Topaz Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 Maybe this is a stupid question, and if so forgive me. In view of the generous salaries bestowed on the Island's senior civil servants.Why are we paying a firm of accountants in the UK to figure out the budget for the Isle of Man ? http://www.bakertilly.co.uk/default.aspx?page=3913 Further to that, what are we paying them? Is this information published somewhere that I can't track down? How do we know that we are getting the services of the highest ranking personel in this company? Has this company got experience in putting together a budget for an Independent nation, if so who? Has this company served the Isle of man in this capacity in the past? What is the ratio of input in to the finished budget on behalf of the Manx treasury team and that of the accountants from the UK.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 Maybe this is a stupid question, and if so forgive me. In view of the generous salaries bestowed on the Island's senior civil servants.Why are we paying a firm of accountants in the UK to figure out the budget for the Isle of Man ? http://www.bakertilly.co.uk/default.aspx?page=3913 Further to that, what are we paying them? Is this information published somewhere that I can't track down? How do we know that we are getting the services of the highest ranking personel in this company? Has this company got experience in putting together a budget for an Independent nation, if so who? Has this company served the Isle of man in this capacity in the past? What is the ratio of input in to the finished budget on behalf of the Manx treasury team and that of the accountants from the UK.? Was this supposed to be posted in the budget thread http://www.manxforums.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=30625 ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manshimajin Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 So what should actually happen in the Budget to save money/generate income? AB suggested raising the base rate of tax a couple of months ago. Is this the way forward? My breakfast table thoughts: Abolish the no tax above £100K rule - it failed to attract very rich people to the Island and reduced taxes for those who were here, Increase the 18% rate to 20% Sell assets that are a burden on the income side such as MEA and Ronaldsway to recover some of the Rolls Royce capital that has gone and save on interest servicing Change all taxpayer funded pensions from defined benefit to defined contribution - with MHKs being the first to make the change to show 'fiscal responsibility' and commitment to end of the Rolls Royce pension scheme era. Increase corporate tax rate to 5% (no point increasing rate for banks!) What would other forum contributors suggest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
%age Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 He [Treasury Minister Allan Bell] concedes taxpayers' cash could have been better spent in the past and says the era of 'Rolls Royce' capital schemes is now over. What a fucken insult to Rolls Royce. They should never have fucken well started laddie. Not as Rolls Roycers anyway. So is this how the incompetent greedy twats are justifying all those £million way above budget and appropriated from the tax payers' purse? Calling them Rolls Royce schemes - what a fucken teflon coated piece of slippery cynical spin that euphemism is. IRIS, Incinerator, New Hospital, the MEA projects . . . . are enduring testaments of the greed and incompetency that this Island has stood for during the current era. But most of the fat cats will be retired to their homes in Cyprus or wherever by the time the * 'white elephants have come home to roost' © The Isle of Man - a 'triple A' financial centre? * this phrase as been lifted from Peter Karran, that unwitting master of the double metaphor. Amazingly apt though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confirmed Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 The airport will be bought soon enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 What would other forum contributors suggest? Short term. Cut spending. Freeze wages. Longer term - shrink the economy. Because tax havens have no future. None. We cannot stand in the way of the inevitable and the economy here is too small for the island to exist in semi independent isolation [ - almost more English than the most English 1980s tories in many cases]. We also have limited resources to trade. The island needs to scale back it's dependence on financial services. The tax haven issue will not go away. It will get worse. And it would be wrong to legacy further uncertainty to future generations. When we say that we are not a tax haven it has to be absolutely the truth and transparently so. The economy has to be sustainable and realistic. Even if that means it being rather slower. We have to co operate 100% with anything that the international community demands. Even though that inevitably means shrinking the economy. IMO the island should begin working towards some form of full membership of the EU in exchange for the gradual scaling down of any aspects of the economy which are seen, internationally, as unacceptable; moving towards ending for ever dependence upon any part of the economy which can make the island seem to be a tax haven; looking for support from other nations in exchange for full co operation. There would be enormous benefits to be had for full membership of the EU - in exchange for losing benefits which are going to be lost anyhow, sooner or later. Even the process of arranging the transition would generate work and income. I have no doubt that the island's financial services industry could carry on for many years during any process of working towards change and that the journey towards change would be a project of itself. I think that it is about starting by giving out the right signals. And actually I think that process has already started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 What would other forum contributors suggest? Short term. Cut spending. Freeze wages. Longer term - shrink the economy. Because tax havens have no future. None. Can you expand on that? If we can, through indirect taxation without VAT cheating, offer more competitive taxation than other countries, why doesn't that have a future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Power Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 The way things are heading, there'll be lots of senior people really pissed off and possibly looking for a new role in a couple of years. They are actually needed now to lobby, edit, fight etc. on our behalf this 'new order' emanating from the U.S. They just need organising and focussing. Have the new administration in the US actually proposed anything unreasonable or which the island could or should not live with? Yes - there was a piece in this weeks Examiner 'Business News' - about how the proposed legislation deems all tax havens the same - 'good or bad'. The article, based on a US attorney's thoughts, was basically saying: 'time to get our arses into gear...er...like now'. You could be cynical when reading this article, U.S. Attorney Joseph L. Brand could just be scaremongering to drum up business for his lobbying organisation. Mind you, can you imagine anyone from our lot going over there to do it? A bit like Mr Chamberlain returning from Munich methinks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tugger Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 So what should actually happen in the Budget to save money/generate income? AB suggested raising the base rate of tax a couple of months ago. Is this the way forward? My breakfast table thoughts: Abolish the no tax above £100K rule - it failed to attract very rich people to the Island and reduced taxes for those who were here, Increase the 18% rate to 20% Sell assets that are a burden on the income side such as MEA and Ronaldsway to recover some of the Rolls Royce capital that has gone and save on interest servicing Change all taxpayer funded pensions from defined benefit to defined contribution - with MHKs being the first to make the change to show 'fiscal responsibility' and commitment to end of the Rolls Royce pension scheme era. Increase corporate tax rate to 5% (no point increasing rate for banks!) What would other forum contributors suggest? The corporate tax rate could rise for domestically generated profits. A more general rise than that and you will hear a great sucking noise as companies vanish, followed by cries of anguish as CSPs shed staff. I think the no tax above 100K rule could move, but don't think it should be abolished altogether - it makes us look like we blow in the wind too much. It could at least be inflation adjusted though. Why can't we add our own 2.5% sales tax to help with the VAT deficit? Most of all, someone has to get government spending under control. The amount of government we have for our population is too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 What would other forum contributors suggest? Short term. Cut spending. Freeze wages. Longer term - shrink the economy. Because tax havens have no future. None. Can you expand on that? If we can, through indirect taxation without VAT cheating, offer more competitive taxation than other countries, why doesn't that have a future? Because the growing consensus of international opinion (which is actually not so unreasonable) will be that a person who lives (or is domiciled) in a particular place should pay their taxes in that / those particular place(s). And that a company which basically does its business in a particular place should be established (and pay all of its taxes and fees) where it actually generates the income. Whilst there are, without doubt, many ifs and buts - the basic arguments are fairly straight forward. On the other hand - EU companies and individuals are, gradually, increasingly free to be based and pay their taxes across the old national boundaries. Since the EU is, in some ways, one big country (whether the old English tories like it or not). Also - whilst we can argue indefinitely that this or that, is or isn't actually fair and that we should be allowed to do this or that - well we might as well be banging our heads against a wall. We have to accept the fact that this is how the tax havens issue will be seen from outside. Therefore we might as well get on with dealing with the inevitable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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