now President of Tynwald) into 2nd and 3rd place respectively, at both of them.

 

George Edmund Lowey was elevated to the Legislative Council in November 1982 and has been re-elected onto LegCo. by the House of Keys ever since.

 

Must say I have only dealt with Eddie Lowey once and he was an absoloute gent

 

Should he ever feel the need to stand for public election again he would walk it (no pun intended)

[Declan]

When did this M.L.C. last stand ? for a vote to be a M.H.K . It seems along time ago

1981

Thank you, I can say no more.

 

Myles Walker (later to become Sir Miles Walker Chief Minister)

 

I didn't know a knighthood changed the spelling of the recipient's first name. Looking forward to Sir Tiny Brown and Sir Dog Gelling.

 

On the Eddie Lowey issue you do realise that no one under 44 has had the chance to vote for him.

 

Incidently, wikipedia has this pciture of the current CM

 

 

I want to know whether the photo was taken before or after Oliver asked for more.

[The Voice of Reason]

In Douglas domestic rates are paid to Douglas Borough Council to fund the services they provide.

 

Yes. Like the £7m cost of building Shaws Brow and its running costs to accomodate the parking of out of town traffic.

 

Residential parking permits are issued by the Department Of Transport, a government department.

 

Well done. The Corpy don't own the street. I do understand.

 

Your just the sort of pedantic twat I'd enjoy arguing with but I really can't be arsed because from what you have posted previously you're clearly a simpleton.

 

You should learn that if you can't win an argument by reason you are no more likely to win it by resorting to personal abuse.