Cambon Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Didn't you bleat loudly about biometric passports too? I don't have a passport, and I don't want one either, as I'm not interested in long haul flights. And that is the reason it is locked in a safe unless required. If they get the idea of ID cards in, they will be made compulsory, just as they were in nazi germany. The next stage after that is the power to stop and search - communist states of europe here we come. And if it's a well designed, joined up system, that won't matter a jot. If is a very big word. Both you and I know it will not be a well designed system. IT companies forgot how to do that years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Travelling is what passports are for. Going to England is travelling. When you are here, how often do you open bank accounts? How many times per year do you have to prove your identity when not travelling? Once? Twice? and yet you would put your identity at risk by having to carry it with you everywhere! And, you call me a bit wierd? You are beyond weird. Why carry a wallet and a passport, rather than just a wallet, everywhere you go in England, which doubles your chances of losing something. Imagine you are at a Rock Festival, you can't leave the passport in the tent and if you take it into the moshpit it's gonna get crumpled or lost since it's not exactly intended designed to be carried everywhere in a pocket. But to get to England you have to show your passport. A wallet size id card would solve this. I went to get a phone last year, and since it involved switching between PAYG to contract I needed to show id, naturally it never occured to me that I'd need to take a passport to buy a phone, in fact when I set out that morning I didn't even know I was gonna buy a phone. So, I had to come back the next day, wasting another lunch hour. An ID card in my wallet would solve this. This is supposed to be a free country and yet at every turn horrible little creeps like you and David Cameron and the Guardian and are trying to make us less free and make life more complicated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 And that is the reason it is locked in a safe unless required. I don't understand the connection? Isn't the data storage and collection the thing that sets your tin hat pinging? How does locking up your safe help? If they get the idea of ID cards in, they will be made compulsory, just as they were in nazi germany. The next stage after that is the power to stop and search - communist states of europe here we come. Oh behave. The home sec has just announced that they won't be compulsory and the next stage, as has been demonstrated in other countries, is that they'll be adopted by demand, because people will come to realise how useful they are. Is modern Germany like Nazi Germany? Greece? Portugal? They've all got compulsary ID. If is a very big word. Both you and I know it will not be a well designed system. IT companies forgot how to do that years ago. Great generalisation: 'All IT is shit'? You really are clueless eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted July 2, 2009 Author Share Posted July 2, 2009 I, for one, welcome our data mining overlords if it means I can carry one form of identification rather than a few and avoid a stack of questions every time I sign up for something, particularly government services. But are you happy to have all your details logged on a central Government database? Because that's the deal. By the way, you do not need a passport to travel to England or anywhere else in the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Great generalisation: 'All IT is shit'? You really are clueless eh? Maybe he meant that all UK government IT projects are run by the clueless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 By the way, you do not need a passport to travel to England or anywhere else in the UK. How so? The airlines require photo id. What else is there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 But are you happy to have all your details logged on a central Government database? Because that's the deal. All my details? What additional details will they be holding that the various agencies don't have already? They've got all my financials in the form of tax, they've got my medical history, my education, national insurance, social security, police records, etc. All we're talking about here is joining it up, which I see as a benefit, not a hindrance. Daft that I have to fill in all my details on a fishing license as well as a driving license, far better to just bung down my ID number. By the way, you do not need a passport to travel to England or anywhere else in the UK. I know, didn't say you did. You do have to bring photo ID though if you're flying, which means driving license or passport, and a driving license is notoriously shit as an identity prover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambon Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 You are beyond weird. Why carry a wallet and a passport, rather than just a wallet, everywhere you go in England, which doubles your chances of losing something. Imagine you are at a Rock Festival, you can't leave the passport in the tent and if you take it into the moshpit it's gonna get crumpled or lost since it's not exactly intended designed to be carried everywhere in a pocket. But to get to England you have to show your passport. A wallet size id card would solve this. I went to get a phone last year, and since it involved switching between PAYG to contract I needed to show id, naturally it never occured to me that I'd need to take a passport to buy a phone, in fact when I set out that morning I didn't even know I was gonna buy a phone. So, I had to come back the next day, wasting another lunch hour. An ID card in my wallet would solve this. This is supposed to be a free country and yet at every turn horrible little creeps like you and David Cameron and the Guardian and are trying to make us less free and make life more complicated. If you are that worried about your passport then take your driving licence. Yes this is a free country but brown and his crew are trying their best to make it a controlled state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambon Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 All my details? What additional details will they be holding that the various agencies don't have already? They've got all my financials in the form of tax, they've got my medical history, my education, national insurance, social security, police records, etc. All we're talking about here is joining it up, which I see as a benefit, not a hindrance. Daft that I have to fill in all my details on a fishing license as well as a driving license, far better to just bung down my ID number. I know, why not have your id number tattooed on like the nazis did to the prisoners in the concentration camps? Even better - implant a chip so you can be scanned. Then declan