Wikkileaks

[tonythetash]

Since that Aussie bloke from Wikkileaks has distributed 'sensitive material' from the good ole USA top secret drawer to the worlds press criticising many a world leader, it occured to me what their interpretation of our leaders were. That is if they even considered us important enough to spy on.

Perhaps we should have our own ManxWikkileaks, what do you think?

[When Skies Are Grey]

The "leaks" are a bit lame on the whole....I mean you don't need a memo from the CIA to know that the Royal Family indulge in lewd behaviour or that David Cameron instilles about as much confidence as John Major and that Putin is an "alpha-male" nut job!

 

Where's the skeet on Area 51, the Kennedy assasination or those world leaders who are actually lizard-people???

[manshimajin]

How on earth do they get hold of this information?

 

I would have thought that US diplomatic traffic would be encrypted and impossible for others to read. If Wikileaks can get hold of it I assume that Iraq, North Korea, China, Russia or even the dear old EU must be able to do the same.

 

What I should really like Wikileaks to do is to release similarly confidential information from countries like North Korea, Pakistan or Iraq - now that WOULD make for interesting reading and along with the US content allow people to get a broader view.

[jack bauer's brother]

LOL @ when skies are grey that gave me a giggle this miserable monday morning

[Slim]

How on earth do they get hold of this information?

 

I would have thought that US diplomatic traffic would be encrypted and impossible for others to read. If Wikileaks can get hold of it I assume that Iraq, North Korea, China, Russia or even the dear old EU must be able to do the same.

 

What I should really like Wikileaks to do is to release similarly confidential information from countries like North Korea, Pakistan or Iraq - now that WOULD make for interesting reading and along with the US content allow people to get a broader view.

 

 

These aren't interceptions, they're leaks.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/28/how-us-embassy-cables-leaked

 

 

[pongo]

Or perhaps its all a double-bluff. In which case Wikileaks is surreptitiously and deniably being directed with the assistance (or non intervention) of US agencies which are always to some extent in conflict with other US agencies - politics, policy, influence, funding, turf. It's a compelling argument in some ways - to release information (and opinion more importantly) for political reasons which would be useful in the public domain whilst being able to throw up their hands and say "oh no". So amongst all the distracting leaked secrets you maybe see the real headline and hardly notice.

 

Eg - the previous bunch of releases seemed to be very much about saying that the war in Afghanistan is a bit of a waste of time and, in fact, the focus should be on Yemen and Pakistan. These latest seem to be about saying that the Arab world favours attacks against Iran.

 

Even if that is silly - the certain inevitability that everything will be leaked must now be part of the formular.

[P.K.]

How on earth do they get hold of this information?

 

I would have thought that US diplomatic traffic would be encrypted and impossible for others to read. If Wikileaks can get hold of it I assume that Iraq, North Korea, China, Russia or even the dear old EU must be able to do the same.

 

What I should really like Wikileaks to do is to release similarly confidential information from countries like North Korea, Pakistan or Iraq - now that WOULD make for interesting reading and along with the US content allow people to get a broader view.

 

 

These aren't interceptions, they're leaks.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/28/how-us-embassy-cables-leaked

 

The footage from the helicopter attack on the journalist group was encrypted and Wikileaks decoded it.

 

Besides which public servants have been leaking info for political aims for years now. Even the appalling Thatcher's lies were uncovered by this leak.

 

Then there's always Narus. A must have item for any police state.

[manshimajin]

I am caught between curiosity and wondering if there are things that are better not to know!

 

There are certainly some authoritarian states whose thinking it would be interesting to have detailed advanced knowledge of. Unfortunately when I looked at WikiLeaks.org they only seemed to be covering the USA. Are they unbalanced in their coverage or is there a further site that deals with the likes of Iran and N Korean arms deals, Chinese aims in Africa, Russian attitudes to its ex satellites etc etc...?

