Cronky Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 The UK has overall responsibility for the good governance of the Isle of Man. If it believed corruption were endemic here, it could, on the advice of the Lieutenant Governor, suspend Tynwald until reforms had been introduced. However, this decision would need to be acceptable to both the international community and local residents. In the case of Turks and Caicos, it was probably the right decision, as the island's government was institutionally corrupt and was beginning to intimidate voters to the point where true democracy was no longer possible. However, to achieve independence, all the Isle of Man would need to do is approve such a move in a referendum. Turks and Caicos had a pro-independence government in the seventies, and prior to the 1980 election it was agreed with the UK government that independence would take place in 1982. However, power changed hands at the election, and an anti-independence party took control. What would the finance industry think about independence? If, say, one of the Crown Dependencies broke away how would the City of London view that situation? The Lord Mayor of London has praised the Crown Dependencies for the job they do raising inward investment to the City. Would a Crown Dependency me more or less attractive to the City if it became independent. Reputation is everything. Presumably the Tax Information Exchange Agreements are key to continued business? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manshimajin Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 What would the finance industry think about independence? If, say, one of the Crown Dependencies broke away how would the City of London view that situation? The Lord Mayor of London has praised the Crown Dependencies for the job they do raising inward investment to the City. Would a Crown Dependency me more or less attractive to the City if it became independent. Reputation is everything. Presumably the Tax Information Exchange Agreements are key to continued business? If the Island were to be independent and wished to keep the finance sector here it would have to keep in step with what as happening in the EU and the UK. It could not simply go off in a totally different direction ignoring EU Directives and would have to meticulously maintain tax exchange agreements. Independence would require a step-up in the quality of administration if we were not to fundamentally just follow UK legislation. IMO with the population the size of a smallish UK town we are already heavily stretched in attracting quality public servants with long term career ambitions. It would probably also make us more much dependent on tax exiles with the positive/negative influences that brings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 I totally agree with john wright's post (21). The Island's motto is after all : Quocunque Jeceris Stabit. The Manx are historically adaptable, the early suffrage of women was apparently because of a lot of the men of the Island were away at sea for one reason or another (fishing, merchant navy etc). I hope our MHK's adapt or even proffit the Island from this new challenge. well thanks but the IOM votes for women was based on sonething totally different In 1871 it was not one person one vote but voting was based on property ownership. In UK women could not own property themselves. Votes attached to property ownership so no votes to women In IOM historically they had been able to own in their own right separaetly from their husbands So it was a property owners democracy not man or woman vote but an I own property of such a value or more vote and with votes for each property!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ringwraith Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 well thanks but the IOM votes for women was based on sonething totally different In 1871 it was not one person one vote but voting was based on property ownership. In UK women could not own property themselves. Votes attached to property ownership so no votes to women In IOM historically they had been able to own in their own right separaetly from their husbands So it was a property owners democracy not man or woman vote but an I own property of such a value or more vote and with votes for each property!!! Not quite the full account there John - http://www.gov.im/lib/news/mnh/125thanniversary.xml The Election Bill was introduced into the Keys on 5th November 1880 and proposed to extend the vote to every man of full age who was not subject to any legal incapacity such as bankruptcy. However, the ‘Manchester National Society for Women’s Suffrage’ reasoned that by deleting the word ‘male’, women would also receive the vote......However, when the Bill was sent to the Island’s second chamber, the Legislative Council, on UK Home Office instruction the Lieutenant Governor, advised that they could not endorse the Keys decision because it would never receive Royal Assent. Single women in England could own property but not vote, according to this anyway - http://www.indiana.edu/~letrs/vwwp/bodicho...bodichon-note01. Aren't you involved in Law? And as for the EU, out of the frying pan and into the fire if you are serious about detaching from the UK to join it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellyup Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 What would the finance industry think about independence? If, say, one of the Crown Dependencies broke away how would the City of London view that situation? The Lord Mayor of London has praised the Crown Dependencies for the job they do raising inward investment to the City. Would a Crown Dependency me more or less attractive to the City if it became independent. Reputation is everything. Presumably the Tax Information Exchange Agreements are key to continued business? If the Island were to be independent and wished to keep the finance sector here it would have to keep in step with what as happening in the EU and the UK. It could not simply go off