Should Polanski Pay?

[Declan]

I agree. It shows an alarming degree of ignorance to suggest that having sex with a sexually mature person is paedophilia.

So "if there's grass on the pitch you can play?" or at least you ain't a paedophile? I don't buy that, there's more to sexual attraction than "bits & pieces". It doesn't change the person's personality, outlook, or maturity.

[thesultanofsheight]

I do tend to agree in the sense that the 'types' of people referred to as paedophiles who keep pics of kids, want to and do have sex with children under eleven or ten are quite a different thing to those people of whatever age who have sex with a teenager. Nevertheless, I think it still possible to label him as a paedophile in the sense that a person's sexual maturity is not the only indicator of whether they are a child or not. I don't even think it is the most important consideration in such a judgement.

 

There is also a type (I went to school with a few who I saw hanging around the school gates in their flash cars well into their mid 20's) of man who is interested in young teenage girls (14, 15, 16 or so) and who do it because they are not mentally and emotionally mature and they could get away with doing stuff that older more confident women would not put up with. Its still wrong and borderline paedophile activity to me. So I agree with you LDV sexual maturity is irrelevant when faced with opportunistic and predatory sexual behaviour.

[macmannin]

And campervans too,eh Sebrof?

[La_Dolce_Vita]

There is also a type (I went to school with a few who I saw hanging around the school gates in their flash cars well into their mid 20's) of man who is interested in young teenage girls (14, 15, 16 or so) and who do it because they are not mentally and emotionally mature and they could get away with doing stuff that older more confident women would not put up with. Its still wrong and borderline paedophile activity to me.

Not so sure what you mean by that. People on here seem to unsure of what they mean by paedophile. Are we talking about the desire and act of having sex with children or some separate type of being with a separate but distinct state of mind.

 

I think that older people who go after teens may likely have a sexual preference for that age group. I don't think there is much more to it than that. However, if they are going after teens to have as girlfriends then the issue of power comes into it. I might not be that the girls are immature, but rather they are not as mature as the older person and therefore will be dominated by that other person. It appears to me to be a sign of men or women who have control and power over someone.

[Miss Take]

When I was 13, sex was just a word that I didn't understand the meaning of. Some of my peers at that age seemed to be sexually aware, to the point that they would start conversations about sex to 'show off' their knowledge. There was an element of jealousy amongst the rest of us that these girls were somehow more 'adult' than the rest of us.

 

But with the benefit of hindsight I am 100% sure that while these girls may indeed have been old enough to have sex and not feel damaged by the experience, the 'maturity' they showed came as a result of other factors in their life that meant they were indeed damaged. Whether having sex at a young age was a means of getting affection and attention I don't know, but I strongly suspect that that was the case.

 

But to some of the posters on here, this would be the kind of girl who would be 'sexually mature and aware' and that men who desired to have sex with these girls would not necessarily be in the wrong.

 

It is wrong.

 

In the culture we live in (it's irrelevant what other cultures deem, we have not grown up in those cultures), 13 is too young for a girl to be fully sexually aware and able to make informed decisions with regard to sexual partners.

 

Perhaps there are a few, a very few who are. But it should never be assumed that just because a young girl seems like she is sexually mature that she actually is. This is why the law is there - to protect these girls.

 

Also to say - there is a whole world of difference between a young girl who is becoming sexually mature and exploring her sexuality with someone she feels she loves and is a peer to her and a young girl who appears sexually mature who finds herself drunk and incapable with a strange man in his 40s who likes 'em young.

 

Any adult who finds themselves in this situation and chooses to take advantage of the girl is a disgrace to manhood.

[La_Dolce_Vita]

In the culture we live in (it's irrelevant what other cultures deem, we have not grown up in those cultures), 13 is too young for a girl to be fully sexually aware and able to make informed decisions with regard to sexual partners.

Unless it is two 13 year olds or similarly ages people having sex. Nothing wrong with that.

[Chinahand]

Sebrof - I agree that there is a distinction between morality and law.

 

On the legal side, I believe Polanski has a case to answer for, and absconded to escape from doing that.

 

On the moral side I reiterate I find it disturbing that you are claiming their is no moral issue in a 44 year old man plying a 13 year old with drugs and drink and then having sex with her including sodomy.

 

I think those facts of the case are basically undisputed - you seem to be claiming they are, I don't know for what justification, but lets play it by your rules. Morally I say that it is wrong for a 44 year old man to have straight consensual sex with a 13 year old.

 

We are not an agricultural society where girls are forced to bear children from menstruous, we acknowledge that emotional maturity is different from sexual maturity and give minors time to mature.

