Do Mhks Read This Board?

[Slim]

I think you're getting too caught up in the world of internet forums. They're just not that relevant to most people, and not a very good place to have a serious debate.

 

You don't see it happening much in the rest of the world either. You'd think it'd be a good way of getting broad coverage and making it look like you're doing something, but I guess that's just too much of a double edged sword for any politician.

 

If they want to contribute here, they're free to do so like anyone else, but they don't.

[Skeddan]

I think you're getting too caught up in the world of internet forums. They're just not that relevant to most people, and not a very good place to have a serious debate.

 

You don't see it happening much in the rest of the world either. You'd think it'd be a good way of getting broad coverage and making it look like you're doing something, but I guess that's just too much of a double edged sword for any politician.

 

If they want to contribute here, they're free to do so like anyone else, but they don't.

 

 

http://www.manxforums.com/forums/index.php...mp;#entry251214

 

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/worl...icle2037158.ece

 

Some States within China have now stopped the use of internet pseudonyms and anonymous internet forum posting. You have to use your real name (somewhat pointless when billions of people share about 50 surnames) and also input your ID card number as part of the process of registering on a forum

 

It comes as internet protests stop the building of a £700m chemical plant.

[P.K.]

Come off it Albert, that's all about as pointless as turning up at a forum get-together and then not introducing yourself to the people there...

 

With internet forums being anonymous and open to all no politician is ever going to put themselves under that kind of spotlight as they could end up answering questions from Ng in Adelaide. Tell you what, why not try something radical like that nice Tony Blair (who you insist on calling a liar) and get the poliicians up on their hind legs in front of their electorate! Oh whoops, a lot of them aren't elected and are therefore unaccountable. Never mind....

P.K. I don't fully understand the issue here. Is it a bad thing to know where politicians stand on issues, or to answer questions? If Ng in Adelaide raises a valid point, even if not Manx, it might well be relevant. Maybe the question will come from Ng, and could be one that is on the mark and makes a valuable contribution - but if it is uninformed, irrelevant, or trolling, it wouldn't go further. In any event the MHKs can choose not to answer. Politicians are often interviewed by foreign journalists - most don't fear being put in the spotlight as you suggest - at least not in most democracies.

 

It's not to say that maybe there ought to be some vetting or restrictions. Maybe there ought to be a final poll of what goes through by non-anonymous members who are verified as being in IoM. That is a discussion maybe should have. Rather than just dismiss whole thing as pointless, it would be good to have some constructive suggestions to address the concerns you raise.

There are various issues which to me make it a complete non-starter. Firstly out of a pop of circa 70k how many are regularly on here? Hardly enough to warrant any time from an illustrious member of the wonderful government. Secondly there is the rather quaint naiivity some have that the politicos actually care about your opinions. With an un-elected, unaccountable power-block refusing to get their noses out of the Tynwald Trough of Largesse (hmmm.. it's original and I like it) how much support do you think they will give your notion? Thirdly there's my mate Ng in Adelaide. The thing about him is he doesn't have a vote in the manx electoral "system" i.e. his opinions are worth even less than yours!

 

Basically if the gov had wanted such a set-up as you are proposing they would have done it themselves.

[Albert Tatlock]

For example, our wonderful all powerful all caring Tynwald passed an Act to allow 16 year olds to vote. The MHKs go round the world and other commonwealth countries, displaying their pomposity at this example of their fine work.

That was a question on the 'Weakest link' this evening. They're obviously getting one message across.

[P.K.]

Interesting. Did the contestant answer correctly?

[DjDan]

Interesting. Did the contestant answer correctly?

 

Yes.

 

(I don't watch the program.... it was just on.. honestly)

[Declan]

I think inviting politicians to participate here, particularly, in the manner suggested of staged debates is a very bad idea.

[P.K.]

Yes.

 

(I don't watch the program.... it was just on.. honestly)

I have to say I would deny watching that appalling woman as well!

 

Errrr.... wait a minute though:

 

Which brainiac at the BBC thinks he's any good - probably the same idiot that gave Ann Robinson a job.

Oh dear... Oh well, hardly unexpected.

[manshimajin]

As a new boy on the block people's views about how politics works on the island is interesting.

 

I remember hearing one time in Ireland that the difference between Irish politicians and UK politicians was that Irish politicians are still close enough to their electorates and their roots to know the price of a pig. It sounds from some comments that Manx MHKs live on a different island to the population - maybe they are in a commune on the Calf?

 

Whilst clearly some folk are rightly sceptical about the influence that a forum (or presumably any other form of issue discussion) may have, we are now living in an age in which views can be shared and debated in ways never possible before.

