Tell It As It Is - Now Do Something

[Gladys]

Myself I partialy blame the labour govt for introducing a state of affairs where a police officer/teacher/parent etc cannot enforce any form of discipline on kids without fear of prosecution, unfortunately it is now drifting to here now, the second thing is lack of facilities for kids and when they do hang around together in public all they get is moved along even if they all they are doing is making noise by laughing, seems some adults resent kids being happy. I fully agree with parents being part responsible for teaching kids values but you cannot blame working parents for being absent, many of us grew up in the 60,s with both parents at work during the summer holidays but the level of crime wasn't as high then, and why? Because if you did get caught doing something you ended up in the shit from several parties, the worst of wich was usualy home. So lets stop trying to find a party to blame and instead look into what works and how community values can be re instaled into kids and start spending some money on giving them something to do they can enjoy.

Totally agree, far too many 'rights' far too few 'responsibilities'.

[Gladys]

Jimbms - I cannot agree with you over the lack of facilities. Kids today have far more than we ever did back in the 60s/70s. And yes we all got in trouble, we all got told off, we all learned from our mistakes. I got the cane at school, I got stopped for speeding by the police on my push bike with my mother stood at the bus stop across the road, set the house on fire and got the beating of my life. I did not try to take my parents to court and divorce them, or have them locked up for assault, or seek compensation for things that were essentially my fault.

 

I would disagree, there was far more to do as kids during the 60s and 70s here, because we could all participate in the various tourist attractions that existed then. Winter, of course, was a different matter. But a friend went to the museum recently to watch the cinema archive and her only comment was that it looked a much more entertaining place in the old days than it is now.

 

However, I do not necessarily buy the idea that providing 'things to do' will cure all ills, it is a part of the overall package which includes things like parental responsibility and responsibility for self in the kids themselves, that will make the real difference.

[monasqueen]

When Thatcher dies I'm planning to pour a bottle of good scotch whiskey over her grave in tribute.

You can't kill the undead.

 

Seen in today's Guardian.

 

[Albert Tatlock]

However, I do not necessarily buy the idea that providing 'things to do' will cure all ills, it is a part of the overall package which includes things like parental responsibility and responsibility for self in the kids themselves, that will make the real difference.

I think it's too far gone to correct with 'this generation' of parents...we have to go back to basics, realise that we have to provide facilities for kids, get away from the attitude 'kids should be not seen and not heard', provide tougher compulsory (even boarding) schools where necessary for the really difficult ones or specialist help where possible. We have to take the opportunity now to drum responsibility into some of today's youngsters, who will soon be the next parental generation, but doomed to become failed parents themselves.

 

In other words, if we want things to change, society has to take responsibility for the parental failures of today and attempt to replace what parents are failing to deliver. A combination of facilities, specialists and better education would help do that, but heavier penalties need to be on those parents who are failing now, to encourage them to do better.

[Cambon]

I would disagree, there was far more to do as kids during the 60s and 70s here, because we could all participate in the various tourist attractions that existed then. Winter, of course, was a different matter. But a friend went to the museum recently to watch the cinema archive and her only comment was that it looked a much more entertaining place in the old days than it is now.

 

I totally disagree. Every other kid today has an ipod, a tv in their bedroom, playstation (or whatever). Home entertainment is miles ahead of where it was in the 60s and 70s. What did I do back then? I played with bikes, made g0-karts out of wood and old pram wheels, played football, went swimming, fishing, etc. No facilities required.

 

On Sunday I was on the train going through Castletown. There is a massive park there with all kinds of facilities. There were quite a number of parents and small children playing on the swings As for the older kids, the football/rugby field? Empty, Skate board park? Empty. The facilities that have been asked for are there and are free. Who uses them? Nobody!

[Albert Tatlock]

Probably the best way of looking at all this - is the empire is gone - and this is just the trailing end of our civilisation. Such behaviours are common when civilisations fall apart and dissapear into the next one. History shows us that.

[triskelion]

Probably the best way of looking at all this - is the empire is gone - and this is just the trailing end of our civilisation. Such behaviours are common when civilisations fall apart and dissapear into the next one. History shows us that.