 

This girl wasn't 18, or 16, she was 13. If she had been 16 and it was straight consentual sex, with no booze, drugs or sodomy, I think it would be distasteful, but not immoral, but if the perpetrator showed a pattern of such "romances" I would question the morality of such behaviour - it is predatory and emotionally damaging. If he used drugs, or sodomized on the first time I would say it was immoral.

 

I really find it disturbing that people are making petty-fogging distinctions in this case.

[Sebrof]

When I was 13, sex was just a word that I didn't understand the meaning of. Some of my peers at that age seemed to be sexually aware, to the point that they would start conversations about sex to 'show off' their knowledge. There was an element of jealousy amongst the rest of us that these girls were somehow more 'adult' than the rest of us.

 

But with the benefit of hindsight I am 100% sure that while these girls may indeed have been old enough to have sex and not feel damaged by the experience, the 'maturity' they showed came as a result of other factors in their life that meant they were indeed damaged. Whether having sex at a young age was a means of getting affection and attention I don't know, but I strongly suspect that that was the case.

 

But to some of the posters on here, this would be the kind of girl who would be 'sexually mature and aware' and that men who desired to have sex with these girls would not necessarily be in the wrong.

 

It is wrong.

 

In the culture we live in (it's irrelevant what other cultures deem, we have not grown up in those cultures), 13 is too young for a girl to be fully sexually aware and able to make informed decisions with regard to sexual partners.

 

Perhaps there are a few, a very few who are. But it should never be assumed that just because a young girl seems like she is sexually mature that she actually is. This is why the law is there - to protect these girls.

 

Also to say - there is a whole world of difference between a young girl who is becoming sexually mature and exploring her sexuality with someone she feels she loves and is a peer to her and a young girl who appears sexually mature who finds herself drunk and incapable with a strange man in his 40s who likes 'em young.

 

Any adult who finds themselves in this situation and chooses to take advantage of the girl is a disgrace to manhood.

 

Thank you for a reasoned contribution.

 

In many of my posts I said I didn't condone Polanski's behaviour. But I do object to loose usage of the term paedophilia because it suggests that there is little difference between what Polanski did and the (in my view) much more damaging and exploitative behaviour of real paedophiles, like the recent care-home workers, who abused very young children day after day.

 

But because they weren't famous, nobody seems to have got very worked up over them.

 

S

[thesultanofsheight]

But I do object to loose usage of the term paedophilia because it suggests that there is little difference between what Polanski did and the (in my view) much more damaging and exploitative behaviour of real paedophiles

 

He drugged, raped, and had anal sex with a 13 year old yet you don't think he's a REAL PAEDOPHILE?

 

You can dress it up how you like and argue on the strict legal distinctions but the girl (note I said girl not woman) was well under the age of consent and was plied with drink and drugs by a man in his forties.

 

What is the difference between this act and what a "real" paedophile does? Please enlighten me?

 

PS: Just noticed that Sebrof has logged off and MDO logs immediately back on. Funny that. I wonder what arguments will now ensue from MDO to try to stop Sebrof's posts being criticised?

[MilitantDogOwner]

He drugged, raped, and had anal sex with a 13 year old yet you don't think he's a REAL PAEDOPHILE?

 

I was under the impression that the drugs and sodomy charges had been dropped. I could be wrong though.

 

...was well under the age of consent..

 

So now age of consent is an issue? You really need to make your mind up.

[thesultanofsheight]

He drugged, raped, and had anal sex with a 13 year old yet you don't think he's a REAL PAEDOPHILE?

 

I was under the impression that the drugs and sodomy charges had been dropped. I could be wrong though.

 

...was well under the age of consent..

 

So now age of consent is an issue? You really need to make your mind up.

 

Great. Got you. You were posting as I was editing my post. So transparent you are too ......

[La_Dolce_Vita]

He drugged, raped, and had anal sex with a 13 year old yet you don't think he's a REAL PAEDOPHILE?

 

I was under the impression that the drugs and sodomy charges had been dropped. I could be wrong though.

Due to a plea bargain, wasn't it?

[P.K.]

I was under the impression that the drugs and sodomy charges had been dropped. I could be wrong though.

So that's all right then!

 

Actually, no it isn't...

[MilitantDogOwner]

I was mearly pointing out that people are making claims that are potentially wrong.

 

You know, talking about facts, not just stuff they made up or heard of bloke down the pub.

[P.K.]

So if the charges are dropped does that mean drugging a minor for sodomy is acceptable?

 

You know, talking about facts...