[BBC News] Track biking prompts complaints

[John]

my only issue is , its a green way, ie a Green path or road (I stand corrected) but if we start putting gravel etc everywhere, it is no longer a green path and it looks IMO bad.

[islandbiker]

All,

I must apologise for my rant before you read this below, but it is blatantly obvious that some people who are commenting don’t have a clue about the use or the state of the lanes.

 

First I would like to say that as normal this is directed at the bike's, Bike's are NOT the only user of the track's.

 

As a regular motorbike user of the green lanes I have to agree that the tracks are being damaged more and more each year.

Yes something has to be done to Reduce the impact, but it's not just the bikers, it is down to 4X4's , farmers and WATER damage & no one maintaining them.

 

When we get it in the neck for damaging the lane's it is a little unfair, I don’t doubt that some people do try to repair damage.

Shit3hawk, It is unfair to have a pop at enduro man, he brings money to the island and he takes the guys out so that is an element of control on were these guy's go, thus stopping illegal riding so give him some credit.

 

We go out and I cant remember having a bad word of anyone, be it horse riders or walkers, but some of the latter need to have more respect for us, it is a two way road you know…!!!

 

However talking to people who have used these lanes longer than myself, the Government / the moaners / friends of the earth type that don’t ever use the tracks . ! Dog walkers (well they have much more to go at than we do and we don’t leave SH__! Every wear for someone else to deal with). In my opinion made things worse, with regards to a few things below,

 

1, Reduced the available tracks, the effect is more people both Uk and IOM are using limited track's thus more damage.

2, DOT close tracks to work on, or so they say and don’t do any work and make the tracks worse, Gravel roads increase speed. (pipe line)

3, I see increased four wheel drive use, they rip the green lanes up far more that we ever could, see you tube (isle of man green lanes, I think)

4, The tracks aren't maintained by anyone, it's only when someone complains it becomes an issue & every tom ,dick and harry jump on the bandwagon.

5, The tracks are poorly defined, so visitors will go off on to unofficial tracks, It only takes one track in the ground and more people will use it.

6, Tracks are closed over the winter, is this the right time ? How can they be worked upon ?

 

Its very easy to grumble on (above) but if something is not done. No one will be able to use the lanes.

 

What would you do to fix it ?

 

1, Regulate the use more patrols.

2, Close tracks but open unused ones so we have some wear to go.

3, Create 1 or 2 enduro tracks for people to use.

4, Isle of man government actively working on the tracks, let's face it they are happy to promote David Knight but are unwilling to put any efforts into maintenance.

5, Clearly defined tracks, maybe a green lane guide.

[Frances]

The acknowledgement by a biker that the greenroads are deteriorating (at an increased rate?) is welcome - the walkers have a long established Footpaths conservation group (eg see http://www.manxfootpath.org/taskforce.htm) - maybe the bikers who do considerably more damage than walkers, might consider forming such an organisation - bad drainage is in some places used by farmers as a deterent to walkers - poor drainage combined with powered vehicles rapidly strips any thin topsoil off slopes - the deep tracks providing powerful sluices to wash away and widen the rut following heavy rain.The damage to the surface can be seen on the snaefell slopes which is not an authorised greenlane but seens well used by such.

 

The DTI is normally fairly responsive to comments though sometimes it seems to prefer a softly-softly approach approach to landowners who in several cases are breaking the law by blocking an established right of way

[Slim]

The DTI is normally fairly responsive to comments though sometimes it seems to prefer a softly-softly approach approach to landowners who in several cases are breaking the law by blocking an established right of way

 

The mountain bike crowd seem to have a good relationship with the authorities too, resulting in well maintained trails through the plantations.

 

This kind of voluntary assistance is probably the best way for bikers to avoid a total ban, but I bet they won't be arsed.

[victor]

The DTI is normally fairly responsive to comments though sometimes it seems to prefer a softly-softly approach approach to landowners who in several cases are breaking the law by blocking an established right of way

 

The mountain bike crowd seem to have a good relationship with the authorities too, resulting in well maintained trails through the plantations.

