Blair's Book

[BlitzBrione]

Hopefully with Blair in such a generous mood perhaps he'll also divert a few quid to easing the agonies of the hundreds of thousands of lives he helped shatter in Iraq. السلام يكون معكم جميعا. توني بلير سوف تحترق في الجحيم

[censorship]

Hopefully with Blair in such a generous mood perhaps he'll also divert a few quid to easing the agonies of the hundreds of thousands of lives he helped shatter in Iraq. السلام يكون معكم جميعا. توني بلير سوف تحترق في الجحيم

Just a few quid? That's not very ambitious, or perhaps you don't value Arabic lives very highly.

[manshimajin]

I don't think it is the case that MOST sensible people rejected the case for war - many accepted it, and now intensely regret it.

 

It was a polarized time with many millions opposing the war and marching in the streets, but also many millions agreed that action needed to be taken.

 

Most of those people have changed their mind - that IS a significant shift in opinion and it is objectively visible in the polls - see this populus poll documenting a fall from 63% supporting the war in April 03 to only 31% in Feb 07 - I can only call that a significant mood shift!

One is reminded of that Horace Walpole quote "now they are ringing the bells soon they will be ringing their hands". Wars often start off with the majority standing around in the streets cheering.

[censorship]

One is reminded of that Horace Walpole quote "now they are ringing the bells soon they will be ringing their hands". Wars often start off with the majority standing around in the streets cheering.

wringing their hands

[T.I.N.G.]

A bit rude, correcting a quote.

What a cunt.

[BlitzBrione]

Hopefully with Blair in such a generous mood perhaps he'll also divert a few quid to easing the agonies of the hundreds of thousands of lives he helped shatter in Iraq. السلام يكون معكم جميعا. توني بلير سوف تحترق في الجحيم

Just a few quid? That's not very ambitious, or perhaps you don't value Arabic lives very highly.

Oh god, why even bother.....here's a dick definition of sarcasm for you: 1 : a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain

2 a : a mode of satirical wit depending for its effect on bitter, caustic, and often ironic language that is usually directed against an individual

 

And no distinction whatsoever when innocents are slaughtered....including, of course, our brothers & sisters in Iraq

[Mr. Sausages]

Look, unlike you, I don't delight in cruelty so I won't go down the route of discussing your personal, off-forum life in public...

 

But that's exactly the route you have gone down. Or at least, attempted to.

 

And I happen to know that in real life you're far more disliked that slinkydevil, due to your obnoxious treatment of people and volatile temperament.*

 

 

 

 

 

 

*I made that up, see how easy it is?

[the mo beats experience]

Although obviously in hindsight Iraq didn't have WMD's, they DID have WFSD's, Scud missiles, a weapon that could reach neighbouring countries. This weapon was also banned, yet no one really seizes upon this, its not a weapon of mass destruction, but it is a weapon of fair sized destruction.

I think it was right to get rid of Saddam, no matter how pathetic he ended up looking, this was a mass murderer, of his own people no less, people seem to forget this.

 

Just wanted to throw that out there.

 

Edited because i forgot how to spell distruction.

[ballaughbiker]

Quite so mo but there's a bit of difference between a wmd and a scud... I doubt TB would have got a mandate to go to war if they just had scuds. Well I don't just doubt it, he wouldn't have and neither would he if the decision makers had known the true status of no wmds at the time.

 

First of all re joining up - if you can't take a joke you shouldn't have joined! Essentially you give your permission to let the government of the day put you in harms way wherever and whenever it chooses. End of.

Hmmm End of means I don't want to discuss it any more... However I agree with you and this is made 100% clear at the recruitment stage. Well it was back in the 80s when I applied for a 5 year SSC, as if we didn't already know ffs! However there's a very big difference between consenting to being put in harm's way and people nicely comfortable and safe back home saying the likes of 'if you join, you deserve all you get'.

 

Thirdly all this talk about dodgy dossiers, 45-minute claims, the pathetic "No WMD found in Iraq" mantra spewed out by the BBB's as though it's everything they need to condemn and all the rest of their bs completely misses the point - exactly as intended.

Well it might but that was his reason / his mantra to the country for going to war. It is therefore relevant to bring it up now when there were no wmds.

