Tempus Fugit Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 (edited) Mezeron are also shiping Vans, motor homes and cars, In fairness, they always have. True,but now from Douglas. 7mt motor home on IOMSP + 2 passengers £246 same truck on Channel Tunnel + 4 passengers £59, DFDS ferries to Dunkirk £13, LD lines Ostend £19, all return fares ????? eh ? eurotunnel: car + 2, 3-day return £175 ! will have to get myself a 7m motorhome (or was that mt = metric tonnes ?) Edited November 3, 2010 by Tempus Fugit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blade Runner Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 The IOMSP have been taking us for a ride for a long time and their margins are outrageous, bring on the competition. Please Mr Woodward tell us how 30+% margins ( 3x the industry average) and most likely understated, is not a good business model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminal Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Mezeron are also shiping Vans, motor homes and cars, In fairness, they always have. True,but now from Douglas. 7mt motor home on IOMSP + 2 passengers £246 same truck on Channel Tunnel + 4 passengers £59, DFDS ferries to Dunkirk £13, LD lines Ostend £19, all return fares ????? Anyone with a motorhome should take it and fuck off to Dunkirk permanently and free up their corpy house for someone who actually needs it at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blade Runner Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Mezeron are also shiping Vans, motor homes and cars, In fairness, they always have. True,but now from Douglas. 7mt motor home on IOMSP + 2 passengers £246 same truck on Channel Tunnel + 4 passengers £59, DFDS ferries to Dunkirk £13, LD lines Ostend £19, all return fares ????? Anyone with a motorhome should take it and fuck off to Dunkirk permanently and free up their corpy house for someone who actually needs it at the same time. Agreed, people with money don't buy a motorhome, they stay in very nice hotels. Large motorhome ownership is generally confined to the old, not that wealthy, retired, who have a dream to see the world or the council house tenant with a very high disposable income on the back of ridiculously low rents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThankU Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Mezeron are also shiping Vans, motor homes and cars, In fairness, they always have. True,but now from Douglas. 7mt motor home on IOMSP + 2 passengers £246 same truck on Channel Tunnel + 4 passengers £59, DFDS ferries to Dunkirk £13, LD lines Ostend £19, all return fares ????? Anyone with a motor home should take it and fuck off to Dunkirk permanently and free up their corpy house for someone who actually needs it at the same time. Why, Don't live in a Corpy, house, Ive paid for the motor home, parked on my own property and not on the street so whats your probs. Give more Corpy houses to the immigrants, at least they will look after them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThankU Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 (edited) Mezeron are also shiping Vans, motor homes and cars, In fairness, they always have. True,but now from Douglas. 7mt motor home on IOMSP + 2 passengers £246 same truck on Channel Tunnel + 4 passengers £59, DFDS ferries to Dunkirk £13, LD lines Ostend £19, all return fares ????? eh ? eurotunnel: car + 2, 3-day return £175 ! will have to get myself a 7m motorhome (or was that mt = metric tonnes ?) Looks like the may have put the prices up Please check your travel details summary. Going out (local time) Short Stay Saver Fare | Folkestone to Calais | Wednesday 04 May 2011 Check-in closes 00:53Departure time 01:23Arrival time 02:58 £52 Coming back (local time) Short Stay Saver Fare | Calais to Folkestone | Sunday 08 May 2011 Check-in closes 00:55Departure time 01:25Arrival time 01:00 £52 Vehicle details 7.5mt X 3.4mt Campervan + 4 Registration number: PMN4 Total cost of travel £104 ----------------------------------------- HomeFerries to FranceIrish SeaScotland-BelgiumDFDS SeawaysSpecial offersContact usBook online 1. Get quote 2. Select fare 3. Enter details 4. Book & pay Outward journey - Thursday 09 June 2011 Dover to Dunkirk (France) Crossing time is approximately 2 hrs. Departure Price Select 02:00 £ 13.50 04:00 £ 13.50 06:00 £ 25.00 08:00 £ 35.00 10:00 £ 39.00 12:00 £ 39.00 14:00 £ 32.00 16:00 £ 32.00 18:00 £ 32.00 20:00 £ 25.00 22:00 £ 25.00 23:59 £ 25.00 Return journey - Tuesday 14 June 2011 Dunkirk (France) to Dover Crossing time is approximately 2 hrs. Departure Price Select 02:01 £ 13.50 04:01 £ 13.50 06:01 £ 25.00 08:01 £ 27.00 10:01 £ 32.00 12:01 £ 35.00 14:01 £ 35.00 16:01 £ 39.00 18:01 £ 39.00 20:01 £ 27.00 22:01 £ 25.00 23:58 £ 25.00 Select your sailing times to determine the ferry fare. You can use the Previous day and Next day links to see if cheaper fares are available around the dates you intend to travel. How to find the cheapest fares Fare = £ 27.00 Fuel surchargesOn our Cross Channel route a fuel surcharge of £5.50/€6.00 per vehicle per single leg is applied. Fuel surcharges Fuel surcharges = £ 11.00 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Upgrade to First Class & VIP lounge access ■Save 20% of the onboard price by upgrading to First Class for just £9.60/€12.00 per person* ■First Class includes priority loading and discharge** ■Enjoy the exclusive spacious and luxuriously appointed seating area ■Our VIP lounge is perfect for business or relaxation ■Keep up to date with complimentary newspapers & WiFi access *First Class is not accessible to children under the age of eight **Priority loading and discharge is subject to terms and conditions as described on the First Class & VIP lounge page Take a look at the First Class & VIP lounge VIP lounge to Dunkirk (France) 0 1 2 VIP lounge to Dover 0 1 2 VIP