oogie boogie Posted April 6, 2009 Share Posted April 6, 2009 WTF? My first reaction to this was simply to just knock fuck out of the attackers, then remembering they're 10 and 11!!!!! I don't even know how to respond to this. What do you guys and girls think? It really does get to a point where you think the Clockwork Orange Brainwashing and Battle Royale style discipline would work a treat. I must be missing something here, what exactley is getting to a 10 year old that would make them think of doing something like this? 10 and 11 are still primary school ages aren't they? FFS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BETTYBOO68 Posted April 6, 2009 Share Posted April 6, 2009 WTF? My first reaction to this was simply to just knock fuck out of the attackers, then remembering they're 10 and 11!!!!! I don't even know how to respond to this. What do you guys and girls think? It really does get to a point where you think the Clockwork Orange Brainwashing and Battle Royale style discipline would work a treat. I must be missing something here, what exactley is getting to a 10 year old that would make them think of doing something like this? 10 and 11 are still primary school ages aren't they? FFS just finishing reading the story about it, i just can't beleive 10 & 11 year olds could be responsible for such a savage assault, it's absolutely disgusting. god only knows what would of happened if the 9 year old had'nt escape their clutches..... it reminds me a bit of the jamie bugler case another savage attack that ended in death by kids...our generation were never like that as kids! we were all still probaly playing with our dolls, action men, marbles, simon says, we were kids and sadly in todays world, the kids grow up to fast, know too much, and have the latest in every techie item going....do we blame violent computer games and tv? or does it stem from their homelife? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted April 6, 2009 Share Posted April 6, 2009 But most kids today don't doing dream of things like this. Just as you didn't. This is exceedingly rare, once in a generation thing. When was the last similar event - James Bulger? And before that Mary Bell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ringwraith Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 But most kids today don't doing dream of things like this. Just as you didn't. This is exceedingly rare, once in a generation thing. When was the last similar event - James Bulger? And before that Mary Bell? Not so sure about that, these kids are young but shootings and stabbings / slashings are worryingly commonplace now along with deaths as a result. Often the kids are very young under 15. I blame computer games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluemonday Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 According to the Times http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/c...icle6048032.ece The two were in care and being fostered. Presumably the original/genetic parents were found ( eventually ) to be inadequate. 'Give me a child until he is seven and I will give you the man.' The Jesuit motto, alleged to be attributed to Francis Xavier. And here's the result, yet again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.os Theory Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 I blame computer games. here we go again... 2 messed up kids cause harm to other kids, it must be the fault of videogames...can't be movies, the internet, the news, mental health problems, family issues... if it does come out in the press that they ( the attackers ) played violent videogames then surely the fault lies with the parents, not the makers of said games. I can almost see the Daily Mail getting it's " ban this sick filth " headlines ready. it is a shocking and disgusting attack, and from reports other parents were complaining to the police that their kids had been attacked in the weeks leading up to this incident... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 In schools bring back corporal punishment NOW. In the courts the Birch and Borstal and the rope should be returned and very very soon. It’s a fact that some people become evil as a result of their upbringing. Being taken into Childrens Homes and Borstal approved schools would sort many of them, out as would the knowledge that such might happen if they stepped out of line prevent many from doing wrong in the first place. On the other hand some people are born evil and the best way to deal with them is to make them live in fear of expressing their evil, and if that fails then long term jail or capital punishment would solve that problem. Look, the so called permissive society has failed. Too many people have demonstrated that being left to live the way that they want rather than the way that they should they simply revert to savages and so corrupting others as well as making life hell for the rest. Never mind. The soon to hit us all world depression and slump is going to give those don’t work / won\’ work trash and their kind a wake up call that they will not like one little bit once the ‘benefits’ start to wither on the vine, and so much that is delivered by the increasingly nanny state drops away as nanny can no longer afford to deliver what ‘she’ has. Funny thing how so often old sayings often have more than a grain of truth in them. This is going to be a cloud that will have at least one silver lining as the great unwashed get MADE to wash, and benefits become replaced by ‘Workfare’. And it will. The two little swine involved here? Personally I would publicly hang them as punishment for them and as a message to the other scum that swan around sink estates and society. Not just words, I would pull the lever myself. We’ve spent far too long being ‘understanding’ and trying to help the perpetrators since they are victims also. Bugger understanding why they do what they do, let’s just deal with what they do, and as for being victims? Tough. Just as it was tough on THEIR victims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 We’ve spent far too long being ‘understanding’ and trying to help the perpetrators since they are victims also. Bugger understanding why they do what they do, let’s just deal with what they do, and as for being victims? Tough. Just as it was tough on THEIR victims. You seem too rapped up in punishing people with little explanation as how it SOLVES problems and creates a better society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oogie boogie Posted April 7, 2009 Author Share Posted April 7, 2009 Welcome back Rog. I do agree that the recent decline in children behaviour is down to a lack of