Questions, Questions, Questions....

[manxman8180]

What do we win if we get it right?

[crumlin]

What do we win if we get it right?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

A YEARS SUPPLY OF BROWN ENVELOPES

[happy camper]

The salary is more than some of them would ever hope to earn doing a proper job.

[Lonan3]

People make mistakes. Things go wrong. That's not the same as corruption.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Absolutely! Unfortunately, the local politicians don't have a huge party machine to help them cover up their blunders - unlike many sleaze bags in the UK. Perhaps we're fortunate that, although our politicians aren't the best at what they do, they're also not very good at covering things up. At least it gives us a fighting chance to find, highlight and investigate the things that are done wrong.

[Slim]

Incidentally you have got dodgy politics as you have unelected politicians formulating policy (unlike the HoL who can only tinker with it and then for only a specified time) and your only exports are the finance sector and some over-priced cheese. OK, maybe not a "banana republic". How about a "peppercorn republic"? That's clever for me btw.

 

There's the odd unelected, it's hardly a majority and it's a failing thats been recognised and is in the process of being reformed. That doesn't sound like dodgy politics to me, it sounds like an old system that's being worked on.

 

I am not excited about the corruption or the things that can take place, I am disgusted by them. I can also assure you that no-one would ever describe me as embittered, that is an assumption you have made that really is wide of the mark.

 

It's how you come accross. Always negative, always finding the bad things.

 

I have enjoyed a lifestyle over here that I could never have attained in the IOM. I also enjoy all the culture and diversity of which the IOM has virtually none. Being 30 minutes from London by train really does have advantages. You lot get excited when third or fourth string band turns up! However when I lived there it was wonderful and it probably still is but right now my life simply has a different agenda.

 

God for you. I've got mates who've moved out of London. I've got one very good friend who's absolutely desparate to get away. His wife was assaulted on a bus on the way home from work by a gang of behooded youths while a bus full of people did nothign about it. It's apparently some sort of game where these scumbags beat people up while taking mobile phone pictures and mail the results to all their mates. Do I hear about such things and conclude the UK is a corrupt cesspool of violence and hate? No. It's part of a bigger picture. I get the impression that you think this in reverse of the isle of man though.

 

My life here has benefits that I couldn't get in England. My fishing license (from the government) costs a ton a year, which would be a ton a month in many parts of the uk. My (government subsidised) three trips to the pool a week are about £2.80 a visit, and the pools on the way on my five min drive home. My kids are doing very well at a great school, where the relationship with ourselves and the teachers is very important and the food is turkey twissler free! I live near to my family, a family member has just bought her first property, she's single in her 20's and received a substancial govt grant to do so, and will get mortgage relief that isn't available in the UK. A friend has just started his own buisness and recieved good grants and advice from the dti. It only costs me a ton or so to fly to manchester to see those concerts your on about, which isn't really that much more than a taxi home!

 

It's not all perfect, there are fustrations. My family were refused planning permission to build on a field not far away from where the ex Cheif Minister built his holiday homes.

 

However I would baulk at giving my taxes to a bunch of incompetant, bumbling, amateur shysters that you have as a government who are also, by the way, your face to the world. Frankly I would rather finance the war in Iraq.

 

That's probably the stupidest thing I've ever heard anyone say on these forums.

[P.K.]

Incidentally you have got dodgy politics as you have unelected politicians formulating policy (unlike the HoL who can only tinker with it and then for only a specified time) and your only exports are the finance sector and some over-priced cheese. OK, maybe not a "banana republic". How about a "peppercorn republic"? That's clever for me btw.

There's the odd unelected, it's hardly a majority and it's a failing thats been recognised and is in the process of being reformed. That doesn't sound like dodgy politics to me, it sounds like an old system that's being worked on.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Come off it Slim. I wouldn't trust one of your politicians further than I could throw a steamroller! Apart from my namesake I doubt if many others would either. There are none so blind......

 

I am not excited about the corruption or the things that can take place, I am disgusted by them. I can also assure you that no-one would ever describe me as embittered, that is an assumption you have made that really is wide of the mark.

It's how you come accross. Always negative, always finding the bad things.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You mean like this?

I lived on the IOM before this rag-tag of pharmacists and tractor salesmen were anywhere near power and I can assure you that the quality of life was excellent

I can (just) remember when there was half the current population. Imagine half the people, houses, cars etc etc just not there. It was a wonderful place to grow up.

