Resignations From Liberal Vannin

[Bobs]

OK , I live in spring valley and want to hire it for a christening for little david renaldo chavster. Where do I apply?

 

Call the rtown hall, pop into the club house or speak to your local councillor; their details are on the council website www.douglas.gov.im and they should be able to point you in the right direction. I hired the room at Nobles Park Pavillion recently and the town hall were very helpful

[Holy Paladin]

I agree, it was a lot off cash for a golf club..... still it is meant as a community facility as well.

 

still would the same decision be made now with a new Council and a tighter purse string.. I believe not....

[cheeky boy]

Councillors & commisioners should really be a footnote in history, they are a complete wast of time & money

 

Get the picture, we are a small nation with a population of 80,000

 

The same population as Stevenage

 

All functions of town councils & commisioners could be carried out by government departments without the additional cost & beaureocracy

[Skeddan]

Councillors & commisioners should really be a footnote in history, they are a complete wast of time & money

 

Get the picture, we are a small nation with a population of 80,000

 

The same population as Stevenage

and smaller population than the University of Wales, Indiana University, and Bologna University.

(and a much higher proportion of public employees than staff-student ratio in these universities)

[Holy Paladin]

I agree that we are only small, but would things be done in a democratic was and what if a singular government official was to gain over all power would this nor creat almost a dictator..?

 

If you check back on the minutes you may find that some councillors may have been against the golf club and sadly they did not have any control over the seagull as the Douglas Partnership is a seperate organisation, ok this is partly funded by Douglas corpy, but they have no control.

[Skeddan]

I agree that we are only small, but would things be done in a democratic was and what if a singular government official was to gain over all power would this nor creat almost a dictator..?

Who says it would then mean 'a singular government official' would be running things? Is Douglas Council the bastion of democracy in IoM - without which IoM would collapse into dictatorship?

 

Holy Paladin, could you perhaps answer some of the questions raised in the 'CCTV Cameras to be replaced' thread (in Local News). It seems £400,000 will be spent without any real business case, but just on flimsiest pretext on the say-so of the Leader of Douglas Town Council. (maybe 'Douglas Chief Patrician' would be a better term).

[%age]

Hmm, a few good points skeddan.

 

To link the thread back onto topic, I would suggest that the ex-Liberal Vannin councillors joined up in all good faith and rather than enter the political arena alone, they joined a political group with a recognised leader. That is fair enough and understandable.

 

It seems to me though, that David Christian as the big shot on Douglas Corporation, has placed himself as the preferable leader to go with. I don't want to sound trite but . . . . all those buffets and all that pampering eh.

 

Without the taxpayers'/ratepayers' money to lay on such events, Peter Karran and LV never stood a chance with these bright eyed folk.

 

Also, of the Liberal Vannin meetings I have attended, the agenda centred around Tynwald and the House of Keys (Big Bill MHK and Peter Karran MHK). So yes, I feel the local government representatives should have had more recognition.

[Holy Paladin]

Hi Skeddan and %age,

 

I suppose one off the leading values of a council is theer is 18 members plus the major in this case, and sadly even though David is declared the leader of the council, ie he is the chairman of the P&R commitee, he does not have singular control and all schemes, spendings etc, do have to go to council for agreement. as for the CCTV in principle its a good idea, but i also feel the government ie Dept of Home affairs should support this, not the rate payer.

 

The Lib Van meetings where centralised around HoK, not local Authority, the Douglas Councillors where told to attend their own meetings off wich theer where only 3 organised before their quitting, the problem rose that these where over the summer months and peopel where away, or had work commitments and so where only attended by one or two of the 4 at any one time, but the Councillors where in touch due to their being on Council Comitees etc.

 

So some may say that the letters and comments of exec commitee members where rather misleeding to try and pass blame for the reasons these people left from the fact they where a non democratic commmitee tpo the fact that not every coucillor or commisioner attended every meeting.

 

The issues of a local authority member is soooo different from a HoK elect, The Council do not have a life changing inpact, thoiugh they do effect lives in a smaller way (most the time) in my opinion.

 

Back to LV the main reason for this topic...

 

I think the people left fro as reason, they felt the [party was not for them, they felt the party was not being run correctly.. they exec did not like the way the people left , did not like their authority being questioned, so there is a argument off words that in hindsite, just often comes across as bitter.

[Holy Paladin]

%tage, you are still schemimg that David Christian has total control and basicly tells the Councill what to do,... IMO he does not, he is a very voacal and outstpoken memer of Council, yet as Chairman, very rarly can he decide a vote, I fact I hear that certain other councilllors are far more voval and talk a hell of a lot more rubbish than he does, but because they are not in the press or forseen as a godshite its ok.. IMO David though not always in the right way, does care for Douglas and those off us who sit here and judge and make comment etc should maybe try and do it ourselves sometime. I mean I don't seem to remember there being masses off candidates standing for the council, and who can blame them when all you get is criticism from the side lines.

 

so can you recognise anything the council actually did right for a change..?

[jehovah]

"Sadly , he does not have control of the council" At last your agenda is clear. He does not have control because that woulds not be democratic, simple and necessary.

