Lxxx Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 Pongo. I think you and I are probably quite closely aligned here, except that I'm not so sure there's a 'plan / contol' agenda. Those involved are undoubtedly in powerful positions, where it makes good sense to think about what's coming over the horizon. That doesn't amount to colusion in moving towards a 'planned economy and enforcing control' though, and I suspect the very idea would be an anathema to most of the participants. Oh, and I agree with your analysis of Denis (Lord) Healey. Lxxx. I'm not arguing against 'checks and balances' (though have you any idea of the cost of the compliance burden to large businesses?). I also share your distaste for the taxpayer picking up the bill for failed private enterprises. However I think your argument that companies and states are uniting to bring about fascism is complete tosh. In fact I'd actually argue that it's the ongoing advance of capitalism that is leading many countries out of tyranny. Much of Africa, and even China are now doing much better now that SMS's 'profit driven corporations' increasingly act as a counterbalance to state control. The word 'fascism' tends to bring up different views than what it really in essence was, which is not far off what we are increasingly seeing materialise today. Howver I'm not one for all these 'isms' as they're all essentially bullshit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stopmakingsense Posted June 5, 2012 Author Share Posted June 5, 2012 Chinahand. Good post. Much more balanced and less snidey than mine. I'm afraid sanctimonious toss like Stopmaking sense is posting really gets my goat though. Yes, great post, me ol'China. And SMS's condescending arrogance is breathtaking; making the assumption that he is THE one-eyed man in a kingdom of the blind. Ha! I also appreciate Chinahand's posts. And I also respect that he doesn't get tangled up in silly bickering or name calling which seems a common theme on here which I can also be guilty of. Six days of Bilderberg spotting in Virginia with Charlie Skelton and others has got me a little bit excited. I'm saying nothing of the sort. It just pisses me off when people automatically start taring everything that contains a hint of secrecy with the lizard-man and the freemasons brush. That's where my angry comments are aimed at, not anybody I disagree with who has made an effort to contribute with a proper counter-argument. If people hold the view that these meetings are for our good then that's fine. I just happen to disagree that they are more likely to be serving their own interests in there rather than looking after us. All I'm doing is putting questions forward based on verifiable information about the group, its origins and its members and stating why I think it's important. We can disagree until our fingers fall off but please stop with the childish nonsense about super conspiracies from outer space. No one is saying that. The EU is essentially a Bilderberg creation, although the idea has been around longer but they practically nurtured it, and it's not doing so well. They discussed the common currency at their meetings in the 50s decades before it became a reality. A lot of people feel as though they have been slowly tricked into joining each step of the EU's creation along the way. I'm not against corporations in general and I think many of them do a lot of good but many of the corporations that attend this meeting each year hardly have the greatest record when it comes to honesty. Goldman Sachs being one of the worst ones that often have several representatives and links to Bilderberg. Corporations can act as a counterbalance but they can also act in collusion with government officials which is why I want openness. Good deeds are done in the sunshine. There's also the problem of the revolving door between business and politics that we have and the interlocking directorships between multiple corporations, foundations and other organisations. It's taken years of hard work by people from all sorts of backgrounds to even get them to admit that this meeting exists. I have a hard time believing that it is all just for our own good. That doesn't mean I'm saying it's a super conspiracy though which seems to be the automatic response of some people. It's seems quite natural that something like this would happen. I personally spoke to a member of staff leaving the hotel on Sunday which I also have on video. He said that one of the attendees called the people outside 'cockroaches'. How sweet of them. I think if these people are going to be making decisions that effect our lives, we have every right to know about it. Some members say that the meeting is nothing but a quiet chat yet others like Willy Claes who attended in 1994 said on Belgian radio that at Bilderberg each participant is given a report and they are "considered to use this report in setting their policies in the environments in which they affect". So which one is it? They constantly contradict each other by saying its nothing but also saying that they attempt to set policy outside of them meeting. Do they control the world? Absolutely not. But do they have the power to influence and shape it? Without doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alibaba Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 Good deeds are done in the sunshine. Hippy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 Will the last one out of this thread please switch-off the enlightenment.