 

I have enjoyed a lifestyle over here that I could never have attained in the IOM. I also enjoy all the culture and diversity of which the IOM has virtually none. Being 30 minutes from London by train really does have advantages. You lot get excited when third or fourth string band turns up! However when I lived there it was wonderful and it probably still is but right now my life simply has a different agenda.

 

God for you. I've got mates who've moved out of London. I've got one very good friend who's absolutely desparate to get away. His wife was assaulted on a bus on the way home from work by a gang of behooded youths while a bus full of people did nothign about it. It's apparently some sort of game where these scumbags beat people up while taking mobile phone pictures and mail the results to all their mates. Do I hear about such things and conclude the UK is a corrupt cesspool of violence and hate? No. It's part of a bigger picture. I get the impression that you think this in reverse of the isle of man though.

 

My life here has benefits that I couldn't get in England. My fishing license (from the government) costs a ton a year, which would be a ton a month in many parts of the uk. My (government subsidised) three trips to the pool a week are about £2.80 a visit, and the pools on the way on my five min drive home. My kids are doing very well at a great school, where the relationship with ourselves and the teachers is very important and the food is turkey twissler free! I live near to my family, a family member has just bought her first property, she's single in her 20's and received a substancial govt grant to do so, and will get mortgage relief that isn't available in the UK. A friend has just started his own buisness and recieved good grants and advice from the dti. It only costs me a ton or so to fly to manchester to see those concerts your on about, which isn't really that much more than a taxi home!

 

It's not all perfect, there are fustrations. My family were refused planning permission to build on a field not far away from where the ex Cheif Minister built his holiday homes.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Because of the scumbags I don't live in London. I live in the countryside and enjoy all the benefits from both. Ideal really. However I am sure you will understand that when someone from the IOM mentions "the bigger picture" I have a wry smile. I am very happy for you that your trips to the swimming pool are subsidised although I have to say it is of little interest to me. As for schools that is the reason I am over here.

 

The cost of housing over here is a major downer though. One reason Labour will get back in is because so many people have huge mortgages that they daren't risk a Tory government and a rise in interest rates. It would crucify them.

 

However I would baulk at giving my taxes to a bunch of incompetant, bumbling, amateur shysters that you have as a government who are also, by the way, your face to the world. Frankly I would rather finance the war in Iraq.

That's probably the stupidest thing I've ever heard anyone say on these forums.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What's stupid about not wanting to give your taxes to a bunch of incompetant, bumbling, amateur shysters?

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[happy camper]

PK, I shall ask again

 

What do you dislike about education in the IOM?

[Slim]

Come off it Slim. I wouldn't trust one of your politicians further than I could throw a steamroller! Apart from my namesake I doubt if many others would either. There are none so blind......

 

How about Downie? He's been in since 1991, does that cut into your golden age of the isle of man? Or did he only turn bad, evil and corrupt after you left? Edgar Quine? Only left last year so would form part of what you call the 'current lot' and has been in since the 80's. He a bad-un? Gellings been in government for 20 years as well, did he turn bad? Richard Corkill too has been there nearly 15 years, but presumably he's a 'current lot'?

 

Come on then, list who you wouldn't trust, and why. Do you even know who all the members are?

 

I lived on the IOM before this rag-tag of pharmacists and tractor salesmen were anywhere near power and I can assure you that the quality of life was excellent

 

Rose tinted crap? What use is that? How can you compare it with quality of life now when you dont even live here?

 

I can (just) remember when there was half the current population. Imagine half the people, houses, cars etc etc just not there. It was a wonderful place to grow up.

 

Ahh, but you've just been saying how wonderful the advance civilisation you live in is, now the island is bad because its advanced it's population? Make your mind up eh?

 

Because of the scumbags I don't live in London. I live in the countryside and enjoy all the benefits from both. Ideal really. However I am sure you will understand that when someone from the IOM mentions "the bigger picture" I have a wry smile. I am very happy for you that your trips to the swimming pool are subsidised although I have to say it is of little interest to me. As for schools that is the reason I am over here.

 

I was trying to illustrate the quality of life I have, much of which is provided by the government. My kids have excellant schooling too, and we don't have jamie oliver telling us our kids are full of junk either, with our spend on food per child double his quoted figure for the UK.

 

What's stupid about not wanting to give your taxes to a bunch of incompetant, bumbling, amateur shysters?

 

Saying you'd rather pay for the war.

[Rog]

How about Downie? He's been in since 1991, does that cut into your golden age of the isle of man? Or did he only turn bad, evil and corrupt after you left?

 

There's a lot that I could write but the lack of producable evidence means that I must not, though maybe you could justify why you see him as being as you describe.