 

I sometimes wonder if the cynicism that politicians and the media say exists towards politics these days is actually not that at all.

 

People are much better informed these days, can compare what happens in the Isle of Man with what happens in Jersey, Scotland or Katmandu etc..but are still stuck with an archaic system of representation designed in and for the age of horse transport. So when people see issues that, to quote a former Labor Party leader in Australia 'Blind Freddy and his dog could see', and politicians do nothing about them cynicism is inevitably the order of the day.

 

Of course this forum is only one channel of opinion but its membership looks to be about 12% of the population (excuding Ng of Adelaide!!!) which means that it is a pretty good cross section - the sort of population percentages that opinion pollsters would give both hands to access.

 

Someone commented in this thread that despite all the serious issues on the island the main thing the MHKs have done is to lower the voting age to 16 even though this was not seen as a significant issue. So this gives me an idea (shades of Baldrick) for a two stage process that might test whether Fora can be influential:

 

Stage 1 - run a thread to ask forum members what they think the BIG issues are for the IoM,

 

Stage 2 - run a poll to get forum members to vote to identify the Top 5

 

Stage 3 - (because every good 2 stage process has at least three steps) - publicise this activity in the media - beforehand (to maximise participation - and potentially to grow membership of the forum) and afterwards to get the results into the public domain.

Is this a good idea or am I having a T5 moment?

[manshimajin]

I don't know what a T5 moment is, but somehow you seem to have posted twice with the second post 2 mins EARLIER than the first one. Impressive - with powers of time travel like that you might be able to tell us if the idea works out in the future .

 

Mea Culpa - must have hit the button twice.

 

If you are anywhere near Heathrow this week ask BA or their CEO Willie Walsh what a T5 moment is.... the term has rapidly entered the language in Ireland to describe a mess up (perhaps because the first instance is a monumental a mess up by a UK corporation with an Irish CEO). In my case - would a poll on Top 5 issues be a good idea or a monumental mistake.

 

I'll try hitting the button once this time - is there any way of removing the duplicate?

[Declan]

Stage 1 - run a thread to ask forum members what they think the BIG issues are for the IoM,

 

Stage 2 - run a poll to get forum members to vote to identify the Top 5

 

Stage 3 - (because every good 2 stage process has at least three steps) - publicise this activity in the media - beforehand (to maximise participation - and potentially to grow membership of the forum) and afterwards to get the results into the public domain.

 

Stage 4 - Shut down forum because it will be shite after that.

 

You haven't been here long enough to know how to edit posts without double-posting, but you think you can come up with a nasty little destructive idea like this. The beauty of the forum is (or at least was) that we go running to the media to "maximise publicity", because we are not (with the exception of Amadeus) self-publicising politicos.

[Mutley]

You haven't been here long enough to know how to edit posts without double-posting, but you think you can come up with a nasty little destructive idea like this.

 

And when you have been here long enough you'll turn into a grumpy cunt like Declan.

[manshimajin]

You haven't been here long enough to know how to edit posts without double-posting, but you think you can come up with a nasty little destructive idea like this.

 

And when you have been here long enough you'll turn into a grumpy cunt like Declan.

 

Now I know why his tongue is hanging out - not lack of nicotine - too much forum

[Ushtey]

The various comments that current politicians may not care about questions posted via internet forums may feel unwilling to participate in any kind of online debate might be true, but that's no reason to not try.

 

PAG is increasingly finding politicians willing to speak to them about issues and face open questions (in a forum where they don't always have time to think about and carefully word their responses in advance), when they started that wasn't the case.

 

Anything that opens up debate surely has to be a good thing on the Island and contrary to some opinion the current crop of politicians won't be in office ad infinitum.

 

For me, the most successful recent example was the thread around the community waste issue, Dudley Butt posted an excellent response which cleared up a lot of conjecture and rumour.

 

However, I do feel that if people want to debate directly with politicians and expect a reply then they should either supply their own names to them privately or post them with their comments. Just posting questions and hoping to get a response is a different matter.

[Freggyragh]

I can't see too many politicians actually posting to this forum. Of course many of the members do not live here, so why, would an MHK choose to get involved in a discussion between a group of all but anonymous non-voters living in disparate jurisdictions? Eg; P K (living in the UK), Skeddan (living, I assume, in N Z) and Manshimajin (living in R I, - and shouldn't that be Mantojin?). Of course, I'd hope our MHks would have a look at some of the issues that get discussed, but I can't imagine too many of them would care to join in the discussions.