Baby P

[La_Dolce_Vita]

Social Services turn on anyone who reports abuse and Family Court Judges protect Paediphiles and condone violence.

 

How so?

[Chinahand]

people here have completely misunderstood my reasons for coming on this site, ie to see if there was anyone else out there needed our help and to get people talking and thinking about what is happening under their noses.

 

W4J you have done far more than that, you have made exaggerated claims, you've named private individuals and accused them of the most henious crimes etc.

 

If you want to make a case here you have gone totally the wrong way about it.

 

You come over as a group with an axe to grind.

 

I feel you have not been professional or honest in your communications and have tried to give yourselves an authority you do not have.

 

No professional journalist would work the way you have.

 

Basically I would totally start again - abandon your log in, start a new website - .co.uk isn't a good site for an IOM lobby group - plus your focus on women is unfair - "parents4justice" maybe, but probably more relevent "justice4children". It is a shame you've seriously damaged your brand, but quite simply I think you have.

 

I have no idea if there are serious issues with Child Services on the Island - but the way you have attempted to say there are is alienating and I for one do not find them helpful in getting to the bottom of the issue.

 

I imagine the types of issues Child Services deal with result in very strong emotions, and the impression you have created in my mind is of someone who feels wronged by the system and who is lashing out.

 

If you have been wronged I wish you luck in seeking justice, but your manner and language do not create an image of a professional, unbiased attempt to do that.

 

Stop writing in capitals, stop making claims like "Social Services turn on anyone who reports abuse", stop accusing the authorities of helping paedophiles: - behaving like that isn't going to convince anyone.

[Miss Take]

As usual chinahand puts it way better than I'm capable of.

[bluemonday]

It amazes me that obscene language and unqualified angst is rife on here, but common sense and open mindedness or even concern that things may not be quite right for innocent kids on the Island are met with hostility

 

Not at all, read CH post above.

 

Coming on here and influencing people to act on issues requires you to be able to present a credible point of view presented in a manner that will engage even the most sceptical.

Lecturing/hectoring anyone who dares question your viewpoint does not impress.

Initially I was prepared to listen, now I'm rapidly loosing interest in your blustering.

 

You're not advancing your case and if you continue in the vein you've persued thus far, the cause you espouse will not benefit.

 

Regarding your comparison on Baby P and here, the salient point is that the case in the UK is being dissected/publicy debated after a trial and conviction and the actions not taken are now rightly under the scope.

 

For what its worth, I have reservations/doubts on child protection ( and many other ''vulnerable' areas ) and questions of official impartiality and indeed competence on the IOM.

The rock is indeed lacking in not a few areas.

 

But your attitude isn't engaging me nor I suspect many others.

[women4justice.co.uk]

It amazes me that obscene language and unqualified angst is rife on here, but common sense and open mindedness or even concern that things may not be quite right for innocent kids on the Island are met with hostility

 

Not at all, read CH post above.

 

Coming on here and influencing people to act on issues requires you to be able to present a credible point of view presented in a manner that will engage even the most sceptical.

Lecturing/hectoring anyone who dares question your viewpoint does not impress.

Initially I was prepared to listen, now I'm rapidly loosing interest in your blustering.

 

You're not advancing your case and if you continue in the vein you've persued thus far, the cause you espouse will not benefit.

 

Regarding your comparison on Baby P and here, the salient point is that the case in the UK is being dissected/publicy debated after a trial and conviction and the actions not taken are now rightly under the scope.

 

For what its worth, I have reservations/doubts on child protection ( and many other ''vulnerable' areas ) and questions of official impartiality and indeed competence on the IOM.

The rock is indeed lacking in not a few areas.

 

But your attitude isn't engaging me nor I suspect many others.

OK. So what do you suggest? I have not used this forum before so perhaps there is a learning curve involved. From the minute I opened my mouth I was attacked and disbelieved over a very serious issue. Perhaps that is the norm but if someone assaults me verbally I do have to fight my corner. I have been accused of being BNP which I am not, of being a do gooder, also not true and of creating a fairy story, very far from the truth.

My motives, albeit greatly misunderstood were to speak out for people who cannot in order to elicit support and maybe to get people to question. FPU is sadly very lacking and yes there was a conviction on Baby P, but the person who tried to say there was a problem who might have saved Peter was harrassed, threatened and bullied. Surely it is better to bring these things into the open whilst something can still be done, rather than after an innocent child has died?

Yes, there is anger behind what I write too because I have seen victims of abuse on the Island being disbelieved by the system when they have tried to get help and that does anger me. Especially when it places them in a position where they can only come out when they are adults. Look at the eightees when Marshall who was at the time working at the Childrens' centre was brought to trial and convicted. He had abused three boys in his care and they were not able to find a voice until they were adults having already suffered years of abuse.

If you were in support of what i was saying and are now not then that is regrettable. Unfortunately I can only speak as I find and so far there is little compassion out there and a great deal of angst.

I can only reiterate that my intentions are not to inflame but to inform and educate where perhaps people may be in the dark and to hope that they will at least open there eyes to where potential problems lie in the hope of doing something before it is too late. I am not speaking without knowledge from the inside.

