Good News On Hiv?

[grant]

I think that deep down, the spook is aware that his bible contradicts itself so much that he has some misgivings as to the credibility of it all.

 

These little doubts, (that any sane person must have) probably cause an enormous amount of guilt. This could well be the cause of his anger and "non christians reap what they sowed" attitude.

 

All in all, a very poor advert for christianity.

[Evil Goblin]

I have in the past clearly shown that homosexuality is deviant. If you care to consult a dictionary you will find that it is also perverted, and in that Spook is perfectly correct.

[La_Dolce_Vita]

You haven't shown why deviance is a concept that should be recognised. Nor has spook demonstrated why it is perverted.

 

What you did in the past, Evil Goblin, is to demonstrate something that I already know. You demonstrated that you have a heterocentric understanding of sexuality using the dominant (heterosexual) discourse. All you have done is to try and force the idea that this discourse is valid. And it is one that marginalises everthing other than heterosexuality. I reject that discourse. All it does is warrant questions - such as what normal, natural, and wrong are supposed to mean and why the heterosexual perspective of sexuality should be accepted. However, if I did accept that discourse then I would HAVE to accept the opposite.

 

You're just trying to use language as a tool to marginalise others who do not have your sexuality.

[thebees]

ARRRRRRRRRRGH FFFFFFFS. I feel like Fenella the witch, currently bobbing around the living room screeching "That Spooky goblin twat" Grrrrrrrrr, spit spat and sput!

[spook]

I think that deep down, the spook is aware that his bible contradicts itself so much that he has some misgivings as to the credibility of it all.

 

These little doubts, (that any sane person must have) probably cause an enormous ammount of guilt. This could well be the cause of his anger and "non christians reap what they sowed" attitude.

 

All in all, a very poor advert for christianity.

 

 

Point 1 - wrong

 

Point 2 - wrong

 

Point 3 - wrong

[spook]

In terms of sexual congress, activities involving people of the same sex deviates from the purpose of sex and so it is deviant sex.

 

Personally I find the very thought of the close emotional relationship between man and woman being repeated between two same sex people distasteful, and that is without gong into the mechanics of extending the emotional relationship into a physical one.

 

That established, at the same time I recognise that there are people who are deviant in their desires, and who therefore do pervert the sex act. Deviant, but not to the extent of being harmful to others with the exception of being a conduit for HIV AIDS into the population at large because of the immorality of others.

 

But at the same time I accept the following principles (blatantly plagiarising from The Merchant)

 

Do they not have hands, organs, dimensions, senses, affections, passions?

 

Fed with the same food, hurt with the same weapons, subject to the same diseases, (let’s pass that one by for the moment!) healed by the same means. Warmed and cooled by the same winter and summer, as heterosexuals are? If we prick them, do they not bleed? if we tickle them, do they not laugh? If we poison then, do they not die?

 

So although I deplore homosexuality I do not extend that to hating people because of their predilections.

 

Just wanted to set the record straight on that point and maybe for anyone who does hate people because of their sexual orientation to raise the importance of seeing the person, not the sin.

[grant]

I think that deep down, the spook is aware that his bible contradicts itself so much that he has some misgivings as to the credibility of it all.

 

These little doubts, (that any sane person must have) probably cause an enormous ammount of guilt. This could well be the cause of his anger and "non christians reap what they sowed" attitude.

 

All in all, a very poor advert for christianity.

 

 

Point 1 - wrong

 

Point 2 - wrong

 

Point 3 - wrong

 

Point 1 & 2, well you would say that spooky. Point 3, there is no doubt at all, that you let your fellow christians down, very deeply. I have never heard anyone pretend to be a christian, but to then be so very bitter, twisted and just vile.

 

You have my pity, if I was mental, I'd pray for you, but seeing as I'm not, I won't.

[Evil Goblin]

As usual, LDV, you try to muddy the waters with your social science textbook verbiage. The matter is perfectly simple - non-heterosexual sex is perverted and deviant and no matter how you try to confuse the issue you will not change that fact (save, perhaps, for those who have been conned into believing that by following the politically-correct teachings of the Left, they are being intelligent and clever. However, like Spook, I do not condemn the perverts as evil - just people to be pitied. As I have said before, there is hope - roll on the day when genetic engineering can remove the misfits from the gene pool.

[Evil Goblin]

You haven't shown why deviance is a concept that should be recognised.

What on earth are you talking about? Deviance is not a concept - it is a matter of fact. The natural purpose of sex is reproduction - homosexual sex cannot lead to reproduction and is therefore a perversion.

[spook]

Point 1 & 2, well you would say that spooky. Point 3, there is no doubt at all, that you let your fellow christians down, very deeply. I have never heard anyone pretend to be a christian, but to then be so very bitter, twisted and just vile.