does not have to worry when he goes to his concerts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 at every turn horrible little creeps like you and David Cameron and the Guardian and are trying to make us less free and make life more complicated. Wait! Seriously - Cameron needs some space. The alternative to him is frightful. Cameron has to take a stand on this whether or not he really thinks it is an issue. These things are all connected to other things. And I'm assuming that he will win the next UK GE. It goes like this: Cameron, Oliver Letwin and and George Osbourne represent the One Nation Tory bit of the Conservative Party. They represent moderate reform and free market opinion - they represent the sort of people who think that consensus is a good idea. They represent the sort of people who quite like Clarke, Hurd, new-Portillo, Major, Rifkind, Chris Patten and co. They are free market liberals but not obsessed with the flag. And, whilst they see the need for reform, they think on balance, that Britain is best off inside Europe. They are pragmatists. But much (possibly most) of the party at grass roots and many of the MPs basically support the UKIP. This makes them schizophrenic. And it means trouble ahead - even if they win. Groups such as 'Better Off Out' and TFA are made up of people from both parties. They represent the sort of people who (more or less) hate Clarke, Hurd, new-Portillo, Major, Rifkind, Chris Patten and co. And many potential Conservative voters are very susceptible to the anti EU propaganda. They are obsessed with the flag. They don't trust abroad. They think it is all a blag. Cameron needs them to win - but they will ultimately try to get rid of him. It is as if the Militant Tendency was on the verge of taking over the Labour Party. Many in the Conservative Party see UKIP as basically the Conservative Party in exile. Which is a pity. But it means that if Cameron is not very careful, sometime after he becomes PM, the Conservative Party will ditch him and move to pull out of Europe. They call his people the 'Roons'. They accuse him of being Stalinist. They basically hate him more than they hate Labour. They think he is wet. So he has to take a stand on something. TFA people in particular have made a big deal about the whole ID cards thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted July 2, 2009 Author Share Posted July 2, 2009 The airlines require photo id. What else is there? FLYBE ID requirements Domestic/Republic of Ireland travel A valid passport An expired passport (can be used on domestic flights for up to two years after expiry) Valid photographic EU or Swiss national identity card Valid photographic driving licence Valid armed forces identity card Valid police warrant card/badge Valid airport employees security identity pass A child on parent’ s passport is an acceptable form of ID CitizenCard Valid photographic firearm certificate Valid Government-issued identity card SMART card Electoral identity card NUS cards photographic (National Union of Students) Photographic University/College ID card Company ID cards of Nationally recognised companies (photographic) Council issued bus pass (Senior Citizens only) Pension book (as only acceptable form of non-photographic identification) Young Scot Card Why the heck would you also want a UK ID Card as well? Why should they take away my passport just because I tell them where to stick their beastly bureaucratic ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sebrof Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Didn't you bleat loudly about biometric passports too? I don't have a passport, and I don't want one either, as I'm not interested in long haul flights. First time I've heard a channel ferry described as a long haul flight. S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted July 2, 2009 Author Share Posted July 2, 2009 The airlines require photo id. What else is there? FLYBE ID requirements Domestic/Republic of Ireland travel A valid passport An expired passport (can be used on domestic flights for up to two years after expiry) Valid photographic EU or Swiss national identity card Valid photographic driving licence Valid armed forces identity card Valid police warrant card/badge Valid airport employees security identity pass A child on parent’ s passport is an acceptable form of ID CitizenCard Valid photographic firearm certificate Valid Government-issued identity card SMART card Electoral identity card NUS cards photographic (National Union of Students) Photographic University/College ID card Company ID cards of Nationally recognised companies (photographic) Council issued bus pass (Senior Citizens only) Pension book (as only acceptable form of non-photographic identification) Young Scot Card Why the heck would you also want a UK ID Card as well? Why should they take away my passport just because I tell them where to stick their beastly bureaucratic ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 If you are that worried about your passport then take your driving licence. Yes this is a free country but brown and his crew are trying their best to make it a controlled state. But I live on the Isle of Man why would I have a driving licence? Surely, that would cost me more than an id card anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manshimajin Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Home Secretary affirms commitment to identity cards by accelerating rollout from 2011/12 identity cards will roll out to the wider population on an entirely voluntary basis. They will be dishing out ID Cards and logging peoples details on the National Identity Register with passport renewals and applications. You can refuse to be involved - but you won't get a passport. Beware the spin. I must be missing something - where is the reference to needing an ID Card to renew a passport? That would be really stupid. It implies that the current passport is not a reliable document for renewal purposes - despite the fact that currently it is seen as a reliable document. What bugs me is that the UKG has been rattling on that the reason they need ID Cards is to stop terrorism and crime - if that is the case why are they so slow in introducing an effective scheme? Clearly if terrorism and crime were the real reasons for an ID Card they would have extracted their digits long before now and protected the citizens of the UK. Certainly the UK public service does not have joined up information despite all the data currently collected. Will ID Cards make the UK Public Service more effective? If they do it should result in a massive reduction in public servants as data shuffling and data mistakes could stop (just hope no-one loses the ID Card tapes though). Funnily enough getting rid of thousands of public servants has never been put forward as a reason for ID Cards. Seems the best rationale for their introduction to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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