When Skies Are Grey Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 With the forum now having unprecendented levels of public interest can I suggest that the badgering of posters be kept to a minimum. We have an opportunity here for some reasoned debate and if people become members to engage in that debate then they should be encouraged to do so, rather than be berated for holding an opinion that is contrary to the "Manx" one (i.e. that the Steam Packet is out to get us all) If this descends into a slagging match on a personal level then we lose the impetus and credence that has been built up. Just a thought like..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VikingRaider Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 Fair enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monasqueen Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 A reduced winter service is perfectly normal for travel operators. I don't think anyone could disagree with this. Unfortunately, the "winter timetable" that had been available for pre-bookings was broadly based on last year's timings. When this timetable was summarily changed in October, anyone who had already booked for their weekend/day breaks or whatever had some serious amendments to face to their own arrangements. From the comments I have seen, there were more than a few who had to cancel their plans. Others who had not yet booked have "had the rug pulled out from under them". Whilst the Steam Packet's difficulties that led to a short-lived service to Birkenhead last year were met with sympathy and understanding, this year's mess is a different ball game. No wonder that the peasants are revolting. MQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X-ManxMan Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 It Amazes me the short memories some people have, and how opinionated some people become when they don't actually have all the facts. May I just remind all those who want Douglas port opened to anyone who wishes, what happened in the 1970's & 80's. ManxLine & the Steam Packet were fierce rivals and both companies became very cut-throat. At the time We Manx People loved the cheaper and cheaper fares, what we didn’t know at the time was the Steam Packet were on the verge of going bust, the ManxLine were being kept afloat (financially) by their parent company. It was only when Jim Shearwood who already owned most of ManxLine stepped in and bought the Steam Packet to merge the 2 and saved Manx services. Had that not happened BOTH companies could have gone and left the island with nothing. That was when & why the user agreement was created. By giving sole use of the port to one operator we have guaranteed service. OK I'll admit the current service isn't the best but I'm one of the few who would prefer reliability over frequency, and if that means the demise of the day trip so be it. Now for those who don't know (probably most of you) the user agreement is a public document so pop along to the Tynwald library and have a look at it before you shout what the Steam Packet should or should not do. They have to provide daily passenger & freight service to 'England', so one round trip on the Ben would take care of that, and they have to provide weekend service to a port near Liverpool, in fact I think it's so vague there would be nothing to stop the SP popping off to Holyhead. Now before you have a go at me I'm just stating some facts, the sorry state were in is the government’s fault for not putting better controls into the document. Just be thankful we have the any provider though. Look at the Isle of Man air links over the last few years. A few years ago everyone hated Manx Airlines because they were too expensive, now everyone cries "bring them back, bring them back". Fact is Manx was pulled by BA after September 11th, BA then binned the less profitable routes and a host of tin pot 1 plane airlines took up the available slots, but came and went again. So for the past few years nobody has been able to keep up with what airports you can even fly to let alone who operates the route. Do we really want to strip the Steam Packet of the user agreement and reduce the ferry service to the same level? Lets say Stenna want to come here, they’ll operate all the services you want in the summer when there's profit to be made, then come winter they'll be one freight boat chugging back and forth because that’s where the profit is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VikingRaider Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 I take your point about the 70's and 80's but times have changed, there are a lot more people on the Island now who consume a lot more imported goods. I think its fair to say that we could now support 2 ferry providers. I also agree about the reliability aspect but I am deeply worried about the Island being dependant on a single boat for the whole of the winter. By their own admission the Superseacat is not suitable, so exactly what would happen in the event of a serious mechanical failure, or god forbid, another accident. You are quite correct that the sorry mess we now find ourselves in is a direct result of a weak government in the first place and I suppose its understandable that the Racket will take full commercial advantage of that situation. If the agreement cannot be renegotiated and the Racket cannot be persuaded to act more reasonably then it is necessary for a game of high stakes poker, and if that means threatening to use taxpayers money to provide another linkspan so be it. Never forget that all of us, even those who never travel, use the Racket every single day of our lives when we shop for anything imported, it is too important to leave control of this essential service to a single company controlled by a bunch of financiers in Australia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tugger Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 The exclusivity afforded by the User Agreement is what makes the Steam Packet worth £225 million. Build another linkspan, and the guaranteed income stream (which is what Macquarie wanted) isn't guaranteed any more. How much do you think it is worth to Macquarie to ensure that another operator doesn't come here? They are making us PAY because they have us over a barrel. Time to turn the tables. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman8180 Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 Can you really see that happening Tugger? Forgetting the logistics of the matter, and the huge costs / risk of nobody using it.......... At the moment, there is a User Agreement in place. An Agreement written by the Government and 'signed up' to by the SP. The provision of services is currently far in excess of those laid down by the Agreement. The pricing is within the boundaries laid down by the Agreement. So the only grounds to build another linkspan, is for the Government to admit that it has royally fucked up. So, I ask again, do you really think that will happen? There is definitely a problem there at the moment, they seem desperately out of touch with the travelling public. I'm just not too sure how it's going to be fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeldn Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 Latest "Blog" from the IOMSPC................. http://www.steam-packet.com/SteamPacket/Bo...d-with-Woodward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluemonday Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 I have many plans for the next few months So have I, just let me sort out this problem with the transporter pattern buffers and I'll be able to get you across in less than a second. Honest............... All offers of volunteers for tests gratefully received. I guarantee you'll be no different after. Well not much.............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 Latest "Blog" from the IOMSPC................. "WELCOME TO ‘A WORD WITH WOODWARD’ – OUR CHIEF EXECUTIVE’S VERY OWN BLOG…... 19 November 2007 The company are also offering a 'Christmas shopping special' at the current day trip fare with foot passengers now being able to travel for £25 (including fuel surcharge. Passengers can travel from IOM on 0800 on Saturday returning either 02:15 from Heysham on Sunday with a free courtesy bus from Liverpool or on the 14:00 service from Twelve Quays, Birkenhead. Mark Woodward concluded: "We hope these reduced rates and what amounts to an extended stay in England with free coach transfers to Heysham will be of interest and benefit to our passengers." Hang on - I've just gone to book IOM - Birkenhead 8:00 am 24/11/07, Birkenhead - IOM 14:00 25/11/07 online and been quoted £50. The cost for the journey coming back via Heysham at 2.15am is £23. Have I read this wrong? Or is this just another cock-up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 I have read it wrong haven't I? The "day trip rate" applies if you use the service that arrives at Birkenhead at 12.15pm and leave an hour and a three quarters later. Very useful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feelslikeitshould Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 I have read it wrong haven't I? The "day trip rate" applies if you use the service that arrives at Birkenhead at 12.15pm and leave an hour and a three quarters later. Very useful You're not wrong. Thats amazing....they reduce the rate so everyone thinks at least they're making some effort but they make it completely useless to anyone! Looks like you either leave on the 2:15am boat or pay to stay some where and pay an extra £10-£20 to return at a reasonable time of day. What a joke. Well done steam packet.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
When Skies Are Grey Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 I am also going to standardise livery on all our vessels to better reflect the Island's identity and culture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ean Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 I lied Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 From Woodward:- "with foot passengers now being able to travel for £25" Right first time - another cock-up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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