[Slim]

There's a lot that I could write but the lack of producable evidence means that I must not, though maybe you could justify why you see him as being as you describe.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I don't discribe him in anyway. It was PK's suggestion that the IOM used to be this haven of wonderfulness and now its stinky and rotton that made me check how long some of the current members have been in.

[Lonan3]

QUOTE:

"I lived on the IOM before this rag-tag of pharmacists and tractor salesmen were anywhere near power and I can assure you that the quality of life was excellent "

 

I grew up here in the 1950/60s and it wouldn't be difficult to reminisce about the wonderful quality of life - provided that the rose-tinted spectacles remain slightly misted and the tunnel vision is properly in place.

 

For me, as a child, it was wonderful. But...

 

My father was a labourer who had to find work on the government sponsored winter schemes each year. Because he was considered a good worker he didn't usually have much difficulty finding the work, but the work itself damned near killed him. He spent several winters working on the construction of Marine Drive and others working on runway extensions at the airport.

In the summer, he was a night cleaner/watchman in the Villa Marina.

Between those jobs there were always a few weeks on the 'dole', when the family had to eke out an existence on what was little more than a pittance.

Although I was considered fairly bright, the chances of going to university were simply nil, because once I was old enough I had to get out to work and help to supplement the family's income. (Fortunately, I was able to get a second chance through the Open University - with a fair amount of help from the IoM Govt - in the 1990s)

That was the reality of the 'quality' of life for most people back then - hard work and very little reward.

Today, partly thanks to the 'bungling efforts of our amatuer politicians' I own my house, run my own business, have holidays abroad from time to time and, thanks to the local education system, all of my children have so far qualified for university and been able to go (Still two more to reach that stage yet)

Yes, I do complain about island and the way it's run occasionally, but I pay my taxes and rates here and so I feel that I have a right to gripe if I feel they're being misspent, but when someone who no longer resides here tries to tell me how much better everything used to be, I feel like throwing up.

And, just as a rider, I did spend a little time in my youth living on the outskirts of London and found it to be the dirtiest, ugliest, most unfriendly and overpriced city that it has ever been my misfortune to visit.

[P.K.]

Well Slim, now I think you're losing it. I've written to that nice Mr Downie on several occasions (that is the Mr Downie that did away with the entire Work Permit Committee at one fell swoop for reasons as yet unclear - yes?) , let's just say his replies were a little less than forthcoming however your loyalty to your 'government' does you credit. As for "Rose tinted crap" I keep in touch and return every year. Don't assume that just because someone doesn't live there any more that they're blind while they are there and can't read when they're not. At no time have I ever said the island is bad because it has advanced it's population and frankly I can't imagine where you have got that from. It's also not something I have to make my mind up about. However a look at the crime figures proportionally to the population rise probably wouldn't go amiss. Basically I think the island is still wonderful and it's establishment stinks.

 

You do not have to illustrate the quality of life there, I lived there, remember? Like most of the UK people were nothing like as well off as they are now. Things like central heating and several cars a household and so on were absolutely unheard of. For example if we did well fishing we were sent around giving it away to the old folks and it was much appreciated which really brings home how times have changed as far as affluence goes.

 

As to school dinners well you're really stretching it now i.e. when was the last time you ate one? I last had school dinner on the 17th April and it wasn't half bad. The teaching is excellent as well, especially around culture and diversity with museum trips, theatre trips, tours of the WW1 battlefields in France and Belgium and so forth. They really make an effort to give a broad and diverse perspective which I find does them credit.

 

By the way, I HAVE to pay for the Iraq war. As I agree with it then it's fine by me. Nothing stupid about that now is there?

 

No doubt you and others will be pleased to hear that unless there is a change of heart and direction by IOM Gov then I'm not coming back. If decent checks and balances get built into the system, especially around finances, then maybe I would consider it. But on their current performance? No chance.

[monkey_magic]

\

"Hello! We're the Golden Girls, and we're here to join in this debate. It is our intention to convince you that the quality of life in Florida far outweighs that of yours in the UK or IOM, despite the widespread reports of corrupt elections. In fact, we'd go as far as to say it's the perfect place to retire to, because the weather is fantastic-oh daddy-oh!"

[Slim]

Well Slim, now I think you're losing it. I've written to that nice Mr Downie on several occasions (that is the Mr Downie that did away with the entire Work Permit Committee at one fell swoop for reasons as yet unclear - yes?) , let's just say his replies were a little less than forthcoming however your loyalty to your 'government' does you credit.

