oldmanxfella Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Looking at it cynically where do churches raise their money from - births, marriages and deaths. They want new recruits that they can make a few quid on at least three times in their lives not just once. I've always thought that's why they are anti gay. Its all about money - a church full of same sex couples no births no marriages just a few quid to bury every 80 years or so! If you look at it that way, you wouldn't have celibate priests- you'd set them procreation targets. Not really the inverse applies to priests - its often a socially acceptable away of keeping your parisioners children in the closet. Sign them up for the priesthood and no questions ever asked again! Well he never married Mrs O'Flanagan he devoted his life to Jesus! (I am being cynical before anyone gets really offended) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sebrof Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 I assume this doesn't include when his priests fuck choirboys Nothing outmoded about that, sadly. S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Smelly Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Gay people are born gay it aint a sickness or phase just accept we are all different its the only way to have a happy life. I don't agree that gay people are born gay, and don't think people are born straight either. But it is not illness, thank god we have got past that one, So do you think becoming gay can happen at any age? The gay guys i know have always said they knew they were different i.e from their str8 friends. Is it like finding religon it just happens? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Gay people are born gay it aint a sickness or phase just accept we are all different its the only way to have a happy life. I don't agree that gay people are born gay, and don't think people are born straight either. But it is not illness, thank god we have got past that one, So do you think becoming gay can happen at any age? The gay guys i know have always said they knew they were different i.e from their str8 friends. Is it like finding religon it just happens? First of all you have to distinguish between what being gay is (recognising yourself as a gay person and identifying with those things that are gay and the fact of having nothing more than an attraction to someone of the same sex. What is certain is that people cannot be straight or gay when they are born because before people become sexual beings we cannot express ourselves sexually. And gay and straight are sexual identities, they do not simply mean that someone who likes people of the same sex and vice versa. Both terms are loaded full of additional meaning. If you say that someone was born with a predisposition to be attracted to people of their own sex then that may be valid. I am not a proponent of that argument as I do not believe the process of being attracted to someone is something that we can put down to out genes, I think it is far more complex than that. I think genes may influence this but not be the sole factor in determining who is attracted to who. Hope that wasn't a bit boring there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knoxville Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 I think its genes, as we were made to populate. If we were born gay, then no one would be here. So its down to something thats happened with your genes, as something must have happened in the past. Were cave men gay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 I think its genes, as we were made to populate. If we were born gay, then no one would be here. So its down to something thats happened with your genes, as something must have happened in the past. Were cave men gay? That would appear to be a contradiction. If it is about the genes and we were meant to populate or do you mean procreate then why are the genes coding for a behaviour that leads to no procreation? If we were all born GAY then nobody would be here but gay identity and sexuality is a social construct. Heterosexuals people and homosexual people are not constants through history. In a way it would be wrong to go back through time and label someone a homosexual or a heterosexual as such sexualities did not exist then. From what can be seen in history, homosexuality goes back a long way. But it seems you are getting very mixed up with what the term gay means. Gay does not just mean someone who fancy people of the same sex. What you may mean is to ask whether cave MEN or WOMEN fancied each other. But to say they were gay would be ridiculous. The term gay only turned up in the 1950s. And the very idea of there being separate beings to normal people came about in the 19th century. In effect, science created homosexuals and thus gay people. Prior to that people were not perceived as being one of two sexualities, as being separated by a sexuality. It just wasn't a concept that existed. Straight sexuality would never exist if it was not for the creation of gay sexuality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knoxville Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Poss mix up of DNA changed over time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Poss mix up of DNA changed over time? Explain...don't understand what you mean. It sounds like what you are describing is a mutation, is this what you mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knoxville Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Poss mix up of DNA changed over time? Explain...don't understand what you mean. It sounds like what you are describing is a mutation, is this what you mean? Well yeah, why would there be man and women who are made to breed. Why aren't we A sexual. So it must be a mix up or mutation of DNA over time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Ayres Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Look folks. The pope is a liar, all catholic priests are liars and every leader of a religion throughout time is /was a liar. Jesus was a liar, his mother and father were liars and all their friends. The followers were/are all deluded. Every person that believes in any religion is deluded., some are liars as well. Why does anyone take any notice or get excited by what these liars say? FFS get a life, tell the pope to fuck off and take all the rest with him. As for homosexuals, they're real, I know some, unlike god, who doesn't exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knoxville Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Look folks. The pope is a liar, all catholic priests are liars and every leader of a religion throughout time is /was a liar. Jesus was a liar, his mother and father were liars and all their friends. The followers were/are all deluded. Every person that believes in any religion is deluded., some are liars as well.Why does anyone take any notice or get excited by what these liars say? FFS get a life, tell the pope to fuck off and take all the rest