Truth Seeker Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 @TruthSeeker. At least consider an alternative perspective: Fractional Reserve Banking creates liquidity out of narrow money. It makes money work. Ultimately it creates work. It is absolutely right that banks should lend out the majority of deposits. Full-reserve banking (as advocated by those who campaign against fractional reserve banking) would be like hoarding. The deposits would serve no useful purpose. Banks are not warehouses. They should not be. If fractional reserve banking did not exist we would have to invent it in order to overcome the inherent stagnation which strictly narrow (m0/m1) money supply would create. You might just as well simply hoard grain. Yes it does create liquidity out of narrow money, but you have to create new debt to make new money to pay off the old debt, that's why its a ponzi scheme. There will never be enough money to pay off the debts. If borrowing increases the money supply increases, but if companies and people try to pay off there debts the supply of money contracts. I would agree with you that ending fractional reserve banking would contract the supply of money, so a new system would be needed. One way might be banks would be allowed to keep the Principal of the loan, but they would only be able to make new loans with 100% reserve. As an example for every £1000 in deposits they would be able to give a £1000 loan. The idea is to have a large supply of money that circulates. Positive Money is a movement to democratise money and banking so that it works for society and not against it. http://www.positivemoney.org/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 EU exit would cost Britain its treasure, City warns (Reuters) - A British exit from the EU would torpedo London's position as a world financial capital by pushing money and talent to the United States and Asia, a lobby group for powerful banks and money managers said on Thursday. Prime Minister David Cameron has promised to renegotiate the terms of Britain's European Union membership and hold an "in-out" referendum if re-elected in 2015, raising fears the world's sixth-largest economy could quit the club it joined in 1973. But in a sign the City of London may be nervous about the possible outcome of a vote, the chief executive of lobby group TheCityUK cautioned that Britain's political and economic clout and its treasure would be at risk if voters chose to leave. "The danger from a Brexit is that we lose our place in the world," Chris Cummings said in an interview at the Reuters Euro Zone Summit. "The City wants to stay in the European Union. We think that's better for the UK economy and we think it's better for Europe to have the UK as a member." London, rivaled only by New York as the world's financial capital, dominates the $5-trillion-a-day foreign exchange market, trading twice as many dollars as the United States and more than twice as many euros as the entire euro zone. Cummings said that although the immediate impact of a British exit would not be removal vans whisking traders and fund managers to rival cities, there would be a long-term seepage that would eventually dry out London's capital markets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truth Seeker Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Remember in the book 1984 they removed words from the Dictionary. Bankrupt? No, say EU language police, it's 'debt adjusted' http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2560406/Bankrupt-No-say-EU-language-police-debt-adjusted-Brussels-tries-remove-stigma-going-bust.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 And if you read the article there's a lot of sense in it: His other proposals include penalising banks if ‘inappropriate lending’ contributed to a bankrupt’s financial problems, and ensuring that unpaid taxes are given priority over private debts when creditors are being repaid. A spokesman for the European Parliament said: ‘I think it is a pity that you pick out this one term to question from the entire document. ‘The report makes clear that the opinions expressed in the document are the sole responsibility of the authors and do not necessarily represent the official position of the European Parliament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Remember when the EU was called The Common Market as it was only for Free Trade and the free movement of people, well look at it now. Would the citizens of the UK have voted to join the Common Market if they could see it now? If you think it can't get any worse see the article below. "A campaign for the European Union to become a "United States of Europe" will be the "best weapon against the Eurosceptics", one of Brussels' most senior officials has said. Viviane Reding, vice president of the European Commission and the longest serving Brussels commissioner, has called for "a true political union" to be put on the agenda for EU elections this spring." http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/10559458/We-want-a-United-States-of-Europe-says-top-EU-official.html It will happen. Took the states of the USA ages, but it is inevitable IMO as the old guard die out over the next 20 to 50 years. It won't happen. Too many diverse cultures and economies. If they try to force it there will be war. In fact, the USA will disintegrate before the USE is established. Things look permanent. They never are. Future generations always change things and the larger and more disparate artificial blocs are, the easier they fall apart. They can't even hold the artificial currency together without blood on the streets. The only way Europe is coming together in the next hundred years or so is as a caliphate. As for why countries join the EU, there are