No it doesn't.

[Albert Tatlock]

Probably the best way of looking at all this - is the empire is gone - and this is just the trailing end of our civilisation. Such behaviours are common when civilisations fall apart and dissapear into the next one. History shows us that.

No it doesn't.

...quite a few say that too when these things happen. It's only after it's happended people actually realise it's happended. Historians will be the judge of it.

[triskelion]

As a historian, I feel quite comfortable saying history does not show us this. Civilisations don't just 'end.'

[tameelf]

As a historian, I feel quite comfortable saying history does not show us this. Civilisations don't just 'end.'

 

easter island amongst many many more

[Cambon]

As a historian, I feel quite comfortable saying history does not show us this. Civilisations don't just 'end.'

 

You must be a crap historian, it is depicted in everything from Noah's Ark and the Phoenix rising from the ashes, to what happened in the Eastern Block, what is happening in Iraq today, what is about to happen in Zimbabwe. Britan is not that far behind. It will probably be a civil war of some sort, unless it is prohibited on health and safety grounds!

[thebees]

What makes that girl in the tracksuit feel the need to wear gold around her neck and in her ears? the people who were the first to judge her for being poor no doubt, I don't think there is anything right nor fair about that cartoon, top class snobbery thats all that is & it certainly is not funny. Perhaps that is where the problem lies, with the snobs & nobs of society, perhaps the kids on the street would have liked to see Princess Anne, not just the usual WAGS but she was too busy with the Islands rich and famous (famous in Port Erin ofc).

[triskelion]

As a historian, I feel quite comfortable saying history does not show us this. Civilisations don't just 'end.'

 

You must be a crap historian, it is depicted in everything from Noah's Ark and the Phoenix rising from the ashes, to what happened in the Eastern Block, what is happening in Iraq today, what is about to happen in Zimbabwe. Britan is not that far behind. It will probably be a civil war of some sort, unless it is prohibited on health and safety grounds!

I'm a crap historian because I don't consider the fictional stories of Noah's Ark or a magical bird as an accurate representation of historical developments?

 

I'm half-convinced you are joking - Britain not far behind Zimbabwe? What? All things are evolutionary, not revolutionary.

[jimbms]

It wasn't supposed to be funny. If there was any 'humour' intended then it would be pathos. For me, it was too close to the truth to be funny and I think that is what the cartoon was trying to portray.

 

We (us humans) have created this society, this need for wealth overcoming our responsibilities to our children. We've become slaves to the advertising that tells us we cannot become complete without having the latest gadget/car/drink/food/holiday. Too many have become providers rather than giving their children what they really need and when the shoite hits the fan too many are ready to pass the blame to the very organisations that were put in place to help them. And now, they have become 'helpless'.

 

The answer? I don't even know that there is one. No education in the world will turn this around. My opinion is that it will take a huge sea

change for things to improve. The financial crisis approaching may be the start of it, or as someone suggested a civil war. Perhaps not as we know a war, but just people being absolutely sick of the way things are and deciding to change they way THEY live. There are some rumblings already. Some folks with more money than sense are actually beginning to realise that they are not fullfilled and that money and 'stuff' does not buy them happiness. Put the people in that category against the poor buggers that have nothing and it's easy to see why there's huge unrest.

 

So Ms Bees - there was no attempt on my part to laugh at the poor and neither I think on behalf of the cartoon's originator. Just an overwhelming sadness and an attempt to show how far things have come.

 

Fast forward 20 years. The child holding the knife will be the parent and the mother the grandparent. God only knows what the child of that family group will be using to try to hold his place within 'his society'.

Ditto what she said

[Cambon]

I'm a crap historian because I don't consider the fictional stories of Noah's Ark or a magical bird as an accurate representation of historical developments?

 

I'm half-convinced you are joking - Britain not far behind Zimbabwe? What? All things are evolutionary, not revolutionary.

 

Not joking, but said tongue in cheek - they are descriptive of past events.

 

Britain is not far behind Zimbabwe, 50 years max. Remember, 50 years ago Zimbabwe did not even exist.