Buying Local

[Frances]

I got so used to excellent Manx Icecream that I bought a proper icecream make for my SE England place as UK commercial icecream is politely described as junk - contrarywise I bought a breadmaker for Peel ! Can't understand why there is no decent 'doux' Manx butter - go to any French supermarket and you can buy (somewhat more expensive than the usual stuff ) AC butter from specific areas or even farms - the mature Manx 'cheddar' is acceptable but is there really a market for the other admixtures - Manx double cream is however significantly up market on English (tho considerably more expensive).

[slinkydevil]

We make our own bread. It's a pity that Ramsey Bakery put the local bakers out of business.

 

Ramsey Bakery is a local baker. Granted though a shit one.

 

Apart from ice cream we buy very little processed food.

 

Get an ice cream maker. I got one a few weeks ago, some blackberries picked from the hedgerows over here (seen loads of blackberries this year) and had blackberry Ice Cream, gorgeous. Tried a few different experiments - all nice. Chocolate orange (cocoa powder, orange/lemon juice and zest of orange) with some broken up flakes in..... mmmmn.

[keyboarder]

Ramsey Bakery is a local baker. Granted though a shit one.

 

It's not that bad.

[Miss Take]

with some broken up flakes in..... mmmmn.

 

Flakes aren't local - traitor!

[MarcusAurelius]

Please don't shoot the messenger here , but I was speaking to a fellow shopkepper on Thursday and he told me that a consultant who has just done a report on retail on the island said that 56% of the government's revenue comes from VAT.

 

One of the gripes I have is that people are always saying to me in our little shop that they can get the same thing from Play or Amazon for £10 less.When you try to explain that the difference in price is solely down to us having to pay VAT and Play , Amazon ( any other Jersey based website ) not having to pay VAT they just scoff.

 

If you look at it another way the VAT that gets levied on mine and other shops goes towards your childrens schools , health service etc.. Thats what buying local does for the manx economy.It helps us all.

[oldmanxfella]

Please don't shoot the messenger here , but I was speaking to a fellow shopkepper on Thursday and he told me that a consultant who has just done a report on retail on the island said that 56% of the government's revenue comes from VAT.

 

I think you might find its slightly higher than 56% but why would a consultant paid by the government (us?) effectively point out that you're a mug and that your business is paying for everything. Hopefully the government might take note at contract renewal?

 

Its human nature though. I buy a CD off you and pay VAT or I get it £10 cheaper from Play.com.

 

The real question is why are we all paying so much in VAT here and why, because the VAT agreement can be cancelled at 2 years notice on either side, is nothing being done to change our complete over reliance on consumption based taxes when we are entering a period where consumption is going to cut back massively.

[Skeddan]

One of the gripes I have is that people are always saying to me in our little shop that they can get the same thing from Play or Amazon for £10 less.When you try to explain that the difference in price is solely down to us having to pay VAT and Play , Amazon ( any other Jersey based website ) not having to pay VAT they just scoff.

Shouldn't VAT be charged on imports at same rate as would be if sold locally?

[MarcusAurelius]

Please don't shoot the messenger here , but I was speaking to a fellow shopkepper on Thursday and he told me that a consultant who has just done a report on retail on the island said that 56% of the government's revenue comes from VAT.

 

I think you might find its slightly higher than 56% but why would a consultant paid by the government (us?) effectively point out that you're a mug and that your business is paying for everything. Hopefully the government might take note at contract renewal?

 

Its human nature though. I buy a CD off you and pay VAT or I get it £10 cheaper from Play.com.

 

The real question is why are we all paying so much in VAT here and why, because the VAT agreement can be cancelled at 2 years notice on either side, is nothing being done to change our complete over reliance on consumption based taxes when we are entering a period where consumption is going to cut back massively.

 

You may view that us ( me ) paying VAT makes me a mug but I disagree.I am by no means of a socialist point of view but it has heartened me to know that there is a point to the VAT we pay.The tax and NI we pay as well. I don't know what the situation is in Jersey when it comes to direct and indirect taxation but its not going to really to change my view on this.

 

Who really knows how much we contribute to the government coffers when it comes to VAT , TAX & NI whether it be 56% or whatever.But what we do know is that the money we spend ends up there eventually.Much better than spending it on the internet to some company that has no responsability or interest in what happens to the Isle Of Man.

 

Nonetheless it is every persons right to do as they see fit , consumers have to do whats best for them

 

Shouldn't VAT be charged on imports at same rate as would be if sold locally?

 

I think that is the theory but I don't think in reality that is what happens.

[oldmanxfella]

You may view that us ( me ) paying VAT makes me a mug but I disagree.

 

Sorry that came across wrong. I didn't want to suggest or say that at all.

[pongo]

Few points:

 

1. Retail sales of DVDs and CDs don't have much long term future. Sooner or later we will buy all our media as downloads. Personally everyone I know already does. Buying data on bits of plastic has no future.

 

2. If VAT was charged at a different rate than in the UK - we would suddenly find that we were blocked from being able to buy all sorts of stuff online. Including online services etc.