 

This kind of voluntary assistance is probably the best way for bikers to avoid a total ban, but I bet they won't be arsed.

do you volunteer to fix the roads you already pay tax to drive/ride on.people seem to lose track of the fact these so called green lanes are public roads,you have to be taxed and insured to ride them.

[ponderer]

The fact that even bikers are admitting that the conditions of the tracks are getting worse simply underlines how bad it is getting.

 

You don't see bike or 4x4 tracks ruining the walking country in the Lakes or other national parks in England, Scotland or Wales.

 

So why is more not done to learn from other countries and protect the Manx hills?

[SteveP]

I thought there was a weight limit of 500kg on Manx greenlanes?

 

I can't think of many 4x4 vehicles (or than quad bikes maybe?) that are under this limit.

[victor]

The fact that even bikers are admitting that the conditions of the tracks are getting worse simply underlines how bad it is getting.

 

You don't see bike or 4x4 tracks ruining the walking country in the Lakes or other national parks in England, Scotland or Wales.

 

So why is more not done to learn from other countries and protect the Manx hills?

As already stated these greenways are roads ,not footpaths,there are hundreds of miles of footpaths all over the hills and glens on the island to walk on,so why insist on walking on the same tracks utilised by motorcyclists,then go on to moan about them.walk elsewhere

[wideload]

i cant see why bikes are being victimized on this subject, i'm sure there would be similar amounts of damage on a track if it was a hundred bikes or a hundred horses.

 

Wouldn't it make sense to open up as many tracks as is practicable and rotate their usage (for all users) so they can "heal"? (vague memorys of crop rotation from GCSE geography creeping back)

[Silentbob]

They did close certain tracks (Hairy Hill a few years ago, put a gate up in the middle of nowhere, no walls, just a gate on a hill, was very funny to look at) when they start to get eroded to give them chance to recover. I have seen the scary videos of the 4x4 club of old hacking down trees to get past and digging huge holes when they get stuck; it stopped me from signing up with them for years.

 

 

BUT.... I am reliably informed that the 4x4 club now is a lot more involved in the upkeep of the tracks.

 

Aside from the Remeberance day run, the impact of motorcycles on our tracks is very limited, most damage occurs when a vehicle gets stuck, and bikes rarely do.

[gazza]

my pannys worth on it,

 

the reason bikes and quads are getting the bad name is because there doing most of the damage,

yes 4x4 do a bit but it is mostly the bikes

 

michael mountain is one such place that it is clear for it to be seen why bikes are getting a bad name,

 

i have seen in the past 5 years the 2 tracks that take u around one side and one that takes u to ballugh end

how bad it is getting, and an utter nightmare trying to get across them with a quad, some of them are so bad now that u can lose a quad tyre in them and the rest of it

 

the track to ballugh when i was first up there was about a quad wide, now it is about in places 4 cars wide,

as thay keep going wider and wider to keep out of the ruts,

 

also god knows how many of them decide to go off the greenlanes and make there own tracks on the hill,

you can see these from the tracks vary well, but there is a group that is going up there and just useing the hill as there own play area,

 

while yes its the bikes that are causeing most of this damage, and are getting the blame for it, is it there fault,

there allowed to use the tracks and on a nice day u see a lot out there, but thay may be makeing the damage, but its the dot that is not fixeing them that is at fault, thay never do any repairs to them,

yes now and again the main rd over the hill will be redone but them 2 tracks off it are never touched, and its a right mess,

 

But on a note any bikes i ever met up there all seam to slow down when thay meet somebody on the rd,

[Slim]

do you volunteer to fix the roads you already pay tax to drive/ride on.people seem to lose track of the fact these so called green lanes are public roads,you have to be taxed and insured to ride them.

 

 

Oh get real, the roads are used by thousands, so justify the time and money. I wouldn't expect my road tax to be spent on maintaining greenways that only a few people use.

 

If the mountain bike people can do it, why can't the motoring people?

 

Oh, topical:

http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/bicy...OURCE=BRGENNEWS

 

Certain us forestry authorities starting to differentiate between cycle use and motorcycle use. Could be the future if motorcyclists don't sort their act out.