Why should the taxpayer pay for CCTV in Douglas, it will benefit Douglas ratepayers only, they should pay, if they don't like it they can vote out the decision makers next election. By then it will be too late of course. David does seem a bit megelomanic in his ramblings. He is chair of P&R but that committee, as it is made up of the chairs of all other committees, is quite powerful and he can lead that committee where he likes. In this way it is acting as a political party with an agenda and goals. It is this lind of powerbase building, without accountability, LV is actively working to eradicate. OK if there is a mandate but in this case there is not.

Your last paragraph is interesting, the party was not for them, they left. It is not up to you to say whether it is run properly or not, you don't know how it is run. You do not know how the executive thought or whether they enjoyed any authority let alone didn't like being questioned. There is an argument ongoing of which you are not part. I suggest you leave it at that and allow the party to carry on with it's business as it wishes. It is nothing to do with you.

The situation seems to be that the LV party will continue and the Douglas councillors will also continue. The next election will tell how the public react.

[Holy Paladin]

P&R has more Power than the council...nahhhhhhhhhhhh i disagree..

 

and are you saying that I am advocating DC running Douglas..? far from it, i advocate only a democratic and responsible society..

 

Though i agree how the exec off lv is run, is only on my opinion undemocratic and i am merly expressing the believe of the LA members that left and their reasons why..

[jehovah]

I don't want a tennis match but, I did not say the P&R committee run the council, they are a powwerful committee and you can't deny that if you know anything about local politics.

I don't know DC personally but responded to your statements only. He may be a nice fella, unfortunately what is needed is a politician.

I would like to hear exactly why those that left LV did so, I don't accept that it is only about unelected exec members, they knew that when they joined and took the money, will they be paying back their loans?

[Holy Paladin]

Jehova, firstly it costs £10 to join LV, the only council that recieved fanancial help was Sara Hackman, who had desined her own manifesto, but was told she had to have the party one , even though she could have some at work printed up for free, she had to toe the party line and get the more expensive party ones that PK told her the party would pay for, Steve Babb paid £500 of his own money to have his and the other Onchan LV candidates manifesto printed, did he ask LV for this back, the LV candidates that did not get elected, and never seemed to appear at any meeting ie Inkerman Farager (no relation to John faragher) did they get asked for the money back..? IMO this is just a diversery tactic by PK to throw stones etc and try and digredit the people who left. The other Coucilors did not have to stand for a election and so did not have manifesto's or any printing etc, and since Sara is a single mum off 2, who works 2 jobs to keep the wolf from the door, its a bit low off PK to go on and on about it.

 

as far as i am led to believe teh rot as we shall call it set in when the Councillors where asked to make a democratic decision on how they would vote on the issue of the Mayor being elected, when she had not been voted on as a councillor. During a meeting with PK , Bill M, the Councillors and the infamouse Helen callow (you may ask why was she at a LV meeting, when she is not an LV member and is often seen as a very disruptive, rude and unwelcoem person, if you do not know her, she is the pigeon lady that owns a antique shop opposite Jabbawokeez and feeds the pigeons outside) well the members came to a group decision on how they would vote, at which time PK lost his temper and started shouting, that they should vote the other way, is that democracy or dictatorship,...?

 

it was also later found out that PK had already told a excisting Councillor R Chatel, how the LV members would vote, THE DAY BEFORE the meeting, sadly he had forgotten one major issue in doing this......that these people had their own minds, this seemed to be the seed off doubt in these peoples minds, also the fact that the very heart off any party is the constitution, this is not adhered too, there where conflicting messages as to when and if an election of the executive would be held, it was later confirmed by Kate B there would be no election at the ANNUAL conference, even though at the first meeting after Bill M , at the RAF Club John Faragher asked the question on election and was told by Nigel Dobson in the presence off Peter K and Kate B, and Roy Redmayne, that there would be an election at the conference, a answer that was later reversed, and in email Nigel D admitted said he had "made a mistake" why was he not corrected on the night and why has he out in a letter to the Examiner today saying that the LA Members where never told there would be an election,..? IMO that lying.. so maybe you see where the peopel who left are coming from,

 

you have to ask.... Would you trust anything the Executive said after that..? Would you feel like you even had a choice on what you voted on..?

 

Sultan - I am talking solely about the new Councillors as they had no control over decisions made before they where even councillors in may !!! as fro sitting scrathing there asses with pencils and eating custard dreams.. they infact use pens and eat sausage rolls from the free buffett they missed the day before,,, maybe you should attend the next Council meeting on wednesday as is your god given right and then make judgement on what does and doesnot go on..

[Holy Paladin]

ps The Douglas Development is a partly funded seperate entity, also funded by government and Local Business, but I agree in my own opinion it is also somewhat a waste off monbey, but then again my opinion is a totally uneducated one, as i really have no idea what DD does and what it has or has not achieved apart from the the stupid giant seagull, but I will investigate.

 

Jehova, please elaborate on what exactly a politician is in context to Douglas ouncil..?

 

HP

[Holy Paladin]

Sultan, that is a rather childish response, as how many off then do you actually know..?