 

 

Not at all.

 

All you have shown is how little you know about Christianity, and how little you have understood what I have written.

 

Christianity isn’t “soft”. It isn’t antagonistic, a Christian isn’t someone who goes out for revenge, but a Christian is someone who is willing to be controversial in the face of things that are wrong.

 

There are so many examples of where Jesus did or said the right thing, rather than avoid upsetting people by exposing evil and wrong doing. From the Cleansing of the Temple to the healing of the sick on the Sabbath he refused to simply abide by the status quo.

 

I suspect that your impression is that we are a collection of slightly delicate, always polite, easily shocked people who like to be seen as the pillars of society and examples of respectability.

 

Well we are not. Especially as today respectability is determined by compliance with social nicety.

 

There are many Christians who do show witness by being people who go out of the way to help the poor but also many who do the same but do not let what they do be seen because they do what they do out of love for The Lord, not to gain social kudos.

 

There are many Christians who will not even break the speed limit because they do not wish to break the law of the land and so present bad witness. In fact I am one such.

 

But there are some of us who will present the other facet of Christianity. The side that carries the sword. We are equally important as witness that Christianity is power and influence and not acquiescence to the forces of the world.

 

Being a Christian isn’t about being soft, it’s about being sufficiently hard to present a soft response when that is appropriate, by turning the other cheek being a prime example, but to stand firm when it is not.

[spook]

You haven't shown why deviance is a concept that should be recognised.

What on earth are you talking about? Deviance is not a concept - it is a matter of fact. The natural purpose of sex is reproduction - homosexual sex cannot lead to reproduction and is therefore a perversion.

 

To be honest I’m ever so slightly on LDV’s side on this but only because in the case of man and woman sex is not only about reproduction, sex is also the tip of the iceberg, the zenith of a committed loving interpersonal relationship.

 

Where LDV and I part company is the rightness of such relationships being between two people of the same sex. That is where I see the deviance from normality.

[Evil Goblin]

Spook - you are wrong here. The natural purpose of sex is reproduction and everything which surrounds sex is conducive to the succesful reproduction of offspring and the optimum conditions for that offspring to be reared until itself is of reproductive age.

[Terse]

I have in the past clearly shown that homosexuality is deviant. If you care to consult a dictionary you will find that it is also perverted, and in that Spook is perfectly correct.

In the interests of accuracy, I've so far consulted six dictionaries - including a medical one - and nowhere is it defined as 'perverted.'

[grant]

Point 1 & 2, well you would say that spooky. Point 3, there is no doubt at all, that you let your fellow christians down, very deeply. I have never heard anyone pretend to be a christian, but to then be so very bitter, twisted and just vile.

 

 

Not at all.

 

All you have shown is how little you know about Christianity, and how little you have understood what I have written.

 

Christianity isn’t “soft”. It isn’t antagonistic, a Christian isn’t someone who goes out for revenge, but a Christian is someone who is willing to be controversial in the face of things that are wrong.

 

There are so many examples of where Jesus did or said the right thing, rather than avoid upsetting people by exposing evil and wrong doing. From the Cleansing of the Temple to the healing of the sick on the Sabbath he refused to simply abide by the status quo.

 

I suspect that your impression is that we are a collection of slightly delicate, always polite, easily shocked people who like to be seen as the pillars of society and examples of respectability.

 

Well we are not. Especially as today respectability is determined by compliance with social nicety.

 

There are many Christians who do show witness by being people who go out of the way to help the poor but also many who do the same but do not let what they do be seen because they do what they do out of love for The Lord, not to gain social kudos.

 

There are many Christians who will not even break the speed limit because they do not wish to break the law of the land and so present bad witness. In fact I am one such.

 

But there are some of us who will present the other facet of Christianity. The side that carries the sword. We are equally important as witness that Christianity is power and influence and not acquiescence to the forces of the world.

 

Being a Christian isn’t about being soft, it’s about being sufficiently hard to present a soft response when that is appropriate, by turning the other cheek being a prime example, but to stand firm when it is not.

 

But you're antagonistic, very rude and now you seem to suggest you're some sort of knight in shining armour, quoting from your book of fairy tales. Do you ride a white horse when you carry your sword? You're just as arrogant as you are deluded.

[Evil Goblin]

I have in the past clearly shown that homosexuality is deviant. If you care to consult a dictionary you will find that it is also perverted, and in that Spook is perfectly correct.

In the interests of accuracy, I've so far consulted six dictionaries - including a medical one - and nowhere is it defined as 'perverted.'

Try using the dictionaries properly and look for the meaning of perversion instead of desperately trying to find some way of justifying your predispositions.