 

The West needs a stable Middle East to function

Agreed but do you really think Iran is developing/was developing nukes just to stop another war with SH? Doesn't Israel come into this anywhere? If SH was still there, Iran would still like the power to nuke Israel. Getting rid of SH has not altered that.

 

I admire the way Blair changed British politics forever

Me too. I agreed with much he did during his reign. Unfortunately going to war is the thing he will be remembered for and not in the way he wants, hence trying to make apparent amends now.

[P.K.]

Well it might but that was his reason / his mantra to the country for going to war. It is therefore relevant to bring it up now when there were no wmds.

 

We've been here before.

 

If there were no WMD's what did Iraq use on the Iranians and the Kurds at Halabja then?

 

This "no wmds" claim is a complete and utter nonsense. You don't need to stockpile any wmd (and actually you don't as they can be very unstable) if you can make as much as you need tomorrow. Which is why the "no wmds" claim is a complete and utter nonsense. The Iraqis not only demonstrated that they could produce large quantities of VX, one of the most toxic nerve agents known, but they also demonstrated at Halabja and on the Pasdaran that they had the will and the means to use it. Jeeeze, just how thick are some folks???

 

However there's a very big difference between consenting to being put in harm's way and people nicely comfortable and safe back home saying the likes of 'if you join, you deserve all you get'.

 

We've been here before as well.

 

If you can't take a joke you shouldn't have joined...

 

Unfortunately going to war is the thing he will be remembered for and not in the way he wants, hence trying to make apparent amends now.

 

I don't think he's trying to make amends at all. He's a very smart operator and he would have been well aware of how this extremely generous gesture would be viewed by the all BBB's and the rabidly anti-Labour press, which is to say most of them. He didn't have to attract all this adverse publicity but he did it anyway. Personally I have to admire the cojones it takes to do that.

[censorship]

A bit rude, correcting a quote.

What a cunt.

[censorship]

 

Oh god, why even bother.....here's a dick definition of sarcasm for you: 1 : a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain

2 a : a mode of satirical wit depending for its effect on bitter, caustic, and often ironic language that is usually directed against an individual

Apologies, the tone of sarcasm didn't come through to me, I thought you were just an uncaring cunt.

 

And no distinction whatsoever when innocents are slaughtered....including, of course, our brothers & sisters in Iraq

You have my deepest sympathies about the loss of your relatives, how many brothers and sisters did you lose?

[censorship]

But that's exactly the route you have gone down. Or at least, attempted to.

And I happen to know that in real life you're far more disliked that slinkydevil, due to your obnoxious treatment of people and volatile temperament.*

*I made that up, see how easy it is?

 

I fully understand the point you are making, it is easy to make things up on anonymous forum for fun or mischief. That simply isn't the case in this instance, as this individual well knows, and no, I'm not going to go into detail partially out of respect for this individual's privacy, but also out of respect, and sympathy, for other parties who understand only too well what a 'bully' really is.

[Mr. Sausages]

I fully understand the point you are making, it is easy to make things up on anonymous forum for fun or mischief. That simply isn't the case in this instance, as this individual well knows, and no, I'm not going to go into detail partially out of respect for this individual's privacy, but also out of respect, and sympathy, for other parties who understand only too well what a 'bully' really is.

 

One man's bully is another man's strong character. Assuming you're not mistaken in some way, or lying, then all you're doing is exposing your own feelings and perception about a stituation. And you're doing it anonymously, and publicly. A route you claim to be trying to avoid, without actually make much effort to avoid.

 

Who's the bully again?

[censorship]

One man's bully is another man's strong character. Assuming you're not mistaken in some way, or lying, then all you're doing is exposing your own feelings and perception about a stituation. And you're doing it anonymously, and publicly. A route you claim to be trying to avoid, without actually make much effort to avoid.

 

Who's the bully again?

Look, I don't want to get into this, but to explain....I did let my personal feelings spill over into a post on another subject (cheese) in which I accused someone of being a bully. I shouldn't have done that, even if it is true, and decided not to post in that thread any more.

That issue was brought up by the individual on this thread, not by me, and all I have done is stand up for myself (which I can imagine is something this person doesn't like) and declined to go into detail. I'm happy never to mention it again, at least on this forum.