bluemonday Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 Clicky The last British survivor of the World War I trenches, Harry Patch, has died at the age of 111. Mr Patch was conscripted into the Army aged 18 and fought in the Battle of Passchendaele at Ypres in 1917 in which more than 70,000 British soldiers died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 I really shouldn't read these sort of articles. A man who was conscripted in the Forces, who has been in conditions that nobody today can truly imagine passes away...and then all manner of people sully and dirty his name and other servicemen's names with talk of people being proud of his generation, talk about a sacrifice, and possibly worst of all - that these men were of the noblest sort. It's disgusting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 I really shouldn't read these sort of articles. A man who was conscripted in the Forces, who has been in conditions that nobody today can truly imagine passes away...and then all manner of people sully and dirty his name and other servicemen's names with talk of people being proud of his generation, talk about a sacrifice, and possibly worst of all - that these men were of the noblest sort. It's disgusting. No you really shouldn't read these sort of articles, much less comment on them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 I really shouldn't read these sort of articles. A man who was conscripted in the Forces, who has been in conditions that nobody today can truly imagine passes away...and then all manner of people sully and dirty his name and other servicemen's names with talk of people being proud of his generation, talk about a sacrifice, and possibly worst of all - that these men were of the noblest sort. It's disgusting. No you really shouldn't read these sort of articles, much less comment on them Why not? I think it is completely disrespectful to paint this man's and other men's past as they have in this article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 I really shouldn't read these sort of articles. A man who was conscripted in the Forces, who has been in conditions that nobody today can truly imagine passes away...and then all manner of people sully and dirty his name and other servicemen's names with talk of people being proud of his generation, talk about a sacrifice, and possibly worst of all - that these men were of the noblest sort. It's disgusting. No you really shouldn't read these sort of articles, much less comment on them Why not? I think it is completely disrespectful to paint this man's and other men's past as they have in this article. We,ve been here before. It's you that sullies and disrespects this man's and others' lives. Please don't start again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 We,ve been here before. It's you that sullies and disrespects this man's and others' lives. Please don't start again. But it is not me who disrespects these people. I have a good enough understanding of what happened and why it happened to recognise the situation for these people. They should be remembered for what they experienced, why they were forced into the horrors they were, and their inability to do otherwise. They had their lives stolen from them. To talk of sacrifice, nobility, and other patriotic nonsense is to pretend they had choices, that their goal was noble, etc. That's a lie. I need not say anymore, it just riles that these people's lives and deaths will be remembered for the wrong reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Back to the Future Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 We,ve been here before. It's you that sullies and disrespects this man's and others' lives. Please don't start again. But it is not me who disrespects these people. I have a good enough understanding of what happened and why it happened to recognise the situation for these people. They should be remembered for what they experienced, why they were forced into the horrors they were, and their inability to do otherwise. To talk of sacrifice, nobility, and other patriotic nonsense is to pretend they had choices, that their goal was noble, etc. That's a lie. I need not say anymore, it just riles that these people's lives and deaths will be remembered for the wrong reasons. Read his autobiography if you can. The things he'd seen. (His funeral will be in Wells Cathedral.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vulgarian Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 Chief of the General Staff, General Sir Richard Dannatt, said: "He was the last of a generation that in youth was steadfast in its duty in the face of cruel sacrifice and we give thanks for his life - as well as those of his comrades - for upholding the same values and freedom that we continue to cherish and fight for today." What sort of fucking nonsense is that? Our values and freedoms weren't threatened in WW1. Is he getting confused with WW2? One would expect the head of the army to know a bit about military history. But that's just the sort of language always used in statements in the media when speaking of the military, which we are so used to hearing i think we accept without pondering what is being said. It's empty patriotic nonsense that is supposed to make sense of national pride well up in our breasts. It's the misrepresentation of the men who fought in WW1 that annoys me, (and i think LDV) and the misappropriation and misunderstanding of the reasons they fought and the things they experienced, for the purpose of engendering nationalism and support for the military. The same process is at work in the UK government's new Armed Forces Day that we were talking about recently. upholding the same values and freedom that we continue to cherish and fight for today He's trying to increase approval for the wars Britain is involved in today by associating the men who fought in WW1. A very cheap trick indeed.It demeans and disrespects the WW1 veterans. His whole statement is based on an erroneous assertion that we were fighting for our freedom and liberty in WW1, which he then suggests is what we're fighting for in conflicts today! