Mercenary Posted September 10 Share Posted September 10 1 hour ago, Ringy Rose said: The Steam Packet have put out a little explainer tonight: https://www.steam-packet.com/blog/iomspc-answers/ They’ll draw it in crayon for Julie Edge. They're obviously keener to lean on the 'out of our control' factors but isn't the lack of berth availability (due to Steam Packet incident with number 1 linkspan at Heysham ) likely a significant factor? They're now battling over short window spots which means a limited weather margin, or risk of turning back. Is there any timetable on number 1 coming back available? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopek Posted September 10 Share Posted September 10 It doesn't really matter what the excuses, explanations are it is a fact that the failure of service is..... Diabolical It is not a good look for 'our' lifeline service? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2112 Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 The Mythbusters have been pressed back into service. The Steam Packet's been defending its decision to cancel some of yesterday's Manxman sailings. It's shared an article on its website answering some of the most common questions it saw on social media. The comments have been responded to by Fleet Operations Manager James Royston and Tom Turner, who's one of the captains on Manxman and Ben-my-Chree. Both were also involved in the design and build of the Manxman. They say when a sailing is cancelled because of high winds, a number of factors are considered, particularly wind direction. For example, Heysham Port is more exposed when there's a north westerly wind, so 30 knots from the north west in Heysham would have a larger effect on the vessel than if it was 30 knots from the south west when there's shelter from the Nuclear Power station. They also say they have access to more detailed weather data which isn't publicly accessibly, which they use along with their local knowledge of the ports, to assess the forecast as well as the current weather conditions. They add that, unlike the aviation industry, ships don’t have the luxury of assessing a ‘stable’ approach, then invoking a ‘go around’ if an unstable approach is determined, hence the manoeuvre is planned with a factor of contingency, a margin which ensures the vessel can safely berth with a sudden increase of wind (i.e. gusts/windshear). Meanwhile, a number of other challenges have been responded to. Mr Royston and Mr Turner say the maximum wind speed, per the risk assessments, for Ben-my-Chree to berth in Heysham is very similar to Manxman’s, and therefore, the Ben-my-Chree couldn’t sail if Manxman wouldn’t have been able to either. They've also confirmed that trials to dock the Manxman in Liverpool still haven't been carried out, which means it can't be used as an alternative route for the time being. The Steam Packet is hoping to have more flexibility to consider Liverpool as an option in the future though, although it won't be possible to transport freight due to, they say, 'circumstances outside our control'. They explain why the Manannan might be able to sail and not the Manxman, saying the wind conditions between Liverpool and Heysham can be very different, and that the layout of the land and buildings around the ports means they are affected more by different wind directions. When asked if Manxman is too big for Heysham, Mr Royston says Manxman’s dimensions are based more on Douglas than Heysham, as Douglas is a smaller port. Manxman is 133m long but other vessels using Heysham are up to 147m long. He also adds it’s draught is pretty much the same as Ben-my-Chree’s and can be altered in port through the use of ballast tanks and the in-built stability sytem. Responding to accusations that Manxman was a cancelled cruise ship, they say the vessel was designed and built specifically for the Steam Packet to a bespoke design, based on the requirements of the Sea Service Agreement and using input from customer surveys. Finally, Mr Turner challenged claims that Manxman is not as precise or controllable as Ben-my-Chree. He says, for a ship of Manxman's size, she's a sustainably powered and capable vessel in terms of propulsion and thrust, and that she has nearly twice the bow thruster power compared to the Ben. He says Manxman also has special high lift rudders to aid with manoeuvrability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarndyce Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 Perhaps posting a link here would be better than “cutting & pasting” huge chunks of text straight off the MR website? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 30 minutes ago, 2112 said: The Mythbusters have been pressed back into service. A lot of people myth the ferry these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ringy Rose Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 9 hours ago, Kopek said: It doesn't really matter what the excuses, explanations are it is a fact that the failure of service is..... Ferries don’t travel in bad weather. Who the hell knew? 10 hours ago, Mercenary said: They're obviously keener to lean on the 'out of our control' factors but isn't the lack of berth availability (due to Steam Packet incident with number 1 linkspan at Heysham ) likely a significant factor? Very probably isn’t helping. I’d say that’s not within their control either, even if it was their ship that did the damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amadeus Posted September 11 Author Share Posted September 11 6 minutes ago, Ringy Rose said: Ferries don’t travel in bad weather. Who the hell knew? Very probably isn’t helping. I’d say that’s not within their control either, even if it was their ship that did the damage. This ferry isn’t. There are many variables involved. The Lady went out in way worse but was smaller, built for the Irish Sea and less likely to smack into the pier in heysham. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercenary Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 2 hours ago, Ringy Rose said: Ferries don’t travel in bad weather. Who the hell knew? Very probably isn’t helping. I’d say that’s not within their control either, even if it was their ship that did the damage. https://www.steam-packet.com/blog/customer-service-faqs-ongoing-changes-to-service-at-heysham-port/ Quote Why is IOMSPC not able to use the usual berth? The number 1 linkspan is thought to have been impacted by a vessel. "a vessel" ... could have been anyone's 🫣 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manx Paddy Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 Mr Royston and Mr Turner say the maximum wind speed, per the risk assessments, for Ben-my-Chree to berth in Heysham is very similar to Manxman’s, and therefore, the Ben-my-Chree couldn’t sail if Manxman wouldn’t have been able to either. It would be interesting to know what the maximum wind speed is per the risk assessment for each ship and how very similar the wind speed limit is for both ships. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Gay'n Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 3 hours ago, Jarndyce said: Perhaps posting a link here would be better than “cutting & pasting” huge chunks of text straight off the MR website? https://www.steam-packet.com/blog/iomspc-answers/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopek Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 4 hours ago, Ringy Rose said: Ferries don’t travel in bad weather. Who the hell knew? I fully understand that valid reasons can cause the number of cancellations, thank you! However, the reasons and excuses are not ........ '' It is not a good look for 'our' lifeline service? ''. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 (edited) 4 hours ago, Amadeus said: This ferry isn’t. There are many variables involved. The Lady went out in way worse but was smaller, built for the Irish Sea and less likely to smack into the pier in heysham. But wasn't carrying trailers and/or containers. The world and IOM has moved on. ETA: And the Lady had her fair share of prangs as well. Edited September 11 by Andy Onchan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 Considering the Steam Packet didn’t sail to Heysham for most of the life of the Lady it would be surprising if the Lady “smacked into a pier” at Heysham. 4 hours ago, Amadeus said: This ferry isn’t. There are many variables involved. The Lady went out in way worse but was smaller, built for the Irish Sea and less likely to smack into the pier in heysham. 13 minutes ago, Andy Onchan said: But wasn't carrying trailers and/or containers. The world and IOM has moved on. ETA: And the Lady had her fair share of prangs as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 4 hours ago, Amadeus said: This ferry isn’t. There are many variables involved. The Lady went out in way worse but was smaller, built for the Irish Sea and less likely to smack into the pier in heysham. Before health & safety, compensation culture and Facebook posts of people & cats being damaged etc. no one will take any chances whatsoever with your safety etc due to insurance requirements etc 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambon Posted September 11 Share Posted September 11 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Banker said: Before health & safety, compensation culture and Facebook posts of people & cats being damaged etc. no one will take any chances whatsoever with your safety etc due to insurance requirements etc This! Arrow goes in virtually anything. No or few passengers. I don’t particularly buy the “Windage” argument. Many, much bigger ships don’t seem to be affected by this. I doubt Manxman with its very powerful thrusters is. Edited September 11 by Cambon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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