Islam4uk March Through Wootton Bassett

[Rog]

No, they're an Islamic group hell bent on installing Islam in the UK.

Ther's a clue in the name 'Islam4UK'.

That's right. I know they are. What is your point, Rog?

 

 

The proposed march wasn't about condemning the war, it was about raising the stakes in the continued attempt to instill Islam in the UK.

 

That shower will have gained huge kudos simply by proposing the ‘march’ and be seen to be defying the British government.

 

They were set to win no matter what the outcome proved to be. Even their backing down in the face of the whole group being banned if they did not will be played to their advantage in Mosques on Friday up and down the land.

[Chinahand]

Semantics. Occupation is how it's actually perceived by most Afghans - who have already undergone recent decades of occupation since the 1980s, let alone occupation going back into earlier last century.

Is that true?

 

Link

 

Fifty-nine per cent think the government is making some or a lot of progress in providing a better life, 38% say little or no progress (no comparison). Forty-eight per cent think the government is doing a good or excellent job, down from 59% last year and 80% in 2005. Afghan President Hamid Karzai's equivalent figures are 52%, as against 63% last time and 83% in 2005.

 

Sixty-three per cent support the presence of US forces – down from 71% in 2007 and 78% in 2006. Support for other foreign forces, including Britain, stands at 59%, down from 67% last year and 78% in 2006. There's an increase in the number of people who think foreign forces should start pulling out straight away – 21%, up from 14% last year (when the question addressed only US forces).

 

Link 2

 

Sure you can say these surveys aren't worth anything - but some bloody brave researchers have headed out and found the 3000 odd people in these surveys and asked them their opinion - that's far more than most journalists do, and has some validity in trying to understand what Afghans think - and it isn't as negative as is being made out.

 

Is Afghanistan "winnable" - Iraq has started the process of reconciling itself to its new situation - the vast majority of people just want to get on with there lives and that old Northern Irish phrase "an acceptable level of violence" means the hot war has mutated into a long war where the ballot box slowly usurps the gun.

 

Afghanistan isn't there yet - but less than 1% of the population say they support the Taliban, 62% believe the country is moving in the right direction, and only 3% believe foreign forces are either the biggest or second biggest problem the country is facing.

 

Journalists go to trouble spots - 20 years ago surveying opinion on the Bogside would show overwhelming anger against the political situation in NI. Something akin to that is happening in the reporting of Afghanistan that Albert has picked up on - reality is far more complex 62% report a favourable view of the US.

They've updated the survey - the results show more than ever that Afghans think their country is moving in the right direction, that the foreign forces are helping this and that the Taliban isn't wanted.

 

Overall very hopeful.

[Albert Tatlock]

They've updated the survey - the results show more than ever that Afghans think their country is moving in the right direction, that the foreign forces are helping this and that the Taliban isn't wanted.

 

Overall very hopeful.

And nothing of course to do with if they happen to say: 'I support the Taliban, and don't like Americans'...risking getting shot at, and their house blown up.

[P.K.]

They've updated the survey - the results show more than ever that Afghans think their country is moving in the right direction, that the foreign forces are helping this and that the Taliban isn't wanted.

 

Overall very hopeful.

And nothing of course to do with if they happen to say: 'I support the Taliban, and don't like Americans'...risking getting shot at, and their house blown up.

Knobhead. The Afghans want the Nato planks to come down harder. The Taliban descend on a village and expect food and shelter. They quote this as "local support". Well, peasants aren't actually going to stand up to gangs of heavily armed tossers demanding succour. Funny that...

 

Give it up Albert, the locals don't actually agree with your BBB shallow view of the world...

[Freggyragh]

PK, you haven't forgotten your medication again have you?

[La_Dolce_Vita]

They were set to win no matter what the outcome proved to be. Even their backing down in the face of the whole group being banned if they did not will be played to their advantage in Mosques on Friday up and down the land.

And what about our 'win'. Winning is haven't the government and anti-democratic populace demand a ban. Big lose.

 

They've updated the survey - the results show more than ever that Afghans think their country is moving in the right direction, that the foreign forces are helping this and that the Taliban isn't wanted. Overall very hopeful.

Essentially they are just happier because a less oppressive regime exists. Great. But we should get out now, that isn't a good justification to stay.

[Albert Tatlock]

They've updated the survey - the results show more than ever that Afghans think their country is moving in the right direction, that the foreign forces are helping this and that the Taliban isn't wanted.

 

Overall very hopeful.

And nothing of course to do with if they happen to say: 'I support the Taliban, and don't like Americans'...risking getting shot at, and their house blown up.

Knobhead. The Afghans want the Nato planks to come down harder. The Taliban descend on a village and expect food and shelter. They quote this as "local support". Well, peasants aren't actually going to stand up to gangs of heavily armed tossers demanding succour. Funny that...

 

Give it up Albert, the locals don't actually agree with your BBB shallow view of the world...

It was a tongue in cheek comment...what's a 'BBB'? or is there something wrong with your keyboard?

[P.K.]

PK, you haven't forgotten your medication again have you?

Actually last night I had a really good dose of the Norovirus with some quite spectacular "projectile vomiting".

 

Picked it up in a hospital where it's managed to get out onto the wards. Not at all nice for the patients and staff.

[gazza]

I see they just outlawed the group now.

[jimbms]

I see they just outlawed the group now.

Link?

[Amadeus]

I see they just outlawed the group now.

Link?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8453560.stm

[gazza]

problem i see with banning it is.

the group will go under ground, least if its in the open they can be tracked kept an eye on etc

[aimeejulia]

they should try and have a discussion with these people instead of driving them underground where their will feel spurned and more likely to turn to violence. also i think their popularity with radicals will increase because they are seen as being defiant.

 

they seem to want the uk to adopt the sharia law which would in todays multcultural society not be practical as in the uk alone there are hundreds of different religions and thus it would be unfair if only one religion is represented in the law. The law should always be representative off all members of the country irrespective of the who they are.

 

The government should sit down at a table with these people and explain the reasons why the sharia law cannot be adopted by the uk instead of shunning them.

[gazza]

they should try and have a discussion with these people instead of driving them underground where their will feel spurned and more likely to turn to violence. also i think their popularity with radicals will increase because they are seen as being defiant.

 

they seem to want the uk to adopt the sharia law which would in todays multcultural society not be practical as in the uk alone there are hundreds of different religions and thus it would be unfair if only one religion is represented in the law. The law should always be representative off all members of the country irrespective of the who they are.

 

The government should sit down at a table with these people and explain the reasons why the sharia law cannot be adopted by the uk instead of shunning them.

 

while yes you think that would work.

these people would not listen its there way or no way, they would not take a comprmise

[Amadeus]

they should try and have a discussion with these people instead of driving them underground where their will feel spurned and more likely to turn to violence. also i think their popularity with radicals will increase because they are seen as being defiant.

 

they seem to want the uk to adopt the sharia law which would in todays multcultural society not be practical as in the uk alone there are hundreds of different religions and thus it would be unfair if only one religion is represented in the law. The law should always be representative off all members of the country irrespective of the who they are.

 

The government should sit down at a table with these people and explain the reasons why the sharia law cannot be adopted by the uk instead of shunning them.

They don't appear like the sort of people who are interested in peaceful talks, though.