 

3. AFAIK Amazon stuff is not VAT free.

 

4. AFAIK we get our VAT back from the UK as an agreed estimated amount. So does it actually make so much difference, in terms of the VAT, whether we buy stuff online or locally?

[MarcusAurelius]

Few points:

 

1. Retail sales of DVDs and CDs don't have much long term future. Sooner or later we will buy all our media as downloads. Personally everyone I know already does. Buying data on bits of plastic has no future.

 

2. If VAT was charged at a different rate than in the UK - we would suddenly find that we were blocked from being able to buy all sorts of stuff online. Including online services etc.

 

3. AFAIK Amazon stuff is not VAT free.

 

4. AFAIK we get our VAT back from the UK as an agreed estimated amount. So does it actually make so much difference, in terms of the VAT, whether we buy stuff online or locally?

 

Jersey is not UK though.Amazon stuff is VAT Free.They certainly do not pay VAT when they buy games and consoles.You state that the VAT does not make much difference , but with all due respect what knowledge or experience do you have to make such a statement.UK & IOM pay the same rates of VAT, Jersey & Guernsey do not.

 

You say that most of the people you know buy your media as downloads , yet HMV still do a reasonable trade when it comes to Blu - Ray , DVD's and CD's.Game turned over in the region of £2 million when I was store manager ( approx. 18 months ago ) and our little shop turns over a reasonable amount for Ramsey.People have been able to legitimately download games through applications like Steam for ages , yet we still have plenty of people that come into our shop to buy PC games.

 

For the foreseeable future there will be a demand for hard copies of CD's , DVD's & Games.I would be interested to know if anyone has downloaded a movie in standard or high definition from xbox live locally.

[Mission]

Even if you could get the full 8meg, how long would it take to download a dvd quality movie over here?

 

Not to mention the fact that hard-drives have an annoying habit of going tits up at a moments notice so you'd need a backup (either onto another HDD or onto DVD).

 

Fuck that shit, far easier to just go buy the thing.

 

I'm sure there may well come a time when everything is downloaded but I think it's a long way off yet tbh.

 

As for Amazon, it depends where the stuff comes from. If it's from Amazon Jersey (indigostarfish) it's definitelty VAT free. If it's from Amazon Uk, the VAT is charged.

[Skeddan]

Shouldn't VAT be charged on imports at same rate as would be if sold locally?

I think that is the theory but I don't think in reality that is what happens.

At moment don't have to pay VAT or import duty on goods imported from out of EU that cost less than £18. It's been a VAT loophole that Jersey's been using and there's been talk of closing for years. It seems the UK aren't too worried about closing this loophole - which is fine for them, but I don't think they've taken IoM into account.

 

Either there ought to be no VAT on CD and DVD purchases below £18 in IoM, or start charging import duty on this. (and there's no reason why the VAT agreement can't be amended by mutual consent). Sorry - to clear confusion - doesn't it make sense that VAT should be charged on imports at same rate as would be sold locally (whether at standard rate or zero rate)? How can decision to not close this loophole be justified?

 

Seems to me that maybe this loophole hasn't been closed because some very big fat cat operators are dong quite well out of it - like Tesco - and they have the ear of the government which lets them get away with this perk at the expense of domestic traders and small operations. But that's just me being cynical - maybe there's some awfully good reason why imports below £18 should be zero rated.

[MarcusAurelius]

I think you might find its slightly higher than 56% but why would a consultant paid by the government (us?) effectively point out that you're a mug and that your business is paying for everything. Hopefully the government might take note at contract renewal?

 

Just want to clarify , this consultant was commissioned by the DTi , but we ( the retailers who use his services and knowledge ) pay him , as far as I know anyway.

[Sebrof]

Shouldn't VAT be charged on imports at same rate as would be if sold locally?

I think that is the theory but I don't think in reality that is what happens.

At moment don't have to pay VAT or import duty on goods imported from out of EU that cost less than £18. It's been a VAT loophole that Jersey's been using and there's been talk of closing for years. It seems the UK aren't too worried about closing this loophole - which is fine for them, but I don't think they've taken IoM into account.

 

Either there ought to be no VAT on CD and DVD purchases below £18 in IoM, or start charging import duty on this. (and there's no reason why the VAT agreement can't be amended by mutual consent). Sorry - to clear confusion - doesn't it make sense that VAT should be charged on imports at same rate as would be sold locally (whether at standard rate or zero rate)? How can decision to not close this loophole be justified?

 

Seems to me that maybe this loophole hasn't been closed because some very big fat cat operators are dong quite well out of it - like Tesco - and they have the ear of the government which lets them get away with this perk at the expense of domestic traders and small operations. But that's just me being cynical - maybe there's some awfully good reason why imports below £18 should be zero rated.

 

VAT isn't charged on low value private imports for one simple reason - it's not worth the trouble to collect it. There is no conspiracy, and I am surprised at you, Skeddan.

 

Amazon will charge VAT on anything supplied from within the UK, and anything worth more than £18.00 from abroad, and so will all but the smallest foreign internet sites.

 

S