jonnyrotten Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 Total nonsense If you are watching a race, you have to appreciate that your odds of being injured are higher that if you stay at home. Of course that's just my opinion, and you are entitled to your own. The trouble is, the odds are much higher in places where there's no run-off, no barriers and no safety fencing. All that namby-pamby stuff that was introduced at circuits all over the world fifty years ago for exactly this reason. Long before the arrival of the health and safety nannies all the blood and guts TT supporters take so much pleasure in sneering at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMC Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 That's why it's called 'Motorcycle Racing' as opposed to 'Motorcycle Tootling Along' numbnuts. Yes it is racing, but around the Mountain Course it's a time trial, and as such, it's the time for each individual rider on their own, and not head to head on the road with other racers!! What I was getting at, is that an individual will go at their own pace, and in their own safety zone. However, if a board appears part way round the course as it does, to suggest they are being caught on corrected time, then that individual might up the pace over and above their own ability. It must make an effect on the riders, and could, and I mean could contribute to mistakes and possible incidents. I look forward to hearing all about 'heightless climbing' too. I wish you would give more credit to the riders, organisers and everyone involved who are very much aware of their own skills and abilities, those of others, or in some cases the lack of experience of some on the TT course. These people are not idiots and don't go out with a deathwish, nor do they send people out who are likely to be incapable of riding the course. Many people try to extend their own ability in whatever they do, it's often called ambition, effort, and challenge in the workplace, but sometimes in other areas of life it involves daring or just wishing to seek to undertake things that involve risk or danger and/or just enjoying being emotionally aroused and worked up by such challenges etc. - and very many other words and phrases that describe interesting human beings who do not want to sit cocooned in a life-barrier of cotton wool like you. You could limit the speeds of bikes to 100mph, but some people would still inevitably be killed - by oil spills, mechanical failures or animals on the track etc. People got killed on the course when average speeds were less than 45mph. Answer me please. What is your real problem with other people doing what they want to do, even if that involves only risking themselves? what is your mission in all this? what is even your right to say it? when it is the freedom of choice of others, and not you? This self-righteous and arrogant thinking seeking to control my and other people's lives and destinies, when not harming others, whilst inferring such behaviour as motorcycle racing is childlike or irresponsible, really gets on my tits. Jebus - forget about the motorcycle race - join the human race - and realise, even if you personally don't like it or approve of it, that other people are willing, able and have the right to take responsibility for their own lives, even if that involves some risk. Albert, I was only making a suggestion, and if you had followed my membership on here, and various other sites, you would know that I am 100% behind all RRR. I have and do help sponsor riders and also fund raise for the Rob Vine and the MGP Helicopter fund. Oh, and my website is called RoadRacingSupporters.Com ??????? As I said, it was only a suggestion, and certainly not intended to have a go at the sport that I support and follow. OK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 Albert, I was only making a suggestion, and if you had followed my membership on here, and various other sites, you would know that I am 100% behind all RRR. I have and do help sponsor riders and also fund raise for the Rob Vine and the MGP Helicopter fund. Oh, and my website is called RoadRacingSupporters.Com ??????? As I said, it was only a suggestion, and certainly not intended to have a go at the sport that I support and follow. OK I think that's what they call a 'Blue On Blue' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTF Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 Total nonsense If you are watching a race, you have to appreciate that your odds of being injured are higher that if you stay at home. Of course that's just my opinion, and you are entitled to your own. ofcourse they increase, but it still doesn't make you involved. it is only the 'involved' aspect of AT's post i don't agree with. why does watching constitute involvement?? you can be involved without watching and watching without being involved. AT's post suggested to me ( ?? ) that if you are watching you ARE involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 Total nonsense If you are watching a race, you have to appreciate that your odds of being injured are higher that if you stay at home. Of course that's just my opinion, and you are entitled to your own. ofcourse they increase, but it still doesn't make you involved. it is only the 'involved' aspect of AT's post i don't agree with. why does watching constitute involvement?? you can be involved without watching and watching without being involved. AT's post suggested to me ( ?? ) that if you are watching you ARE involved. I think spectators are involved. They are warned of the dangers, 'marshalled' and restricted where they can watch, and make the conscious decision to become involved by the very definition of the word 'spectator'. I also think that they are in one place just watching the races...not riding their bikes, not doing DIY, not showering and not risking standing on the soap in the shower etc. - and are therefore actually safer. Sounds nuts? Not really - studies showed the 1991 gulf war actually saved quite a lot of American lives too...those that would have otherwise been killed doing something else instead, like riding motorbikes, having accidents, getting robbed and killed, and getting into fights and killing each other etc. etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 I think spectators are involved. They are warned of the dangers, 'marshalled' and restricted where they can watch, and