Isle Of Man Prisoners Go On Hunger Strike Over Smoking Ban

[slinkydevil]

So explain why an exception should be made?

 

I don't need to, I don't think they should allow smoking in prison.

 

I was asking how it is 'difficult' to make an exception for prisoners. It's not.

[manxy]

Bit of perspective: We are talking about a few prisoners refusing meals here, not a mass riot.

 

Smoking is banned on all Government property, and it is difficult to make the case an exception should be made for convicts.

 

Smoking is not a human right. Food, water, shelter, healthcare and social interaction are and, as such, are all provided.

 

But in the UK - "Exemptions will apply to prisons, care homes, hospices, designated hotel rooms and long-stay secure psychiatric facilities."

 

So explain how is it 'difficult' to make an exception for prisoners?

I disagree slinkydevil with you on this occasion and agree with triskelion because of the problems it will leave. IMO, people might say that prisoners get all the perks and privileges, whilst the honest working person doesn't. (not sure exactly who that person is)

Obviously it's a lot more complicated than that and whichever angle you look at it, there's loads of things for and against this long winded discussion. From past posts however, I noted that the prisoners get free patches and lozenges, which is more than other people get.

[cheeky boy]

""She said: 'Tobacco in the jail is worth more than heroin – that's how bad it is.' ""

 

So an ounce of tobacco is worth more than an ounce of heroin in jail ?

 

Don't be fucking stupid

[slinkydevil]

I disagree slinkydevil with you on this occasion and agree with triskelion because of the problems it will leave. IMO, people might say that prisoners get all the perks and privileges, whilst the honest working person doesn't. (not sure exactly who that person is)

Obviously it's a lot more complicated than that and whichever angle you look at it, there's loads of things for and against this long winded discussion. From past posts however, I noted that the prisoners get free patches and lozenges, which is more than other people get.

 

True manxy, I agree. But people arn't up in arms in the UK about it - maybe they were annoyed for a couple of months but a year or so on I don't think people give a second thought about it. I guess it's a good thing the IOM is setting a standard and being forceful for once.

[Albert Tatlock]

Bit of perspective: We are talking about a few prisoners refusing meals here, not a mass riot.

 

Smoking is banned on all Government property, and it is difficult to make the case an exception should be made for convicts.

 

Smoking is not a human right. Food, water, shelter, healthcare and social interaction are and, as such, are all provided.

 

But in the UK - "Exemptions will apply to prisons, care homes, hospices, designated hotel rooms and long-stay secure psychiatric facilities."

 

So explain how is it 'difficult' to make an exception for prisoners?

I disagree slinkydevil with you on this occasion and agree with triskelion because of the problems it will leave.

Remember though, this 'hunger strike' isn't likely to be just one action that just simply dies out...the prison gets new inmates on a regular basis. It might be fairly 'quiet' or 'not amounting to much' now (though that depends on who you get your information from, or who you choose to believe of course), but future reactions will always depend on who goes in, and are therefore completely unpredictable, as is the seriousness of any future reactions.

 

The line in the sand for the government telling you what you can do with regard to smoking has to be drawn somewhere, and to me that line is the open air and my front door. Remember too, lots of people rent government property i.e. all of the council estates on the island - are people seriously going to suggest smoking be banned in such government owned houses?

 

AFAIC, people who believe prisoners are simply there to be punished as harshly as possible, and not rehabilitated - nor treated as human beings especially when they are expected to rejoin society (as practically all of them will do at some stage), deserve this society they are creating for themselves - short sighted brainless thinking at it's best, which just keeps the revolving door at the prison spinning.

 

Prison is the home of a prisoner and this is cocking about too far, when there are simple compromises available to protect staff.

[Declan]

Mystic Declan strikes again, Dan.

[DjDan]

think you just know him a little too well.... !

[Amadeus]

The Island has gone bonkers and to add to the madness only Amadeus & Albert are talking sense.

I am currently in a state of shock

 

Back shortly - I need to lie down...

[Lonan3]

If the prospect of not being able to smoke when incarcerated is to be a deterrent factor, then all well and good. Whether this 'additional form of punishment' should have been inflicted on those whoe were already in prison - assuming that they wouldn't have known that such a complete ban was to be imposed - does, perhaps, suggest that their rights are being ignored, at least when they are outside in the grounds of the prison.

[P.K.]

AFAIC, people who believe prisoners are simply there to be punished as harshly as possible, and not rehabilitated - nor treated as human beings especially when they are expected to rejoin society (as practically all of them will do at some stage), deserve this society they are creating for themselves - short sighted brainless thinking at it's best, which just keeps the revolving door at the prison spinning.

Nice try Albert but you're wrong. If the regime is thought to be so harsh (a la Joe Arpaio) that the prisoner does not want to return under any circumstances then they have been rehabilitated. In any event as smoking is so bad for the prisoners health banning it in prison can't be seen as an "extra" punishment because it's actually doing them some good.

 

By the way I read the Grauniad, not the Daily Wail.

[Doric]

If they are so keen to say "I'm going on hunger strike" and that in the newspapers and be public, then they should also be so keen to add who they are and what they have done because if one of them was the guy that stole my computer or broke my wing mirror then i simply don't have any sympathy.

[Mutley]

LMFAO - down to 5 Bobby Sands now. Solidarity brothers! If any of them lasts a whole 2 weeks without food I'll eat a tasty Kahuna burger.

[ourtess]

Prisoners should be encouraged to take up smoking with free cigarettes issued every day.

They should also have as much chips cheese and gravy as they want, at any time of the day.

And really comfy armchairs and sky+ to discourage any form of fitness.

[VinnieK]

Nice try Albert but you're wrong. If the regime is thought to be so harsh (a la Joe Arpaio) that the prisoner does not want to return under any circumstances then they have been rehabilitated.

 

No, rehabilitation is the act of making a criminal a productive member of society who respects the law and others through his or her own free will. What you describe is simply a form of coercion and conditioning, which only works for as long as the person thinks they wont get away with breaking the law. Have you actually seen any figures regarding Maricopa county's crime and reoffending rates? Everything I've read suggests that their crime rate isn't much different from that of the U.S. as a whole, and that in certain areas it's significantly higher.

 

By the way I read the Grauniad, not the Daily Wail.

 

Now that's not entirely true is it? You don't so much read it as prance about with it under your arm with an underserved sense of accomplishment whilst bellowing "I listen to the radio! I once had a sandwich in the Tate modern! I use strange old ladylike affectations such as "oh dear"", and even then you only carry it around because you once saw a gentleman with spectacles reading it and assumed it must be the paper of the intelligentsia.

[DjDan]

LMFAO - down to 5 Bobby Sands now. Solidarity brothers! If any of them lasts a whole 2 weeks without food I'll eat a tasty Kahuna burger.

 

 

In a statement issued this morning, the Department of Home Affairs confirmed that nine prisoners refused their lunchtime meals yesterday and five refused their evening meal.

 

 

Oh come on.... NINE start the "hunger strike" at lunch..... and FOUR cannot even make it past teatime!!! That's a pretty poor attempt at staging a "hunger strike" by any one's standards.

 

I fast, 'food and water' for 24 hours once a month!