Johnny F Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 Right, the top picture shows a massive force has cause the aluminium yoke to snap. The lower picture shows how steel can be eroded by having a fluid containing sand, blasted at it by a 4,ooo horse power engine for years. The other reversing flaps will be nearing the end of their useful lives now too Filters on the jets are not needed because nothing went through the jets to cause this damage. I have watched 4 inches of high carbon steel be eroded by fluid with sand in it in 15 minutes, so, please don't bother questioning my expertise. So what you trying to say? in your expert opinion (which I'm not questioning) the first picture was caused by debris and the second was caused through metal fatigue (ie age and force of the engine) I've no idea what cause the first but it must have been a huge force and it could not have been debris going through the jet or the jet would have been damaged too. The second looks like erosion by a highly erosive fluid, just like sea water with sand in it that the boat manoeuvres in every time it enters a port. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 You get what you accept. You deserve what you get. Isn't that axe you've been grinding for so long sharp enough yet? No. Incompetence and exploitation is still not fully exposed and accepted. The excuse about the UA precluding the removal of the unsuited fast craft is also interesting. Who pressed for the things to be mandated in the UA? There is a great need for FOI legislation and right now more than ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Surfer Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 Gosh Johnny F, It's a brilliant theory, but..... Manannan has been in service for a long time now. If erosion happens as quickly as you say it does, why hasn't this same thing happened many times before? And if the boat, and this equipment in particular, has been recently inspected as I understand it has to be every year in dock, why this time round has it only taken a few weeks for the failure? And just to be clear, unlike NeverAgain, I most definitely am questioning your 'expertise'! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny F Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 Gosh Johnny F, It's a brilliant theory, but..... Manannan has been in service for a long time now. If erosion happens as quickly as you say it does, why hasn't this same thing happened many times before? The high speed erosion I was referring to was to highlight the fact that water and solids can erode things very quickly. In this case it may have happened over many years. There are millions of factors which influence the speed of erosion, I am only offering an alternative to the debris theory. And if the boat, and this equipment in particular, has been recently inspected as I understand it has to be every year in dock, why this time round has it only taken a few weeks for the failure? Poor inspection technique, not using ultrasonic thickness meter, the list could go on. And just to be clear, unlike NeverAgain, I most definitely am questioning your 'expertise'! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pammie Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 (edited) So now, Johnny F, instead of the obvious answer - a large foreign object was ingested by Manannan's propulsion system and then clattered about causing extensive damage to that and the trim tab - it is now not only the CEO and the engineering staff of the Steam Packet lying to us, but the external Classification Society Surveyors who inspected the Manannan just three weeks ago. Are you really criticising their inspection techniques? It must be a conspiracy theorist's dream scenario. Oh, but don't forget, in that theory, you need to include the P&O ship - what spin can you put on their assertion that they too suffered damage to a trim tab when leaving the Island? Are they in on it too? It's more a case of Occam's razor - the simplest answer is most often correct - than of conspiracy theory. Edited April 9, 2015 by Pammie 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j2bad Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 So now, Johnny F, instead of the obvious answer - a large foreign object was ingested by Manannan's propulsion system and then clattered about causing extensive damage to that and the trim tab - it is now not only the CEO and the engineering staff of the Steam Packet lying to us, but the external Classification Society Surveyors who inspected the Manannan just three weeks ago. Are you really criticising their inspection techniques? It must be a conspiracy theorist's dream scenario. Oh, but don't forget, in that theory, you need to include the P&O ship - what spin can you put on their assertion that they too suffered damage to a trim tab when leaving the Island? Are they in on it too? It's more a case of Occam's razor - the simplest answer is most often correct - than of conspiracy theory. If only steam packet staff spent as much time communicating with their customers as they do bickering with anonymous forum posters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
When Skies Are Grey Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wann Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 (edited) We used to laugh like fuck at the pub naysayers and the likes, that said IRIS wouldn't work (pumping shit up hill all over from Ramsey to wherever). Fools Then there were the ones that had no qualifications whatsoever that said that it was a mighty Power Station we were building with a huge glass front and all that. They said it would cost hundreds of £millions which we couldn't afford. Fools they were, fools. And when they found out the size of the incinerator they all went - "nahh, we don't need one that big". I even heard one say it would need loads of fuel pumped into it to get it going all the time. The list goes on of course. I'll stay clear of the trains and trams and that, jeez, there's no bigger expert than the good ol' trainspotter. Actual bona fide establishment friendly experts are highly paid people who know exactly which side of their bread the jam caviar is spread. Edited April 10, 2015 by Wann 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 ...a large foreign object was ingested by Manannan's propulsion system...Bloody foreign objects...coming over here taking out all our ferries. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
When Skies Are Grey Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 I guess if you talk enough shit enough of the time, eventually something will be correct. Law of averages and all that....... We used to laugh like fuck at the pub naysayers and the likes, that said IRIS wouldn't work (pumping shit up hill all over from Ramsey to wherever). Fools Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monasqueen Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 If the steam packet had been honest about their problems and not relied on the old "fishing gear story" they wouldn't be getting half as much flack. A stray bit of monofilament fishing net doesn't snap chunks off a boat and put it out of service for a week Why don't you bother reading what they do put out to the press properly? If you did you would see that they don't mention fishing gear at all, but 'debris'. Just because lazy journalists re-reporting the story talk about fishing gear is no excuse for you not to bother to check your facts before you accuse people of dishonesty. Steam Packet management should think before blaming the press exclusively for putting out the old fishing gear stories. Looking at the Steam Packet's Facebook page, it seems a lot of would be passengers were told by Steam Packet staff that the vessel had been damaged by fishing gear. It seems that the lack of communication starts at the top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wann Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 I guess if you talk enough shit enough of the time, eventually something will be correct. Law of averages and all that....... We used to laugh like fuck at the pub naysayers and the likes, that said IRIS wouldn't work (pumping shit up hill all over from Ramsey to wherever). Fools I do agree WSAG. I suppose my point is that many of the times, the so-called experts - and this is particularly noticeable in our courts of justice - are just another opinion with letters after their name. As has been pointed out by our Pammie (actually for the other side of the argument): It's more a case of Occam's razor - the simplest answer is most often correct - than of conspiracy theory. Very often the 'man-in-pub' or the hairdresser or whoever can often be a prophetic voice of wisdom. (well, not the man in the pub, but my hairdresser is usually spot on) IRIS and Power Station being two glaringly obvious examples, but there are so many more. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 There are people who are members of this forum who actually are experts where some subjects are concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeverAgain Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 Anyone see the repair to the trim tab on SP's Facebook page? 2 new panels welded in? seems an odd choice to me, I'd have replaced all 3 pieces. Enough to pass an MOT no doubt (like replacing one wishbone rather than a pair of wishbones) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
When Skies Are Grey Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 There are people who are members of this forum who actually are experts where some subjects are concerned. Separating the wheat from the chaff is the hard part though.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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