[VinnieK]

Surely it's not a matter of coverage and/or bias, Manshimajin. Wikileaks simply hosts what is leaked to it, rather than seeking out and covering stories like a news agency. It's not unreasonable to imagine that police states, with all of the paranoia which fuels them don't suffer from the same number of leaks. I would also guess that western countries' intelligence on those states is more secure than diplomatic communications and what have you, cutting down the likelyhood of wikileaks receiving information on them from those sources either.

[manshimajin]

Surely it's not a matter of coverage and/or bias, Manshimajin. Wikileaks simply hosts what is leaked to it, rather than seeking out and covering stories like a news agency. It's not unreasonable to imagine that police states, with all of the paranoia which fuels them don't suffer from the same number of leaks. I would also guess that western countries' intelligence on those states is more secure than diplomatic communications and what have you, cutting down the likelyhood of wikileaks receiving information on them from those sources either.

So put another way information on Wikileak tells us more about the level of freedom in the USA and freedom of the press in countries like the UK than it does about authoritarian control in other countries?

 

I was expecting much more by way of 'leaks' as I can't believe that the USA is the only leaky boat

 

PS - I am not trying to defend the USA but my impression is that this sort of site probably gives a lot of ammunition to abhorrent regimes and movements. Maybe that is the price of 'freedom'.

[gazza]

i wonder what bad news will be hidden on this.

 

allways a good day to hide bad news when something like this comes out

[VinnieK]

So put another way information on Wikileak tells us more about the level of freedom in the USA and freedom of the press in countries like the UK than it does about authoritarian control in other countries?

 

I'm not sure it's as simple as a question of 'freedom', although that's unquestionably a part of it. It may be that it results mainly from authoritarian regimes having tighter security on secret information, more stringent screening of who has access to data, smaller and less technologically sophisticated intelligence networks and communications which make it easier to catch and plug leaks, fewer people accessing less data, and the risks of leaking data are undoubtably much greater.

 

Remember, these are leaks, not espionage or intelligence that's been directly accessed or targeted by Wikileaks. How many leaks there are and where they come from depends on how many people there are who can access such data and have the inclination (for whatever reason) to leak it to a third party like wikileaks for little personal gain (unlike in espionage where financial rewards may be offered) and how many of those are willing to take the risk to do so.

 

There's also the fact that the U.S. is particularly active on the international stage, economically, politically, and militarily. Much more so than is perhaps Russia and almost certainly more active than North Korea. This results in the generation of vast quantities of information across a large number of agencies and personel, all of which surely increases the risk of leaks occuring.

[pongo]

Remember, these are leaks, not espionage or intelligence that's been directly accessed or targeted by Wikileaks.

 

There is no obvious way of determining a difference between a leak, disinformation and / or propaganda. What better way to dissipate a message than to dress it up as a secret and bury it amongst a bunch of gossip which will probably be leaked. Just saying !

 

Historically it has always been very difficult to get the other side to believe disinformation. eg Operation Mincemeat.

[manshimajin]

So put another way information on Wikileak tells us more about the level of freedom in the USA and freedom of the press in countries like the UK than it does about authoritarian control in other countries?

 

I'm not sure it's as simple as a question of 'freedom', although that's unquestionably a part of it.

I agree - it is not a simple matter. But I think that it is a telling thing about the world we live in that the "freer" (my parenthises) societies are more vulnerable to being exposed and to having populations that are taken aback by what emerges.

 

Totalitarian and oppressive regimes have ways of making sure this doesn't happen very much - if at all.

 

I am very glad that for all the faults of our society (and the US one) that I am not living in some of the ones that will seek to make capital from this information.

[Max Power]

Since that Aussie bloke from Wikkileaks has distributed 'sensitive material' from the good ole USA top secret drawer to the worlds press criticising many a world leader, it occured to me what their interpretation of our leaders were. That is if they even considered us important enough to spy on.

Perhaps we should have our own ManxWikkileaks, what do you think?

We don't need ManxWikkileaks, we have Manxforums!