[women4justice.co.uk]

Social Services turn on anyone who reports abuse and Family Court Judges protect Paediphiles and condone violence.

 

How so?

 

Try reporting abuse on the Island and you will find that the reaction is one of suspicion if you are a woman/mother. If you are a man it will be a different result. I know this from at least five people. One woman's child was battered by her ex partner and when she went to the police she was disbelieved even though the child ended up in hospital. Her witnesses were discredited in Court and the father is now on the way to getting custody of the child. This is just one example but there are more.

[Jimcalagon]

Women4Justice - I would like to help you in your quest for justice but sadly I'm a man and, I presume, not particularly interested in stuff like that.

[bluemonday]

OK. So what do you suggest?

Attributed to Buddha - “Thousands of candles can be lit from a single candle" ( just part of the actual saying )

[jimbms]

Women4Justice you keep spouting off all these claims yet continue to refuse to show your evidence for one single event you have mentioned, with all this there is every reason for people here to consider you a liar and a shit stirrer. So either prove what you are ranting on about with real facts that people can check or go spout your one woman campaign elsewhere, it's time to either piss or got off the pot.

[women4justice.co.uk]

Women4Justice - I would like to help you in your quest for justice but sadly I'm a man and, I presume, not particularly interested in stuff like that.

Not at all! this site is to help women who are suffering , but that does not mean that there are not plenty of men who have suffered. Perhaps the name was ill chosen but it was a group of women who got together and decided they had to find a voice and there has been plenty of Fathers 4 Justice publicity so perhaps it was time to redress the balance.

 

 

Good on you for being a man and saying that....so long as it is not tongue in cheek!

[women4justice.co.uk]

Women4Justice you keep spouting off all these claims yet continue to refuse to show your evidence for one single event you have mentioned, with all this there is every reason for people here to consider you a liar and a shit stirrer. So either prove what you are ranting on about with real facts that people can check or go spout your one woman campaign elsewhere, it's time to either piss or got off the pot.

Try Marshall, worked at the children's centre was convicted of abusing three children in his care who were not heard until they were all adults, went to jail and served time but the kids were powerless until they were old enough to be heard. Was publicised in Manx Press. Info given to me by someone else who worked at children's centre.

 

Cannot and will not publish names of abused children in the IOM for obvious reasons! They are already at risk.

Can only ask you to trust that what I am saying is true. It is up to you whether you choose to believe it or not. The facts remain regardless and this will come into the public domain via the press before too long if you are patient.

[women4justice.co.uk]

Women4Justice you keep spouting off all these claims yet continue to refuse to show your evidence for one single event you have mentioned, with all this there is every reason for people here to consider you a liar and a shit stirrer. So either prove what you are ranting on about with real facts that people can check or go spout your one woman campaign elsewhere, it's time to either piss or got off the pot.

Try Marshall, worked at the children's centre was convicted of abusing three children in his care who were not heard until they were all adults, went to jail and served time but the kids were powerless until they were old enough to be heard. Was publicised in Manx Press. Info given to me by someone else who worked at children's centre.

 

Cannot and will not publish names of abused children in the IOM for obvious reasons! They are already at risk.

Can only ask you to trust that what I am saying is true. It is up to you whether you choose to believe it or not. The facts remain regardless and this will come into the public domain via the press before too long if you are patient.

We are talking about a case that was around the eightees so you will have to do your research in the archives, sad to say nothing has changed.

 

Two kids died in care....much publicised failure of social services. Supposedly huge shake up of system afterwards.....sadly nothing has changed.

[The Voice of Reason]

and there has been plenty of Fathers 4 Justice publicity so perhaps it was time to redress the balance.

 

I don't think it's a case of redressing the balance, there have been injustices perpetrated against both fathers and mothers. One is not necessarily at the expense of the other. You may have good intentions but your histrionics and unsubstantiated allegations do your cause no favours.

[women4justice.co.uk]

and there has been plenty of Fathers 4 Justice publicity so perhaps it was time to redress the balance.

 

I don't think it's a case of redressing the balance, there have been injustices perpetrated against both fathers and mothers. One is not necessarily at the expense of the other. You may have good intentions but your histrionics and unsubstantiated allegations do your cause no favours.

So were back to calling women hysterical or histrionic when they speak out against injustice and tell the truth. How feeble and how typical of someone who may consider themselves the voice of reason, but hasn't a clue really what they are saying. Talk about missing the point! I did not say one was at the expense of another. But I am starting to think there are few people worth communicating with here who actual have something valid to say other than jsut to slight me because I will not place children at risk by naming names which should be fairly obvious to any intelligent being.

As for naming names I already said look at the case of Marshall, children's centre, proven case....so there you go you have a name and evidence and a conviction...happy now.

[The Voice of Reason]

Social Services turn on anyone who reports abuse and Family Court Judges protect Paediphiles and condone violence.

 

I'm really not sure you are capable of reasoned argument. You probably think Prince Phillip destroyed the Twin Towers and President Bush murdered Princess Di.

 

The last thing anyone on here would ask you to do is name children who you think may have been abused.

 

You obviously have great passion about the subject of abused children. Please put that passion to good use and offer practical help rather than trying to alienate those who are sympathetic to your cause (the majority of people , myself included).