discipline in schools and at home. I've heard some first hand stories of children running wild in high schools over here and teachers not being able to do anything about it. A popular punishment seems to be to send the child home for the day to "cool off".... where's the punishment there?? A very drastic change needs to take place in legislation over here, with regards to education. Maybe not bring back public flogging but teachers should be able to throw small things at children (like other children hmmmmm) and at the very least they should be allowed to be shook violently. Kaos of course the games are at fault... I've seen you running round town trying to collect golden rings with your ginger sidekick many a time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stavros Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 A sad but prime example of society jumping to blame anything that moves without a single comment or thought about the health, welfare or future of the victims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbms Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 We’ve spent far too long being ‘understanding’ and trying to help the perpetrators since they are victims also. Bugger understanding why they do what they do, let’s just deal with what they do, and as for being victims? Tough. Just as it was tough on THEIR victims. You seem too rapped up in punishing people with little explanation as how it SOLVES problems and creates a better society. I would say the statement is quite self explanitary, you do wrong you get punished, this can also act as a deterent to others, if the scroats know they are they only going to get comunity service then that is no deterent, if they know they are going to face 2 years in a military style prison being beasted and have to work hard from dawn to dusk with minimal privilages then they may think twice and forget all the bollocks about it's not their fault it's society, remember these scroats are a minority in society there are far more who have had a worse upbringing/experience etc who have gone on to becaome a decent member of society, remember society does not owe anyone a living, each person owes a responsibilty to society to maintain its rules and uphold it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 Welcome back Rog. I do agree that the recent decline in children behaviour is down to a lack of discipline in schools and at home. I've heard some first hand stories of children running wild in high schools over here and teachers not being able to do anything about it. A popular punishment seems to be to send the child home for the day to "cool off".... where's the punishment there?? A very drastic change needs to take place in legislation over here, with regards to education. Maybe not bring back public flogging but teachers should be able to throw small things at children (like other children hmmmmm) and at the very least they should be allowed to be shook violently. Kaos of course the games are at fault... I've seen you running round town trying to collect golden rings with your ginger sidekick many a time I disagree. I think teachers have little legitimacy to their role of authority over children in school, never mind meting out punishment in the form of violence. I don't think the solution lies in discipline. Yes, you can instill discipline by brainwashing children into thinking that they should take orders and should behave in a way that others want but then you just create people who are more likely to accept authority unquestionably. Not something we want if we expect that education is to create intelligenct, free-thinking individuals. I think the issue lies with self-respect and the consequences of being brought up with no respect from parents and society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 A sad but prime example of society jumping to blame anything that moves without a single comment or thought about the health, welfare or future of the victims. But what are we supposed to do. Comment about how unhappy we are that people have suffered or died. The god assumption we all make is that we recognise how terrible this is because we should all be able to understand it and sympathise with it. We don't have to say anything about the victims. But we want to do is to make sure this sort of thing never happens again. We has happened can't be reversed. I would say the statement is quite self explanitary, you do wrong you get punished, this can also act as a deterent to others, if the scroats know they are they only going to get comunity service then that is no deterent, if they know they are going to face 2 years in a military style prison being beasted and have to work hard from dawn to dusk with minimal privilages then they may think twice and forget all the bollocks about it's not their fault it's society, remember these scroats are a minority in society there are far more who have had a worse upbringing/experience etc who have gone on to becaome a decent member of society, remember society does not owe anyone a living, each person owes a responsibilty to society to maintain its rules and uphold it. But then you are making the assumption that deterrence is effective. Is there good evidence of this? These people are a minority in society, but this does not mean that they are NOT society. They are a product of it and their identity and development is a result of their upbringing and experience. They have responsibility but it has to be recognised that if they were brought up by people who have no self-respect or did not offer respect to their children then their children will grow up to not respect anyone. Punishment only teaches the lesson that certain behaviours will be punished. That isnt the best lesson to teach and will not change much in the greater scheme of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somewhatdamaged Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 Shocking story, really brings a tear to your eye. Unfortunately at that age you pretty much get away with it. Look what happened to the two lads who killed the Bulger boy. I believe they are both free? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terse Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 ...bring back corporal punishment ...the Birch and Borstal and the rope should be returned We’ve spent far too long being ‘understanding’ Bugger understanding why they do what they do, let’s just deal with what they do, and as for being victims? Tough. Just as it was tough on THEIR victims. You have Israeli connections. It shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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