Bananaman Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 If the child has an interest in other languages, that is a bonus. Slightly off topic, but it is quite amazing how much sign language and spanish my 3 year old has learned/picked up from watching 'Something Special' and 'Dora the Explorer' respectively. Considering he doesn't watch that much telly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Do you not think that before considering Manx kindergartens, more emphasis should be placed on what are really more useful languages. Let Manx be available to learn, but maybe not enforced. I think it rather 'nice' to maintain the language and is an interesting activity to learn. I also accept that much can be gained. But I am very cynical of any ambitions to make such things compulsory. I suspect that much of the effort is to bring back a dying language largely to restore Manxness for its sake, but this seem a process of reification. Bilingual Manx/English kindergartens have been up and running for quite a few years now. The language is not compulsory anywhere, and there is no desire for this to happen. Compulsory Irish has done the language no favours in Ireland, and the traditional compulsory French in the English school system has also had a dubious impact. I'm glad you think it 'nice' that Manx is being maintained. Whilst that might be the initial motivation for people to learn a few words, ultimately that is not enough of a reason to continue on to fluency. If you knew what an amazing language Gaelic is, and could appreciate how it describes the world you would understand why people fall in love with it. Some people have the attitude that learning any language at all is good, except Manx. Others believe that if only we could go back to the days before the Tower of Babel then we would all live in peace and harmony. I, probably because of my experiences learning Manx, strongly believe in tolerance for linguistic and cultural diversity. The loss of a language is the loss of collective history and culture, and bilingualism teaches tolerance for that diversity. In Oklahoma there is a an English Only school policy that means that Native American Pawnee and Sioux schools are not eligible for state funding. The French have a similar 'French is the language of the Republic' policy, so Breton, Flemish, Basque, Alsatian, Catalan, Corsican, and Occitan schools struggle to get any funding. Mandarin Chinese is the compulsory language of instruction in Tibetan secondary schools. You will find the same attitude of 'why don't you learn a useful language' used against speakers of the Aztec languages in Mexico, Welsh speakers in Wales, Gaelic speakers in Scotland, Hawaiian speakers in Hawaii, and Maori speakers in New Zealand - despite 99% of these people being completely bi-lingual in the dominant language of the state they live in. The human brain is perfectly capable of learning more than one language. I want to ask you to be tolerant and enjoy the great diversity of human expression - but judging from your posts you may be too infected with the 'one culture from here to the Urals' mentality of socialism that really wants to limit expression to a monotonous repetition of political mantra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman2 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Like learning Chinese (Mandarin). I find it very difficult to differentiate between 's' and 'x', and to understand the four tones. No matter how much I try and copy my friend. its easy .. answer is E .. see sex is the same in any language.. on a side note to MDO .. sex is also better with a partner.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman2 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 If the child has an interest in other languages, that is a bonus. The structure can differ quite a bit, for instance "half past seven" in English is "half to eight" in German. In England if you move from one area to another, place names never seem to be pronounced the way they look, and that is not just down to whether you speak English - dialectual differences come into play. I find it very amusing hearing people trying to pronounce place names that they are not accustomed to. Manx place names are problematic to many - Ballaugh becomes Balla Ugh, and so on. A bit of tutoring in Manx helps enormously if you want to fit in, to learn the roots of the words - Snaefell being Snow Maountain, Laxey is Salmon River, and so on, which to me makes the places more interesting. In Wales Pwllheli often seems to turn into Flewelly. Very few manage Llangollen or Llandudno correctly. A very easy way of spotting the tourist/incomer. there easy to spot here aswell .. they will be the ones talking while the manxies will be the ones tolerating it with grace / dignity / respect / and humility before reminding them about how regular the ferries are.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
%age Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 on a side note to MDO .. sex is also better with a partner.. I think that is a bit off manxman2. If you remember MDO's introducing himself to manxforums, he was apparently concerned with his amorous endeavours being interrupted by a brass band bringing the joys and spirit of Christmas to his neighbourhood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman2 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 on a side note to MDO .. sex is also better with a partner.. I think that is a bit off manxman2. If you remember MDO's introducing himself to manxforums, he was apparently concerned with his amorous endeavours being interrupted by a brass band bringing the joys and spirit of Christmas to his neighbourhood. no missed that episode of the drama. .. not that i am really bothered what he gets upto with his pets.. dog lover by name dog lover by nature imo.