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Yeah, bang on. Nasty propaganda which completely covers up the real reasons for this war (and many others). And really atrocious considering how our understanding of these men's lives is moulded by filling people's minds with lies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananaman Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Read his autobiography if you can. The things he'd seen. I really do think idiot and idiot above really should. I know the one of you are just trying to wind us up so we shouldn't really read into the vague dribble that the one of you post. If either one of you ever get the chance, please go to Ypres and go to the Mennin Gate, 8pm every evening, what an amazing spectacle. So moving, it really is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Read his autobiography if you can. The things he'd seen. I really do think idiot and idiot above really should. I know the one of you are just trying to wind us up so we shouldn't really read into the vague dribble that the one of you post. If either one of you ever get the chance, please go to Ypres and go to the Mennin Gate, 8pm every evening, what an amazing spectacle. So moving, it really is. Even if you may disagree, do you understand where Vulgarian and I are coming from on this? I have to ask because you regularly dismiss things without debating them. I would like to go to Ypres and would like to do a WW1 walk and I like reading about WW1 a lot, more so than WW2, but why do you bring it up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananaman Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Even if you may disagree, do you understand where Vulgarian and I are coming from on this? I have to ask because you regularly dismiss things without debating them. I would like to go to Ypres and would like to do a WW1 walk and I like reading about WW1 a lot, more so than WW2, but why do you bring it up? No I don't know where you and ermmm Vulgarian are coming from, all I know is that you look like a disrespectful twat. Scum who drop litter are held in a higher regard in my mind. Why do I bring what up Lala love? Going to the Menin gat and feeling a little bit of humility and humbleness (is that a real word?)? I hope you go my wind up merchant friend. I really do. Learn a bit - even you and your high up obnoxious tower could learn. Jebus it's a moving moment. It really is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vulgarian Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Read his autobiography if you can. The things he'd seen. I really do think idiot and idiot above really should. I know the one of you are just trying to wind us up so we shouldn't really read into the vague dribble that the one of you post. If either one of you ever get the chance, please go to Ypres and go to the Mennin Gate, 8pm every evening, what an amazing spectacle. So moving, it really is. I'm sure it is, really. I'm not trying to wind you up, you've just got your panties in a bunch probably without reading my post. I have a great deal of respect for people who were conscripted to fight in the World Wars. My grandfather was involved in WW2 on a mine sweeping vessel in the merchant navy, (although he wasn't conscripted as he was already in the merchant navy which profession was exempt from conscription) - a very dangerous occupation - his ship was sunk and he lost many of friends, but himself survived. It's just the sort of bullshit that the government comes out with about duty, honour, and sacrifice. They're taking the awful experiences of these veterans and using them to their own ends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 No I don't know where you and ermmm Vulgarian are coming from, all I know is that you look like a disrespectful twat. Scum who drop litter are held in a higher regard in my mind. Why do I bring what up Lala love? Going to the Menin gat and feeling a little bit of humility and humbleness (is that a real word?)? I hope you go my wind up merchant friend. I really do. Learn a bit - even you and your high up obnoxious tower could learn. I am starting to think you are very narrowminded as well as somewhat ignorant. If you don't understand what I am saying then it is a bit silly to talk of it all being a wind-up. No doubt many will be wound up by what I say on political matters, because my ideas and thoughts are controversial, they run against what most people believe. Some people don't like their ways of thinking being challenged. It doesn't mean I am trolling in the normal sense of the word. Go back to my first post if you like, I have explained what I have an issue with - ideas of nobility, sacrifice, and mention of freedom and values in respect of the men who fought in WW1. My thoughts are very much on the deaths and hardship of those people who fought in this war. I wouldn't comment if it didn't care less about it all. I also wonder whether you are ignorant of what happened around this period in history when you seem so incapable of understanding where we are coming from. I know you're not thick. In any case, yet again you dismiss what I am saying with no explanation as to why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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