make the conscious decision to become involved by the very definition of the word 'spectator'. Are spectators really warned of the dangers? I never have been. I went to the bottom of Bray for 10 minutes during TT week, thought "actually, this feels pretty dangerous" and left. Nobody warned me of the dangers - is that because it was deemed safe by others and not restricted? I also think that they are in one place just watching the races...not riding their bikes, not doing DIY, not showering and not risking standing on the soap in the shower etc. - and are therefore actually safer. Sounds nuts? Not really - studies showed the 1991 gulf war actually saved quite a lot of American lives too...those that would have otherwise been killed doing something else instead, like riding motorbikes, having accidents, getting robbed and killed, and getting into fights and killing each other etc. etc. Link please. Because I'm calling bullshit on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesypeas Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 If you are sitting at the side of the TT course and don't appreciate the risk, you must be a bit of a retard don't you think? Bikes travelling at 100mph plus within 10 feet of you. Wouldn't you be asking youself serious questions such as, what happens to me if this bike locks up ? Would you play with a snake if you didn't know it was dangerous? Would you bollix, you would use caution. Same as the TT course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 If you are sitting at the side of the TT course and don't appreciate the risk, you must be a bit of a retard don't you think? Do you mean like the people who got killed a couple of years ago? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 I think spectators are involved. They are warned of the dangers, 'marshalled' and restricted where they can watch, and make the conscious decision to become involved by the very definition of the word 'spectator'. Are spectators really warned of the dangers? I never have been. I went to the bottom of Bray for 10 minutes during TT week, thought "actually, this feels pretty dangerous" and left. Nobody warned me of the dangers - is that because it was deemed safe by others and not restricted? I also think that they are in one place just watching the races...not riding their bikes, not doing DIY, not showering and not risking standing on the soap in the shower etc. - and are therefore actually safer. Sounds nuts? Not really - studies showed the 1991 gulf war actually saved quite a lot of American lives too...those that would have otherwise been killed doing something else instead, like riding motorbikes, having accidents, getting robbed and killed, and getting into fights and killing each other etc. etc. Link please. Because I'm calling bullshit on this one. Here you go for starters. "In 1991 American soldiers in the Persian Gulf War had a lower death rate than their counterparts who stayed home. More died of traffic accidents than from Iraqi weapons." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesypeas Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 If you are sitting at the side of the TT course and don't appreciate the risk, you must be a bit of a retard don't you think? Do you mean like the people who got killed a couple of years ago? I'm sure if you asked them if there was an increased risk of injury watching motor sport, they would have agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinahand Posted September 5, 2009 Author Share Posted September 5, 2009 Sorry Cheasypeas but can you clarify yourself. Do you really think that those people would have said that they had correctly anticipated the risks and would not have changed their viewing arrangements if they had gained a fuller picture of the risks they were facing? My belief is that people are not correctly estimating the risks involved in the sport - and so are exposing themselves to more danger than they realize. I think Keyboarder has correctly pointed out that alot of this is down to under-reporting of the carnage the racing causes. Xpert pointed out that the helicopter was continuously coming into Nobles during racing on Friday - I've looked at Manx Radio and there is some indication of the accidents - the leading rider crashed out, but the coverage basically glosses over the accidents concentrating on the results. How many riders sustained injury over the week of racing? I think the injuries are massively under-reported - so it is difficult for both riders and spectators to calculate the risks involved - the result: continuing levels of accidents year in and year out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesypeas Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 One of those injured in the incident mentioned was a marshall. I would have thought she knew the risks. Couldn't those helicopters have been filming? Do we know for certain they were conveying casualties? I cannot believe that any rational person stands at the side of the course, and doesn't question the risk. If they don't, I believe they must be stupid. If you believe otherwise then so be it. I would bet that most people in here would agree with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 My belief is that people are not correctly estimating the risks involved in the sport - and so are exposing themselves to more danger than they realize. That's a throw away statement that applies to everything, in both under and over estimation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTF Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 One of those injured in the incident mentioned was a marshall. I would have thought she knew the risks. Couldn't those helicopters have been filming? Do we know for certain they were conveying casualties? I cannot believe that any rational person stands at the side of the course, and doesn't question the risk. If they don't, I believe they must be stupid. If you believe otherwise then so be it. I would bet that most people in here would agree with me. i think people see the risks for the riders, but they don't expect to twatted to death by flying debris if a rider crashes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesypeas Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 Really ? How bizzare Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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