Addie Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Sorry John but I find your interpretation bizarre. If this was a publicity stunt what have they achieved ? It couldn't have been handled worse. As for 'refreshing' I can only say that you have an odd notion of refreshment. This political travesty demeaned the highest court in the land and made a mockery of our democratic process. There was an opportunity today for someone to stand up in Tynwald and ring out the name of Peter Karran as a true Manxman of character, integrity, and experience, in a rousing speech for a man of the people. He would still have lost, but he would have gone down with dignity, with his colours intact and proudly aloft, as he shook the hand of Allan Bell. Instead he was shot down in tatters from his own side in the biggest act of political suicide and tactical stupidity that I've ever witnessed. Spot on. Agreed. What an embarassing pantomime that was. Karran, Hall and Beecroft sounded bitter, frustrated and inept. How Beecroft can behave as disrespectfully as she did, giving her first speech, bodes badly for the dignity of politics in the Isle of Man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopek Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Spot on. Apart from the " Highest Court in the Land"!!! You mean the people we have elected to represent our best interests? You'll be refering to them as 'The Right Honourable Members' next. Don't kow tow to the buggers. First thing they do on being elected is give their selves a fancy title, at this stage we do not know if they are 'Right' and the 'Honourable' bit could always be in doubt! A classic case for adopting the Marks & Spencer ' Your MHK'. Our employees to do our bidding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 People here are getting their knickers in a twist with all this talk about 'respect' for the old conventions etc. So what if people go in and say what they mean ? It's all there in Hansard now which is the public record. I guess they were putting down their marker. People can agree or disagree politically - but it has nothing to do with 'respect' for the conventions. It isn't a debutante ball. It's up to the rest of them in there to be equally as feisty. The execution might not have been perfect but at least it was something different. Personally I think that Mr Bell was the best choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempus Fugit Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 First thing they do on being elected is give their selves a fancy title, and a pay rise ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian rush Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 This whole circus this morning leaves me with the impression that the next 5 years will essentially be a continuation of the previous shambles and that little significant action will be taken to address the main issues facing the IOM. The biggest problem facing us may not be external pressures but the Manx 'Government' itself. It won't be a continuation, we'll have extra shite from LibVan cluttering up agenda papers now they somehow managed to get two others in. Let's see how long PK's dictats wash with His Party - I imagine Hall will have the sense to eject (although why on earth he thought it was a good idea to bring up the 'plane crash is beyong me). Beecroft on the other hand... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blade Runner Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Sorry John but I find your interpretation bizarre. If this was a publicity stunt what have they achieved ? It couldn't have been handled worse. As for 'refreshing' I can only say that you have an odd notion of refreshment. This political travesty demeaned the highest court in the land and made a mockery of our democratic process. There was an opportunity today for someone to stand up in Tynwald and ring out the name of Peter Karran as a true Manxman of character, integrity, and experience, in a rousing speech for a man of the people. He would still have lost, but he would have gone down with dignity, with his colours intact and proudly aloft, as he shook the hand of Allan Bell. Instead he was shot down in tatters from his own side in the biggest act of political suicide and tactical stupidity that I've ever witnessed. Spot on. First of all I would like to congratulate Alan Bell on becoming Chief Minister. Sorry John but on this, I have to agree with SMUJ and disagree with your interpretation of the LVPs longest suicide note in history. Some have commented that they will offer scrutiny, and they may well but there are now committees set up for that purpose and on todays theatrics, the LVP will not actually scrutinise but just disagree, no matter what the proposal - my 8 year old could do the same, with about the same amount of thought put into it. What a waste of a vote getting those 3 in. They are not a party of Opposition either as has also been mentioned in the thread, far from it they are just spoilers and as such will do the island no favors in these difficult times when we need solidarity behind a common goal. I am really pleased that the MHKs chose to nearly 100% vote for AB, that is a good sign for getting through the difficult decisions they need to make in the coming months/years, a very public and very important show of intent IMHO. Hopefully that will give him a mandate to push through cuts, in the right places and spending, where it will benefit the island long term. PS.......Can anybody say who is actually behind the LVP or if not, what are their motives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lezayre Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I do hope that the LibVan supporters in Onchan and Douglas South are proud of themselves. Bring on the clowns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 what are their motives? to piss you off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I think that a number of you have missed the point. This was a publicity stunt by LVP. Bell was a done deal. It has given publicity and the opportunity to set out their stall and attack Bell. Generally the standard of speaking in Tynwald is not good, KB was doing her maiden speech, doesn't matter who wrote or advised, or how well she read it. She got over her point. It was stage managed theatrics. It had some purpose, its stopped AB being crowned without any fight at all. It has set the scene for the next 5 years, drawn attention to the fact there are now 3 in opposition. It showed that there is the possibility of another way. It was not a lowering of standards due to party politics, but a demonstration that party politics is now here and that there will be attempts, outside the new select committees to hold the executive to account Of course no one else was going to vote for PK, they all know which side their bread is buttered, they will have been promised departments, boards etc and even possibly, the chairing of select committees yes it was rough and scrappy, nothing new there then, but it was actually quite refreshing I made the same points two/three pages earlier... if you wanted party politics before the election got under way well now you have it.. I'm looking forward to hearing what happens when the ministers are announced. The cosy elite of the last 15 years will be in for a rough time. Expect the same from LVP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 It's taken her three goes to get in, and the first thing she does is fuck the entire Island over. Brilliant. Errrrr - call me old-fashioned if you like but my preference has always been to make reasoned judgements based on the best possible factual information available. However I'm going to really stick my neck out here and suggest that Kate Beecroft and Zac Hall DIDN'T vote for Allan Bell. So if it all Bellies up (sorry) over the next few years then the very last folks you can blame are - Kate Beecroft and Zac Hall! I didn't listen to it all (several times it felt like some of the posters on here i.e. my will to live was ebbing away) but Madam President I thought was an absolute disgrace. Bullying, patronising, just downright nasty. It's established practice that maiden speeches are NOT subjected to the kind of pressures seen in Tynwald today. Throwing the toys out of the pram would appear to be singularly appropriate in El Presidente's case. OK, Beecroft's speech might not have been wholly appropriate but that doesn't change the fact it was her MAIDEN speech and as such deserved a fairer hearing from those who should know better. They say you get the government you deserve. Enjoy.