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilitantDogOwner Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 If the child has an interest in other languages, that is a bonus. The structure can differ quite a bit, for instance "half past seven" in English is "half to eight" in German. In England if you move from one area to another, place names never seem to be pronounced the way they look, and that is not just down to whether you speak English - dialectual differences come into play. I find it very amusing hearing people trying to pronounce place names that they are not accustomed to. Manx place names are problematic to many - Ballaugh becomes Balla Ugh, and so on. A bit of tutoring in Manx helps enormously if you want to fit in, to learn the roots of the words - Snaefell being Snow Maountain, Laxey is Salmon River, and so on, which to me makes the places more interesting. In Wales Pwllheli often seems to turn into Flewelly. Very few manage Llangollen or Llandudno correctly. A very easy way of spotting the tourist/incomer. there easy to spot here aswell .. they will be the ones talking while the manxies will be the ones mumbling about "takin ah jarbs" and telling anyone who wasn't born here to politely fuck off back where we came before reminding them about how regular the ferries are.. Fixed. Then the come-over reminds the slightly confused Manxie that the boat does not sail regularly and is often broken, lost or incapable of sailing in anything stronger than a gentle breeze. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilitantDogOwner Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 on a side note to MDO .. sex is also better with a partner.. I think that is a bit off manxman2. If you remember MDO's introducing himself to manxforums, he was apparently concerned with his amorous endeavours being interrupted by a brass band bringing the joys and spirit of Christmas to his neighbourhood. no missed that episode of the drama. .. not that i am really bothered what he gets upto with his pets.. dog lover by name dog lover by nature imo.. Married. Work for an IT department. Get help with the animal sex thing you have got going on. Its not healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glass Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 I am just me... and you lot are in my world Why do we have to compartmentalize everybody and everything - as somebody said; who give a flying plastic seagull over Douglas harbour where you come from, who you think you are and where your going. These is no such thing as Manx, English, Scottish, French, or for that matter comeovers or stayovers. As they say - where ever I lay my hat is my home, which is at the moment is on a tiny pimple or rock on the backside of a blue planet. We are all related. Dependant on your beliefs, we all started life in either a big bang in space followed by slime with one cell or the biblical style 7 days. which ever you believe we are all related. Manx what is it really? I work with a Mr Kelly. Thats a good Manx man? well no Kellys are stopovers from Eire. Then theres Mr Clague. no hes Manx? must be? well er no. He's a stopover again from Eire. Dividing the country based on an accident of birth is madness. admittedly some residents of the world have not yet evolved beyond the one cell slime, but thankfully most of Mann have. (except The Dog Mills of course). so lets stuff the Manx / foreigner argument. if they like it here and stick to our rules let them stay. The we can chuck out the good Manx people who stand in the dock each week. They drag the country down far more than Mr XYZ the stopover worker. Then we can change the national anthem to one that does not exclude 1/2 the population...................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 I'm glad you think it 'nice' that Manx is being maintained. Whilst that might be the initial motivation for people to learn a few words, ultimately that is not enough of a reason to continue on to fluency. If you knew what an amazing language Gaelic is, and could appreciate how it describes the world you would understand why people fall in love with it. Some people have the attitude that learning any language at all is good, except Manx. Others believe that if only we could go back to the days before the Tower of Babel then we would all live in peace and harmony. I, probably because of my experiences learning Manx, strongly believe in tolerance for linguistic and cultural diversity. The loss of a language is the loss of collective history and culture, and bilingualism teaches tolerance for that diversity. This is what I mean though. It is a difficult question, but what specifically has been lost? Over time more and more people stopped speaking Manx and more spoke English. The culture has changed because of this. What I am questioning is the motivation behind learning Manx, because what the language cannot do is to bring back that culture that existed when Manx was commonplace. It could give you an insight into that culture, but cannot have ability to bring it back to life. but judging from your posts you may be too infected with the 'one culture from here to the Urals' mentality of socialism that really wants to limit expression to a monotonous repetition of political mantra. One culture? No, how can you infer that? We already live in a world of monotonous repetition of political mantra. You hear it all the time when people talk about their work, the government, and their life in the way they do, framed by liberal and capitalist values. And from the Isle of Man to the Urals people share that same understanding of capitalism. You are INFECTED as I am, but I would prefer the less vicious and more accurate word of brainwashed. Though what you might be partially referring to is the language of socialism, which in many respects is stale and monotonous and boring. It is what communists have not seemingly got their head around but anarchists are trying to look into ways of dropping the age-old spiel that repeats the same words and phrases, as it bores the shit out of people. But it is all we have, and much of the reason why it is so repetitve is become the circumstances it relates to have barely altered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sebrof Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 on a side note to MDO .. sex is also better with a partner.. Don't believe everything you hear! S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malebrain Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Its been said that you must go back 3 generations of manx births to be classed as Manx. Hands up who is Manx now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarahc Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Am I a generation? If so yes, if not I'm not sure - but could be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macmannin Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Me,and have the star of shame regarding the Eu on my passport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesultanofsheight Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 and have the star of shame regarding the Eu on my passport. Me to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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