two main reasons: idealism and self interest. The idealists have their taxpayers pay money in and the self interested take it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 If you think the diktats of the EU technocrats is bad enough, the amount of corruption in Europe is getting out of control, all paid for by the unwitting taxpayer. "The extent of corruption in Europe is "breathtaking" and it costs the EU economy about 120bn euros (£99bn) annually, the European Commission says." http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26014387 And how much would there be without the structure of the EU? Read your history, corruption is a way of life. Only the stupid get caught... FWIW some very senior Swiss politicians are advocating EU membership. Like the IOM, Switzerland has to obey the EU rules so better to help form them than sit on the outside. The EU is here to stay no matter what little Englanders may think. Maybe they are on the take? Or else they see the tax haven game is up so they might as well join the EU gravy train. Can't see any other logical reason why anyone would want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 It would be so wonderful to see little England leave the EU & the rest of us join It would. Especially if they dropped all the stupid effin EU legislation at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Maybe they are on the take? Or else they see the tax haven game is up so they might as well join the EU gravy train. Can't see any other logical reason why anyone would want to. Or just a level of maturity? The Swiss economy is very strong indeed, Switzerland would be a significant net contributor. The tax-haven game is under attack but the main banks are heavily into other areas. The benefits for Swiss politicians are far better than those in Brussels. After almost 30 years working on the continent I'm 101% in favour of the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truth Seeker Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 The Swiss are well out of it, I bet Ireland wish they had done the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 The Swiss are well out of it, I bet Ireland wish they had done the same. What??? Are you sure you're on planet Earth at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 The Swiss are well out of it, I bet Ireland wish they had done the same. The EU has been crucial to Ireland's transformation. Until relatively recently it was a place everyone wanted to leave. Everyday was Sunday. Today almost 70% of GDP is from services. Massive finance sector depends upon being inside the EU. Sure they had a house price collapse. The IOM finance sector would have surely benefited from being inside the EU. Read the Reuters article above about why the City of London is firmly behind UK remaining part of the EU. Cameron is also committed to the EU despite having to deal, politically, with the Daily Mail nutters, UKIP, little Englanders, people who don't like foreigners etc. Irish support for Europe fails to dim in euro crisis (FT) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truth Seeker Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Ireland got in to trouble because they where using the Euro, borrowing went way up, but they could not raise interest rates because that is controlled by the ECB. So Ireland went bust. The Swiss have control over their own economy and have flourished, Ireland will be lucky if they can eventually pay back their debts, now Ireland's biggest export is people. Also don't for get Spain, Portugal, Greece, Italy, Cyprus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hillshepherd Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Maybe they are on the take? Or else they see the tax haven game is up so they might as well join the EU gravy train. Can't see any other logical reason why anyone would want to. Or just a level of maturity? The Swiss economy is very strong indeed, Switzerland would be a significant net contributor. The tax-haven game is under attack but the main banks are heavily into other areas. The benefits for Swiss politicians are far better than those in Brussels. After almost 30 years working on the continent I'm 101% in favour of the EU. i'm not,and you just stay on your beloved continent,fifth columnists we can do without. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Maybe they are on the take? Or else they see the tax haven game is up so they might as well join the EU gravy train. Can't see any other logical reason why anyone would want to. Or just a level of maturity? The Swiss economy is very strong indeed, Switzerland would be a significant net contributor. The tax-haven game is under attack but the main banks are heavily into other areas. The benefits for Swiss politicians are far better than those in Brussels. After almost 30 years working on the continent I'm 101% in favour of the EU. Maturity? The EU? It's a total madhouse run on taxpayers' money. All we needed was a free trade zone and what we got was the bureaucracy from hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hillshepherd Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 The Swiss are well out of it, I bet Ireland wish they had done the same. What??? Are you sure you're on planet Earth at all? would you enlighten us as to the amount of debt the poor old paddys have around their necks for the next 20/30 years, i think this would frighten the shit out of anyone who is sane and not a total a**hole,ffs they have been screwed backwards by the bankers of the ECB and stupid europhiles who would sell their grannies for a few euros. http://www.financedublin.com/debtclock.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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