Amadeus Posted November 30, 2007 Author Share Posted November 30, 2007 2222 at the moment Petition closes at midnight tonight Handover has been arranged for monday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amadeus Posted December 1, 2007 Author Share Posted December 1, 2007 The Petition is now closed Final count: 2225 Big question: What next? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
"V" Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Copies to Peter Karran and Bill Henderson ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triskelion Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Copies to Peter Karran and Bill Henderson ? Better off sending it to MHKs who will not go on about it anyway. Maybe send it to the transport minister, and tell one of those two that you did so. They can probably be relied upon to ask about it. But is there anything Tynwald can actually do? Perhaps best to see if anything comes of this before wondering what to do next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manxman2000 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Somebody has said that the Steam Packet make no money out of freight !!! At £60.00 per freight meter, that is a joke, the freight comes first although we freight users get a bad deal also. Don’t forget that Seacontainers sold the Steam Packet to MPF after making £10 M clear profit. In SeaCo days and as the Steam Packet (real Steam Packet) a good profit was made during the spring and summer on all routes and the Liverpool service as a service during the winter. All the banking owners want is to make more and more money on top of the sky high profits made on freight. Heysham Port was used as it was a James Fisher port and the James Fisher Company was a shareholder in the Packet. James Fisher offered cheaper berthing and port services for the Packet, The Packet was in any case becoming part of sea link (SeaCo) a little at a time. The better service was to the ports of Ardrossan Liverpool Belfast and Dublin. But with conventional vessels. Running high speed craft is expensive, they do not last as long as conventional vessels and use much more fuel (Diesel) Conventional vessels travel at slower speeds and can use a cheaper fuel IFO (intermediat fuel oil) saving all round, and can run in poor sea conditions. Question: Do you travel to Liverpool at speed in 2.5 Hours and pay a higher cost or travel at slower speeds and take 4 Hours but pay less and have reliability ? Also don’t forget that the crews and shore staff work for this company, Many don’t like the company now but cannot say anything for fear of loosing their jobs. This I think is the reason for the poor service onboard, so have some thought for the crews etc. Hamish Ross was one of the old school to some extent, Mark Woodward is just the banks front man and will do as his masters dictate, In his position you would all do the same. I have signed the petition as I believe that we need and should be given a better service than the one we have at present. If that requires another operator then so be it, if we can keep the Steam Packet and have the problems put right would be the best choice. Get rid of the fast craft and replace with modern conventional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homarus Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Somebody has said that the Steam Packet make no money out of freight !!! At £60.00 per freight meter, that is a joke, the freight comes first although we freight users get a bad deal also. Don’t forget that Seacontainers sold the Steam Packet to MPF after making £10 M clear profit. In SeaCo days and as the Steam Packet (real Steam Packet) a good profit was made during the spring and summer on all routes and the Liverpool service as a service during the winter. All the banking owners want is to make more and more money on top of the sky high profits made on freight. Heysham Port was used as it was a James Fisher port and the James Fisher Company was a shareholder in the Packet. James Fisher offered cheaper berthing and port services for the Packet, The Packet was in any case becoming part of sea link (SeaCo) a little at a time. The better service was to the ports of Ardrossan Liverpool Belfast and Dublin. But with conventional vessels. Running high speed craft is expensive, they do not last as long as conventional vessels and use much more fuel (Diesel) Conventional vessels travel at slower speeds and can use a cheaper fuel IFO (intermediat fuel oil) saving all round, and can run in poor sea conditions. Question: Do you travel to Liverpool at speed in 2.5 Hours and pay a higher cost or travel at slower speeds and take 4 Hours but pay less and have reliability ? Also don’t forget that the crews and shore staff work for this company, Many don’t like the company now but cannot say anything for fear of loosing their jobs. This I think is the reason for the poor service onboard, so have some thought for the crews etc. Hamish Ross was one of the old school to some extent, Mark Woodward is just the banks front man and will do as his masters dictate, In his position you would all do the same. I have signed the petition as I believe that we need and should be given a better service than the one we have at present. If that requires another operator then so be it, if we can keep the Steam Packet and have the problems put right would be the best choice. Get rid of the fast craft and replace with modern conventional. Good post Manxman 2000! Just one question! Is your post based on 'fact :' or 'educated assumption'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexMcC Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Somebody has said that the Steam Packet make no money out of freight !!! At £60.00 per freight meter, that is a joke, the freight comes first although we freight users get a bad deal also. Don’t forget that Seacontainers sold the Steam Packet to MPF after making £10 M clear profit. In SeaCo days and as the Steam Packet (real Steam Packet) a good profit was made during the spring and summer on all routes and the Liverpool service as a service during the winter. All the banking owners want is to make more and more money on top of the sky high profits made on freight. Heysham Port was used as it was a James Fisher port and the James Fisher Company was a shareholder in the Packet. James Fisher offered cheaper berthing and port services for the Packet, The Packet was in any case becoming part of sea link (SeaCo) a little at a time. The better service was to the ports of Ardrossan Liverpool Belfast and Dublin. But with conventional vessels. Running high speed craft is expensive, they do not last as long as conventional vessels and use much more fuel (Diesel) Conventional vessels travel