quilp Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 60% No vote.....so another meeting of the EU finance heads. This is brinkmanship and the Greeks have some balls (and gall) to be playing it. Turf them out now and live with the consequences - or talk and extend the credit more. The ball is back in the EU court... And treble Ouzo's all round... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Finance minister has resigned. F**king stupid Greeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amadeus Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Finance minister has resigned. F**king stupid Greeks. Someone in the press put it as "Tsipras is delivering his head to signal he wants to negotiate again". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 The Greeks have nothing to offer, the only negotiation can be 'feed us or we starve'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amadeus Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Numbers game on which option is cheaper? http://www.bbc.com/news/business-33405982 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 It's not just that...there are elections in Spain this year and the Spanish will try the same tactics, then the Italians....for better deals. A firm grip has to be had to rescue the Euro. Greece has to go...back to the Drachma IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lxxx Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 It's not just that...there are elections in Spain this year and the Spanish will try the same tactics, then the Italians....for better deals. A firm grip has to be had to rescue the Euro. Greece has to go...back to the Drachma IMO. If you think the euro is worth rescuing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinahand Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 I find it really quite strange. Greece needs billions of Euros. The countries that are going to hand over that money have said they will only do it if Greece agrees to do some things. The Greeks have now confirmed they aren't going to do these things. And what do the Greeks expect? To the creditors to suddenly go - "Oh, well, now we know you won't abide to the conditions we thought necessary, we'll give you the money anyway?" As Albert says, this isn't just about Greece. The creditors are going to have Spain, Portugal and maybe Italy turning up cap in hand too. Moral Hazard is a huge issue if the debtors think they can renege on their debts: Northern Europeans have lent billions and are still being asked for billions more. You don't want to do that if the debtors think they can renege on their debts. But there is also a point about lender beware. The entire German economy (just like the Chinese) has been based around them lending money to foreigners to buy their manufactured goods. There comes a point when this policy becomes untenable, and Germany passed it quite a few years ago. Germany has to restructure its economy too. It recklessly lent rather than do this and now the drachmas have come home to roost and those particular eggs didn't hatch in the way the Germans expected. Both sides have contributed to this mess. This is why a natural currency area needs to involve fiscal transfers - you can't do it with debt financing! Compromises are needed. But all that is occurring is increasingly bellicose rhetoric. Yuck. My final thought ... this whole crisis is about how Politicians can destroy whole economies. You do have to feel sorry for the millions of Greeks currently seeing their life savings frozen and decimated. My goodness what a mess the politicians have created. It is a warning to all when Politicians spend and borrow in our name. My goodness, budgetary control is important. The Greeks didn't learn that lesson, but neither did the Germans - for every debit there is a credit and neither lender nor borrower have been sensible. Disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hillshepherd Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 I find it really quite strange. Greece needs billions of Euros. The countries that are going to hand over that money have said they will only do it if Greece agrees to do some things. The Greeks have now confirmed they aren't going to do these things. And what do the Greeks expect? To the creditors to suddenly go - "Oh, well, now we know you won't abide to the conditions we thought necessary, we'll give you the money anyway?" As Albert says, this isn't just about Greece. The creditors are going to have Spain, Portugal and maybe Italy turning up cap in hand too. Moral Hazard is a huge issue if the debtors think they can renege on their debts: Northern Europeans have lent billions and are still being asked for billions more. You don't want to do that if the debtors think they can renege on their debts. But there is also a point about lender beware. The entire German economy (just like the Chinese) has been based around them lending money to foreigners to buy their manufactured goods. There comes a point when this policy becomes untenable, and Germany passed it quite a few years ago. Germany has to restructure its economy too. It recklessly lent rather than do this and now the drachmas have come home to roost and those particular eggs didn't hatch in the way the Germans expected. Both sides have contributed to this mess. This is why a natural currency area needs to involve fiscal transfers - you can't do it with debt financing! Compromises are needed. But all that is occurring is increasingly bellicose rhetoric. Yuck. My final thought ... this whole crisis is about how Politicians can destroy whole economies. You do have to feel sorry for the millions of Greeks currently seeing their life savings frozen and decimated. My goodness what a mess the politicians have created. It is a warning to all when Politicians spend and borrow in our name. My goodness, budgetary control is important. The Greeks didn't learn that lesson, but neither did the Germans - for every debit there is a credit and neither lender nor borrower have been sensible. Disaster. ffs you've changed your fucking tune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinahand Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 In what way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sick Moon Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Interesting article on the revolting Goldman Sachs here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarne Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 And as they have no money, the banks stay shut for a few more days now. Gravy train done, no more money. It'll be a fantastic lesson on what not to do to the rest of Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarne Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 It's fantastically morbid to watch - like a rollercoaster or airshow crash on a slightly slower scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notwell Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Interesting article on the revolting Goldman Sachs here. Ah that'll be it. The banks fault .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 The whole Greece mess is 100% self created and self inflicted by the Greeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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