with him. As for homosexuals, they're real, I know some, unlike god, who doesn't exist. That time of the month is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Ayres Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Look folks. The pope is a liar, all catholic priests are liars and every leader of a religion throughout time is /was a liar. Jesus was a liar, his mother and father were liars and all their friends. The followers were/are all deluded. Every person that believes in any religion is deluded., some are liars as well.Why does anyone take any notice or get excited by what these liars say? FFS get a life, tell the pope to fuck off and take all the rest with him. As for homosexuals, they're real, I know some, unlike god, who doesn't exist. That time of the month is it? Hardly, genetics are all wrong. I just don't see why we bother giving oxygen to this crap every day. Not only do we give it room but we allow them to try to govern us. A bishop in parliament, why? what earthly good has he ever done to humanity, he lives off society by perpetuating the myth and relying on the situation where his organisation has everybody so scared of their own humanity and death, they will do anything, including paying his living, to avoid it. 'Life after death' don't be stupid, where would you go, who would supply the power? Think of the resources wasted keeping these leeches around. As for saying people get comfort, they make it possible by all the lies and scaring the shit out of old people and kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lao Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 well its all going swimingly here isn't it? thought i would just add these for those interested. http://www.whywontgodhealamputees.com/ im not trying to spread propaganda (honest) simply trying to adress the imbalance left from the popes one-sided rant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
immortalpuppet Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 The programme where John Barrowman tried to find out why he was gay was interesting, he looked at several explanations by different studies and found that there is overwhelming proof that people are born Gay rather than a childhood moulding the person to be homosexual. I agree that its not the sole factor but it does seem that genetics play a big part in if you are gay or not. one claim was a bit worrying though, they were looking at a link between the more brothers a person has means the more likley that the person will turn out gay due to the lack of testosterone being able to be produced. The claiments did only say the study was true in 30% of researched cases though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 The programme where John Barrowman tried to find out why he was gay was interesting, he looked at several explanations by different studies and found that there is overwhelming proof that people are born Gay rather than a childhood moulding the person to be homosexual. I agree that its not the sole factor but it does seem that genetics play a big part in if you are gay or not. one claim was a bit worrying though, they were looking at a link between the more brothers a person has means the more likley that the person will turn out gay due to the lack of testosterone being able to be produced. The claiments did only say the study was true in 30% of researched cases though. Well I can say with complete confidence that nobody is born gay. As I have just said being gay is not just about attracted to people of the same sex, the meaning is far more expansive than that, it is a sexuality. And the same goes for the meaning of straight. When someone says they are straight, the person hearing that does not simply take in that that person is attracted to the people of the opposite sex but also recognises that that person identifies with other people who call themselves straight. And those people have particular behaviours and a particular identity and culture. All this surrounds the terms gay and straight. If genetics really do predispose I cannot be gay until I have formed a sexual identity for myself, and this happens when one becomes sexually 'aware'. Sexuality is something that is formed as we grow up. And ones sexuality is heavily informed by the gender behaviours that a person performs, and gender is also a social construct. It is quite misleading for these scientists to use the term gay. It completely strips the term of all its associated meanings. And this is why I am so sceptical of these studies and cynical of the reason behind why they have made. These scientists are straight men who pose the question "Why do gay people exist" or "What makes people gay". But such a question is heterosexist. It comes from the position of placing a normative value on one group of sexual behaviour and asks why the Other is there. And this does mimic the way homosexuality is perceived, homosexuality is not seen to be normal in the sense that straight people believe that being straight is the 'right' way to be or the 'natural' way to be. Again, this is heterosexist. I would be far more impressed if scientists actually did a study where they wanted to look at how people become sexually attracted to each other. What is it that codes for sexual attractiveness? But I don't have to be a geneticist to recognise that how people become attracted to one another is a very complex thing. Is it the way someone behaves, how handsome they are, how they treat you, etc. How does genetics come into any of those things. Yet the scientists see this dichtomy of gay and straight, they see one as being abnormal and they want to get to bottom of it by doing studies on people who are either gay or straight. It seems all the more ridiculous when one considers that gay and straight are socially constructed sexualities. There was no such thing as gay and straight people 200 years ago. Just people who had sex. Some had sex with people of the same sex very often. And sometimes they were given names such as Molly but they were not perceived to be separate beings from everyone else. Science has, however, created these beings and created this dichotomy where it did not exist before. So the idea of perceived sexuality as this stark split that has always existed between two sorts of people is utterly wrong. And the fact that people do not tend to strictly abide by the sexual behaviours of either gay or straight shows how there are problems with perceiving people in this way. And going back to gender and the Pope's arguments against gender theory. There are many many people who simply do not conform to the gender stereotypes that exist in society. Just as with sexuality, there is this idea that there are male and female behaviours and roles that a man and woman should perform. But this just isn't the way that people are. But to finish and stop wittering on. People are not born GAY or STRAIGHT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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