at slower speeds and can use a cheaper fuel IFO (intermediat fuel oil) saving all round, and can run in poor sea conditions. Question: Do you travel to Liverpool at speed in 2.5 Hours and pay a higher cost or travel at slower speeds and take 4 Hours but pay less and have reliability ? Also don’t forget that the crews and shore staff work for this company, Many don’t like the company now but cannot say anything for fear of loosing their jobs. This I think is the reason for the poor service onboard, so have some thought for the crews etc. Hamish Ross was one of the old school to some extent, Mark Woodward is just the banks front man and will do as his masters dictate, In his position you would all do the same. I have signed the petition as I believe that we need and should be given a better service than the one we have at present. If that requires another operator then so be it, if we can keep the Steam Packet and have the problems put right would be the best choice. Get rid of the fast craft and replace with modern conventional. Good post Manxman 2000! Just one question! Is your post based on 'fact :' or 'educated assumption'? I wouldn't be at all surprised if the SPC made ~£15+ mil a year profit, I'm not sure who said there was little to be made on freight on Manx services, it's quite a bit less anywhere else though.... I don't think the crews deserve most of the backlash they do receive, they do a job, but I think maybe words when coming to criticize the service could be chosen a lot better by some people. One thing Manxman2000, was not Heysham owned by BR until Thatcher flogged Sealink along with Heysham port to Seacontainers in 1984? (I'm not totally sure who owned it before then). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempus Fugit Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 anyone got any more info on this ? showing Emeraude France and Sea Express 1 both in birkenhead this morning (maybe it's just the radio kit they are testing and not the ships ????) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
"V" Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 They are probably using them to show complaining passengers at Birkenhead how unrealiable they are in this bad weather!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monasqueen Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 They are probably using them to show complaining passengers at Birkenhead how unrealiable they are in this bad weather!!! Whilst we are on the subject of unreliability of fast craft - well this was pointed out in the Blog, so it must be true!.. Do you think we will get an assurance from the Steam Packet that when Ben goes in for survey in February, and is covered by none other than a fast craft for 2 weeks, with no passenger back-up vessel apparent, we will not get stranded when we try to travel. Or is Mr Woodward able to call on divine intervention for the weather in late February/early March? The freight will presumably be OK, as a charter vessel will probably be available - but these only take 12 passengers max., and those spaces will be filled by drivers of accompanied freight vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Heysham was built as a Railway Port - Midland Railway 1904 - then passed to LMS (still proud symbol on the 1930's building that must be due for demolition) then BR then via Maggies corrupt cronies (see www.manxnotebook.com/exans/prt_1906.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Login Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 I wouldn't be at all surprised if the SPC made ~£15+ mil a year profit, I'm not sure who said there was little to be made on freight on Manx services, it's quite a bit less anywhere else though.... From memory the comment that there is little profit on freight has been taken out of context as I think that the comment was not made to suggest the profits were not small in themselves but that in respect of what MacQuarrie earned in total from their portfolio of investments the profit arising friom freight and the SP was fairly small Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manxman2000 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Heysham was a British rail port until Mr Sherwood took control of sealink british ferries, he then set about dividing the company into Port ops Hoverspeed and many other smaller units (all helps toward tax) If anybody has a good memory you will remember that the company that stalked the Racket was called "seaboxes" a play on sea containers. Also if you look back to the sale of the Steam Packet you will find that the company alone made £10 m that year, it could make much more now but I do not have that information and could only speculate. It is correct to say that freight has less value to other shipping lines, with the exeption of Condor to the channel islands (another bank owned company) CalMac have to be excluded from this comparison as they receive much in subsidies from the Scottish ministers. But it is less costley to send freight trailers to Belfast from Heysham than it is to the Isle of Man. and twice the distance. I think this might just rage on until the racket is sold again or the government steps in to allow another company to use the link span. Compertition will sort out the problem. In the mean time we must all put up with the spc as it is but continue to put pressure on to the MHK's and not let it die down, above all no insults to Mark Woodward or his managment team as this would be counter productive and very off putting to Government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 I wonder just how many freight companies would dare criticise the SP until there was a viable alternative established - monopolies that control your lifeline are risky to critise in public though I have heard 'rumours' that not all large freight users are enamoured of the SP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manxman2000 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 I wonder just how many freight companies would dare criticise the SP until there was a viable alternative established - monopolies that control your lifeline are risky to critise in public though I have heard 'rumours' that not all large freight users are enamoured of the SP. In truth I think that all the freight companies have a axe to grind with the packet, the rumours are correct and I suspect that you do not know the half of it (unless you are also in freight on our island) One comment I will make though, the Ben My Chree is the best freighter we have ever had. well worth the £25 mil spent (should have been by the government though and chartered to the racket) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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