[Crystal]

do you volunteer to fix the roads you already pay tax to drive/ride on.people seem to lose track of the fact these so called green lanes are public roads,you have to be taxed and insured to ride them.

 

 

Oh get real, the roads are used by thousands, so justify the time and money. I wouldn't expect my road tax to be spent on maintaining greenways that only a few people use.

 

If the mountain bike people can do it, why can't the motoring people?

 

Oh, topical:

http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/bicy...OURCE=BRGENNEWS

 

Certain us forestry authorities starting to differentiate between cycle use and motorcycle use. Could be the future if motorcyclists don't sort their act out.

[Cret]

As an occasional green lane biker myself I believe that yes the damage is done by bikers AND other groups, but being honest I think mainly by some bikers being irresponsible.

 

For instance I don't ride along greenlanes like I'm doing an enduro race or motocross but I've certainly seen people doing it. There's a limit of 20 mph on some tracks, I can't recall if that's a 'suggested limit' or a definite one offhand, but if people stuck to this, and only went on the open ground ones when the conditions were suitable the damage would be a tiny fraction of what it is. I'm not saying other groups don't damage them, as I'm sure they do, but not to the same extent.

 

Some of the tracks are hard ground and you can happily go along them in the crappest weather without causing a mess as long as you don't go like a loony, but the ones that are on open hills will get churned up to buggery in no time when they are soaking wet and dozens of dirt bikes are wheelspinning their way over them each day.

It's common sense not to really use them under such conditions, or even just to go gently, but a lot of people can't seem to see that.

Even then, if they are in good nick and you ride sensibly you can pretty much do so without really leaving any sign you've been there but lots of people just nail the throttle and proceed with a rooster tail of dirt flying behind them. If it's already muddy & mangled, going over it again ain't going to help.

 

If you want to ride a dirt bike in an agressive, balls out "look at me, I'm full of testosterone and dead hard" way like that then take up motocross etc. I have no interest in competing with people on bikes because I have a fundamental dislike of broken bones, and don't have anything to prove, but it seems that a lot of people treat the green lanes like an extension of the racetracks. Feel free to call me a fanny or add in chicken noises etc but I'd rather use them sensibly and keep them intact so that I can keep doing that in years to come.

 

Not sure what the answer is other than common sense, and getting people to be a bit more responsible but we all know this is unlikely to work as there are always people who don't give a shit about spoiling things for others.

 

Just my opinion for what it's worth.

[TomTucker]

as far as i am aware the Remembrance Run officially stopped about 5-10years ago as it caused too much damage and was too popular with the local bikers.

 

It would be pointless running the event now as the high mountain tracks (Ballaragh, Sky Hill, Slieau Dhoo, Slieau Feranne) are all closed for winter from Oct 31st till March / April.

 

On the issue of bikes causing damage i agree that this is very evident on the above mentioned tracks and i think the only solution is to add hardcore gravel to the worse areas regularly and foot bridges to the impassible areas like skyhill has so that people on foot can get through the bogs. This could and should be paid for partly by road tax (as enduro bikes require road tax they spend all their time off road so they too deserve to have their "roads" looked after) and partly by the same fund that keeps the glens and forests in an orderly and safe condition.

 

The rest of the tracks on the island are unfortunately not as popular as these wide open upland tracks as they tend to attract more sedate riders who struggle with rocky or hilly terrain and therefore get more use than the tougher tracks in the south of the island. They are also the main through route from douglas to ramsey and back.

 

Motorcyclists may not be keen to fix tracks (or build illegal structures in plantations ) like mountain bikers but motorcyclists are an accepting lot and generally dont want to spoil anyone elses fun either.

 

Noone ever complains about that Doorish Cashen being in poor repair, that the Pipeline has been shut for many a year with no sign of re opening and that now Ballacuburragh has been shut its a job to get from one side of the island to the other without a lengthy road ride.

 

All this while 1000s of acres of Plantation and heather sit doing nothing that could easily be put to use for recreation for horses, enduro and trials riders, mountain bikers and walkers whilst generating ROI for IoM Gov.