lounge = £ 0.00 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Vehicle length Your ferry fare is based on your vehicle conforming to the standard dimensions expected by Norfolkline. Additional charges are applied for vehicles that exceed these standard dimensions. Standard vehicle lengths Vehicle type description Car / Motorhome under 2.4m high Length up to 5 m 6 m 7 m 8 m 9 m 10 m 11 m 12 m 13 m 14 m 15 m Vehicle length charge = £ 0.00 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Card charges Payments are accepted using a variety of different payment mechanisms some of which carry a surcharge and some of which do not. For more detail on our payment mechanism policy click here. Credit card policy Payment using Select... American Express (£ 6.00) Carte Bleue (£ 0.00) GiroPay (£ 0.00) Laser (£ 1.00) Maestro - UK (£ 1.00) Mastercard (£ 4.00) PayPal (£ 0.00) Solo (£ 0.00) Visa (£ 4.50) Visa Delta / Debit (£ 1.00) Visa Electron (£ 0.00) iDEAL (£ 0.00) Card charge -.-- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Fare breakdown Your complete fare including all charges is shown. No additional charges will be applied to your booking. Ferry price £ 27.00 Fuel surcharges £ 11.00 Total = £ 38.00 Edited November 4, 2010 by ThankU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Login Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 This thread seems to be getting a bit personal and vitriolic. The SP are or will be doing all that they can to protect there business and profit margins whether or not the margins are obscene. That is why businesses exist. It is to make money for their shareholders/owners, preferably the higher return the better. It is what the directors are required to do by company law as they have a fiduciary responsbility to the shareholders. We may or may not like the way we perceive they have, are and will go about that but that is what they are required to do. Pricing and customer service etc are obvioulsy tools to maximise your profits as are shafting your opposition and competitors. Basically business is not a nice cosy world and you use whatever is legal at your disposal to get ahead including the political card and you can be fairly sure the SP will play that the best they can. You have already seen in the gentle warnings about cut backs they have started to ensure MHk's and Government are being fed the message. Is that wrong? Well possibly some may argue it is ethically but if you believe you have a strong card to play then play it. You are silly folding whilst you still think you have an ace up your sleeve. Accordingly I think it is possible for see how the SP will play this and it is fairly straight forward. You put prices up by cutting out all the special fares. You cut back on sailings to the minimum under the user agreement. You also ensure they are at the times that most suit freight customers and inconvenience passengers so only one boat a day to Heysam and that will be the evening night boat. In other words you hit the individual user hard who will start moaning and complaining. Maybe you hit tourism and the TT as there is very limited capacity with the cut back schedule. Who will people moan to apart from sites like this? Well to the press, MHK's and the Government. Who will they expect to resolve matters? Aggain MHK's and the Government and you can just see now Karran and the ilk demanding to know what the Government are doing about the situation and why have they not resolved. For the SP it is perfect timing just before an election when the MHK's are looking to be reelected. Now the Govt can not cancel the user agreement without the SP's agreement unless the SP are in default as they would get sued but more importantly Govt can not allow their to be any doubts over the credibility of government contracts they enter into. They can not be seen just to cancel them without sound legal reason even though you or I might think thei is a good logical reason to do so. So what are the options? Stand up to the SP and hopefully call the SP's bluff or renegotiate. With an election in the offing I would not have much faith that the Govt would not scurry to the negotiating table and if I was a betting man I can see some hand outs been given to the SP to support passenger service before the election next year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeky boy Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 I agree, but what's to stop Mezeron doing the same should they take over the SPC ? Maybe a solution would be for the government not to have a UA, but to charge for the use of the linkspans and hand that money back to whichever operator in the form of a passenger subsidy. That would leave the business open to competition but still promote a passenger service. Bearing in mind that we still have a viable tourist industry which needs to be nurtured Stand again next year - please. Flaw in that is that Mezzeron are not using the link span so basically you again have what you have now. The only difference is that rather than the freigt to passenger subsidy being internally done by the ferry operator the government would be doing! Alterative candidate please! I was thinking along the lines of charging per metre of freight for the use of the liknspans, that money would then be allocated on a per passenger basis back to the operator The DHPP or whatever they are now could then insist that only bulk cargo is loaded non ro-ro ensuring that all road freight used the linkspans Thank you for your input PS, the papers have been late every morning this week. Is this the SPC turning the screw? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Login Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 I was thinking along the lines of charging per metre of freight for the use of the liknspans, that money would then be allocated on a per passenger basis back to the operatorThe DHPP or whatever they are now could then insist that only bulk cargo is loaded non ro-ro ensuring that all road freight used the linkspans Thank you for your input PS, the papers have been late every morning this week. Is this the SPC turning the screw? So basically compulsory use and a levy on all freight being introduced to the IoM to subsidise passenger services. I can see that going down well with those who ship freight bbyand craine on and off i.e. Mezzeron. I can see the first that will happen is wwholesallers and retailers will put their prices up and blame the compulsory freight charge you introduced. I can not see that being a popular measure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Bowen Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 The IOMSP have been taking us for a ride for a long time and their margins are outrageous, bring on the competition. Please Mr Woodward tell us how 30+% margins ( 3x the industry average) and most likely understated, is not a good business model. That is very true and it has been a very comfortable ride to and from Heysham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bopalula Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Mezeron boat docked in Douglas at the weekend with a load of Stobart containers on Board, Look out local Hauliers, Big Eddies coming, Oh i forgot Stobarts are Tacos prefered hauliers I've seen Graylaw supplied containers that have both Stobart and Graylaw names on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilf_uk Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 You really cannot compare the dover/calais route with the Isle of Man route. The sheer volume of customers allows you to run an economy of scale - just look at what happens when there is any small problem with either the ferries or the Chunnel - operation stack (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Stack). The operators there can afford to make less per sailing as they make up for it overall in the number of sailings they do each day, and it is the same with the channel tunnel. There has also been a mentioned of DFDS and also that the SPCo 30% profit margin is 3 times the industry standard. Lets have a look at DFDS figures for 2009 - Ro-Ro Roll on-roll off: Ship type where cargo is driven on and off - most comparable to SPCo operation - but I have included other types of shipping to give an indication of the margins/ profits on these: 2009: Inc Profit Mgn Ro-Ro Shipping €403 €70 17% Container Shipping €157 €1 6% Passenger Shipping €218 €42 19% Terminal Services €75 €-2 -2.6% Trailer Services €104 €5 4.8% 2008 was pretty much the same as 2009, and I expect that was due to the economic situation. 2007: Inc Profit Mgn Ro-Ro Shipping €494 €120 24% Container Shipping €220 €20 9% Passenger Shipping €259 €33 12% Terminal Services €94 €2 2% Trailer Services €132 €8 6% (http://dfds.com/english/investorrelations/financial%20reports%20and%20presentations/annualreports/annual) I would really like to see the SPCo figures, broken down between freight and non-freight, and also added-value services. Also, do we know where the 36% figures comes from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempus Fugit Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 PS, the papers have been late every morning this week. Is this the SPC turning the screw? looking at the plots, BMC was in the bay : monday 05.30 tuesday 05.50 wednesday 07.00 (low tide @ Heysham 02.45) thursday 05.30 I see no reason for papers being late except wednesday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theambo Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Looks like the Gov and SP both have different views on the UA.... http://manxradio.com/newsread.aspx?id=48361 "Packet must 'fight for survival' Published online at 03/11/2010 01:30:32 Infrastructure Minister Phil Gawne, MHK The infrastructure minister has told the Steam Packet it can expect no special treatment from government, as it comes to terms with the rival freight service which has been set up by Ramsey based Mezeron, between Douglas and Liverpool. Phil Gawne says there is nothing in the government's user agreement with the company to prevent a container-based freight service out of the capital, and there has always been a possibility one could be started. He says the Steam Packet must fight to ensure its survival, and is confident it can overcome the problems it is facing, following the loss of key freight customers Tesco and Shoprite to the rival operation (play audio file): Steam Packet chief executive Mark Woodward has cliamed the Mezeron freight operation poses a threat to his company's passenger services, and Mezeron is not competing for freight busines on a level playing field. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy730 Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 The IOMSP have been taking us for a ride for a long time and their margins are outrageous, bring on the competition. Please Mr Woodward tell us how 30+% margins ( 3x the industry average) and most likely understated, is not a good business model. That is very true and it has been a very comfortable ride to and from Heysham I agree, although all my recent trips over the last 2 years on the Ben have been in a cabin. I've had just one trip on the Snaefell, and vowed to never again sail on it. Cold, damp and uncomfortable. I've also had a trip on the Manannan and was quite amazed on the amount of crew on board that didn't have English as their first language. Personally, this always bothers me as when things go badly wrong, as it can when at sea, people tend to panic in their own language. Finally, what ever happens to the Steam Racket/Mezeron saga, there's very little we on here can do about it anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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