in a totally different direction ignoring EU Directives and would have to meticulously maintain tax exchange agreements. Independence would require a step-up in the quality of administration if we were not to fundamentally just follow UK legislation. IMO with the population the size of a smallish UK town we are already heavily stretched in attracting quality public servants with long term career ambitions. It would probably also make us more much dependent on tax exiles with the positive/negative influences that brings. Reputation is everything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 Independence would require a step-up in the quality of administration if we were not to fundamentally just follow UK legislation. IMO with the population the size of a smallish UK town we are already heavily stretched in attracting quality public servants with long term career ambitions. Valid point. But it seems to me that the Isle of Man already does pretty much follow UK legislation. The recruitment of UK civil servants has a lot to do with that. It stands to reason that such employees will import UK policies wherever they can. There does not seem to be much oversight of this situation by our MHK's. They get appointed to assist the various departments - not decide the policies in the first place. If the Isle of Man were to be independent then this situation might change - but I am not sure how. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triskelion Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 If the Isle of Man were to be independent then this situation might change - but I am not sure how. Abandon ministerial system, replace with all-Island elected LegCo to serve as the primary legislative and policy-making body, which then charges Department Heads with delivering these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted August 18, 2009 Share Posted August 18, 2009 They are taking a serious view of these developments in Guernsey: UK 'working to force change on Guernsey' ‘The biggest problem with this Labour Government is it is actually working with others to force change on us. That’s what has fundamentally changed in our relationship.’ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langweilig Posted August 18, 2009 Share Posted August 18, 2009 "But in terms of the revenue flows, tax exemptions and the contributions they make to the United Kingdom, I think we definitely have to look at that again." In other words, please give us your money...lots of money....ALL your money! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 Rodan hits out over Lib Dem peer's 'arrogance' Mr Rodan has written a hard-hitting letter to Lord Wallace, telling him he had read his comments with 'considerable dismay'. and 'The Isle of Man does not cost the UK a penny. We pay our own way in the world – every pound spent here is raised here; no block grants, subventions, special funding from the UK, the EU or any one else. 'By statute our Finance Minister is obliged to balance for a budget surplus – this is done consistently; with no external borrowing, and rates of taxation which actually encourage private enterprise and wealth creation, yet this little nation can still point to first-class publicly financed services in health, education and social security. 'The way we organise ourselves financially passes muster – the OECD, G20 and others tell us we are an internationally responsible jurisdiction. With such evidence that we are indeed "competent to manage our own affairs" – why on earth would we want to be part of the UK?' Hey, I like people who stick up for Isle of Man. What chance this guy will be the next Chief Minister? Would he have to drop the Scottish accent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 A mature and robust response, pity we couldn't expect something similar from the locally bred politicos. Some times you do just have to say, politely and in a well-crafted way, f off. Very often, the demeanour of our senior politicians to these broadsides from the UK just perpetuate the myth that our autonomy is almost a grace and favour thing. I don't believe it is and it is time IOMG stood up for itself and showed itself, truly, as a player on the international stage not just by being pushed around by the main players, but standing shoulder to shoulder with them and defending its own position. Some times we seem to behave with no more self assertion than an Eton fag. Steve for king! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ringwraith Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 The way we organise ourselves financially passes muster – the OECD, G20 and others tell us we are an internationally responsible jurisdiction. With such evidence that we are indeed "competent to manage our own affairs" – why on earth would we want to be part of the UK?' Or, for that token, a part of the EU, which is by itself a part of the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manshimajin Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 A good reply to a political virtual non-entity. I wonder if any of the others are shuffling around in their seats in embarrassment that someone has dared to say something rude to an English peer? Surely we should all be touching our forelocks to a Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellyup Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 A good reply to a political virtual non-entity. I wonder if any of the others are shuffling around in their seats in embarrassment that someone has dared to say something rude to an English peer? Surely we should all be touching our forelocks to a Lord. Is it that the UK has some hold over the IOM? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah 01 Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Awaiting to be branded 'elitist' but regretably, the majority of our 'politicos' are not sufficiently educated to draft such a response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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