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twitch Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Sorry John but I find your interpretation bizarre. If this was a publicity stunt what have they achieved ? It couldn't have been handled worse. As for 'refreshing' I can only say that you have an odd notion of refreshment. This political travesty demeaned the highest court in the land and made a mockery of our democratic process. There was an opportunity today for someone to stand up in Tynwald and ring out the name of Peter Karran as a true Manxman of character, integrity, and experience, in a rousing speech for a man of the people. He would still have lost, but he would have gone down with dignity, with his colours intact and proudly aloft, as he shook the hand of Allan Bell. Instead he was shot down in tatters from his own side in the biggest act of political suicide and tactical stupidity that I've ever witnessed. Spot on. First of all I would like to congratulate Alan Bell on becoming Chief Minister. Sorry John but on this, I have to agree with SMUJ and disagree with your interpretation of the LVPs longest suicide note in history. Some have commented that they will offer scrutiny, and they may well but there are now committees set up for that purpose and on todays theatrics, the LVP will not actually scrutinise but just disagree, no matter what the proposal - my 8 year old could do the same, with about the same amount of thought put into it. What a waste of a vote getting those 3 in. They are not a party of Opposition either as has also been mentioned in the thread, far from it they are just spoilers and as such will do the island no favors in these difficult times when we need solidarity behind a common goal. I am really pleased that the MHKs chose to nearly 100% vote for AB, that is a good sign for getting through the difficult decisions they need to make in the coming months/years, a very public and very important show of intent IMHO. Hopefully that will give him a mandate to push through cuts, in the right places and spending, where it will benefit the island long term. PS.......Can anybody say who is actually behind the LVP or if not, what are their motives? Isn't it Dick Horsnell, well known UKIP supporter? He was campaign manager for Robert Kilroy Silk's attempt to get into the EU Parliament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hissingsid Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Clare Christian should not even be President of Tynwald she was chucked out be the electorate years ago and only got into Leg Co by the back door because she was Charlies daughter and so must be great, she came over as a really nasty peice of work this morning just watch this space she will have sister Ann in beside her soon, democracy, rubbish. Ihope Peter Karran does not lose heart over this because there are a lot of people behind him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Peters Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I absolutely agree with John Wright, above ^^ Over an hour to download a 55mb file? Is that a problem my end of the connection, or is the Manx Radio site piss poor? Manx Radio doesn't do streaming of the Listen Again anymore. Yes, it is now painfully slow and so is piss poor by comparison. Can a techie explain why you have to now download the whole MP3 file before listening, whereas previously it was a streaming wma file. Please, please, don't someone from Manx Radio tell me it is to save some bandwidth. No, the files are significantly bigger. One of the reasons is that people have been moaning for years about the 'piss poor' audio quality of the WMA files and wanting us to standardise on MP3's...must say it works fine for me here at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Sorry John but I find your interpretation bizarre. If this was a publicity stunt what have they achieved ? It couldn't have been handled worse. As for 'refreshing' I can only say that you have an odd notion of refreshment. This political travesty demeaned the highest court in the land and made a mockery of our democratic process. There was an opportunity today for someone to stand up in Tynwald and ring out the name of Peter Karran as a true Manxman of character, integrity, and experience, in a rousing speech for a man of the people. He would still have lost, but he would have gone down with dignity, with his colours intact and proudly aloft, as he shook the hand of Allan Bell. Instead he was shot down in tatters from his own side in the biggest act of political suicide and tactical stupidity that I've ever witnessed. Spot on. First of all I would like to congratulate Alan Bell on becoming Chief Minister. Sorry John but on this, I have to agree with SMUJ and disagree with your interpretation of the LVPs longest suicide note in history. Some have commented that they will offer scrutiny, and they may well but there are now committees set up for that purpose and on todays theatrics, the LVP will not actually scrutinise but just disagree, no matter what the proposal - my 8 year old could do the same, with about the same amount of thought put into it. What a waste of a vote getting those 3 in. They are not a party of Opposition either as has also been mentioned in the thread, far from it they are just spoilers and as such will do the island no favors in these difficult times when we need solidarity behind a common goal. I am really pleased that the MHKs chose to nearly 100% vote for AB, that is a good sign for getting through the difficult decisions they need to make in the coming months/years, a very public and very important show of intent IMHO. Hopefully that will give him a mandate to push through cuts, in the right places and spending, where it will benefit the island long term. PS.......Can anybody say who is actually behind the LVP or if not, what are their motives? Isn't it Dick Horsnell, well known UKIP supporter? He was campaign manager for Robert Kilroy Silk's attempt to get into the EU Parliament. Yes and another Essex Boy from Chelmsford! You gotta watch 'em you know! Went to same school but he passed 11+ (I did not) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I've listened now and I think the conduct of Braidwood, Lowey & Christian was shameful. Here were two new members of house making their maiden speeches and they were constantly interjecting and using spurious nitpicking to disrupt their flow by members with decades of experience. I would have voted for Bell, but it doesn't mean the people speaking for Karran shouldn't be allowed to make their case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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