 

Hang on, I'm saying Downie is an 'old school' mhk, your suggesting its the new ones that have brought all the disrepute in and the golden years when you lived here were all flowery and nice. But downies been in for ages, as have many of the others. I was just wondering why they were brill back then but are now dark and evil.

 

As for "Rose tinted crap" I keep in touch and return every year. Don't assume that just because someone doesn't live there any more that they're blind while they are there and can't read when they're not. At no time have I ever said the island is bad because it has advanced it's population and frankly I can't imagine where you have got that from.

 

Because you said your quality of life was better here in the past because ther was less people. Now who's losing it?

 

As to school dinners well you're really stretching it now i.e. when was the last time you ate one? I last had school dinner on the 17th April and it wasn't half bad. The teaching is excellent as well, especially around culture and diversity with museum trips, theatre trips, tours of the WW1 battlefields in France and Belgium and so forth. They really make an effort to give a broad and diverse perspective which I find does them credit.

 

We get the menus sent home every term, so we can see what they're eating. It's a good bunch of food, very veried from salads and curries to fish and chips. You've repeatedly ignored the question about what's wrong with manx schools, are you going to tell us?

 

By the way, I HAVE to pay for the Iraq war. As I agree with it then it's fine by me. Nothing stupid about that now is there?

 

I think it's stupid to say you'd rather pay for a war than to a government that's looking after it's population pretty well.

 

 

No doubt you and others will be pleased to hear that unless there is a change of heart and direction by IOM Gov then I'm not coming back. If decent checks and balances get built into the system, especially around finances, then maybe I would consider it. But on their current performance? No chance.

 

What does that actually mean? You're not specific about what the actual problems are, other than calling names. What would need to change?

[P.K.]

It's like a dog worrying a bone. I'm getting bored with this and I suspect others are as well. Oh well, one last time unto the breach....

 

Well Slim, now I think you're losing it. I've written to that nice Mr Downie on several occasions (that is the Mr Downie that did away with the entire Work Permit Committee at one fell swoop for reasons as yet unclear - yes?) , let's just say his replies were a little less than forthcoming however your loyalty to your 'government' does you credit.

Hang on, I'm saying Downie is an 'old school' mhk, your suggesting its the new ones that have brought all the disrepute in and the golden years when you lived here were all flowery and nice. But downies been in for ages, as have many of the others. I was just wondering why they were brill back then but are now dark and evil.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So it IS the same Mr Downie that did away with the entire Work Permit Committee at one fell swoop for reasons as yet unclear. Oh for transparent government eh?

 

Look at it like this. Basically Executive leadership did not transition to the Manx People until the 1980's. I had already left by then.

 

As for "Rose tinted crap" I keep in touch and return every year. Don't assume that just because someone doesn't live there any more that they're blind while they are there and can't read when they're not. At no time have I ever said the island is bad because it has advanced it's population and frankly I can't imagine where you have got that from.

Because you said your quality of life was better here in the past because ther was less people. Now who's losing it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's not that the island has gone "bad" (your word, not mine) in the meantime it's just that it was a much quieter, gentler place when I was there. With half the people and far fewer vehicles I would have said that was a bit of an obvious one.

 

As to school dinners well you're really stretching it now i.e. when was the last time you ate one? I last had school dinner on the 17th April and it wasn't half bad. The teaching is excellent as well, especially around culture and diversity with museum trips, theatre trips, tours of the WW1 battlefields in France and Belgium and so forth. They really make an effort to give a broad and diverse perspective which I find does them credit.

 

We get the menus sent home every term, so we can see what they're eating. It's a good bunch of food, very veried from salads and curries to fish and chips. You've repeatedly ignored the question about what's wrong with manx schools, are you going to tell us?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No, I am not going to tell the royal "us". If you are really genuinely interested and can be trusted to be discreet then pm me and I will explain.

 

By the way, I HAVE to pay for the Iraq war. As I agree with it then it's fine by me. Nothing stupid about that now is there?

 

I think it's stupid to say you'd rather pay for a war than to a government that's looking after it's population pretty well.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I don't trust them with my dosh as I don't know what they are up to. The IOM frequently adopts UK legislation. Tell me, when do you expect to see the Freedom of Information Act adopted in the IOM?

 

No doubt you and others will be pleased to hear that unless there is a change of heart and direction by IOM Gov then I'm not coming back. If decent checks and balances get built into the system, especially around finances, then maybe I would consider it. But on their current performance? No chance.

 

What does that actually mean? You're not specific about what the actual problems are, other than calling names. What would need to change?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

See above FoI Act for starters.

 

Like I said "One last time unto the breach" and this is that last time.

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