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 Click.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stopmakingsense Posted June 6, 2012 Author Share Posted June 6, 2012 I hope that was the sound of your fingers clicking while you ready yourself to type something worthwhile for a change... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 I hope that was the sound of your fingers clicking while you ready yourself to type something worthwhile for a change... Snigger... I ask myself how old you are and whether one day you might look back and think, ''did i really believe that shit?'' Mind you, how old is David Icke? I think i'd rather be ruled by a massive, 'collective-intelligence', who quite possibly know what's best for the future of mankind; people who, after-all, really do know what's going on. What evidence suggests this think-tank conspires to exert its will to the detriment of the world. Real evidence, i mean. Yours, is the burden of proof. I've no other comment on this thread, bored with it having heard it all before. But don't forget, even if you're not paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you. Peace and love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stopmakingsense Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 Hahaha, there you go again. It seems to be you that's jumping to conclusions about this not me. Find one instance where I've mentioned Icke, lizard men, freemasons, UFOs or late night conversations with the moon while off your bonce in the Brazilian rain forest in the way that you are insinuating? There isn't one. The information about the EU, early meeting summaries, memoirs, tax forms, the media blackout for decades and other quotes from members, they all exist. They are mostly from Bilderberg and its attendees themselves, not from some one track mind conspiracy book. Many of them contradict each other. Some say it's nothing, others say they try to set policy. Some even get all flustered and deny it exists when confronted. All you have done is try to muddy what I've said by mixing it in with the wildest crap out there as if I've said that. There's no paranoia here whatsoever, only curiosity as to just how much influence this group and its members have. At least the key members like the steering committee and regular attendees. Going off what is publicly available they've had a lot of influence during the last 60 years. The EU is no small thing and if you think the EU is a good thing and has saved us from half a century of wars like some people then OK, then fine, argue that. But I'd say they've hardly been honest publicly about their goal for the EU have they? In fact, they haven't been honest about very much at all. The history of the late 20th and early 21st century is incomplete without the inclusion of the key men and women involved in this meeting. If you want to twist that into me saying that I believe in demon worshiping black cloak wearing baby eating evil bastards possessed by lizard men from the 4th dimension then I feel sorry for you. You're just lumping me into a box based on a pre-conceived notion. The same with the others saying I'm some anti-capitalist bath dodging hippy anarchist who wants to year down the system or something like that. I want openness, not craziness. I want accountability. I have questions and rightly so. If they are doing such a good thing then why don't they share it with us all and let us thank them for being the great men and women that they are? Sneaking around in secret meeting under armed guard every year doesn't really portray such an image. Why don't they want us 'cockroaches' to know what they are discussing? If it is only what they discuss normally then why go to all that effort to hide it? Goodbye and enjoy the other threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yibble Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 In my work life, I am accountable for my decisions and for my performance. That's a very different thing from being required to have every conversation I have out in the open. I would suggest that the same is appropriate here. Their chosen approach (presumably) allows for intelligent, thoughtful and far-reaching discussion. Once the media and / or 'you lot' were in, it would all become about sound bites and public image. Anyway, we're clearly in 'agree to differ' territory. You feel the participants should be obliged to let you in on their conversations. I don't see that they should, and actually suspect that it's better that they don't. If you want to do something positive, why not start your own 'open forum' think tank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lxxx Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 I hope that was the sound of your fingers clicking while you ready yourself to type something worthwhile for a change... Snigger... I ask myself how old you are and whether one day you might look back and think, ''did i really believe that shit?'' Mind you, how old is David Icke? I think i'd rather be ruled by a massive, 'collective-intelligence', who quite possibly know what's best for the future of mankind; people who, after-all, really do know what's going on. What evidence suggests this think-tank conspires to exert its will to the detriment of the world. Real evidence, i mean. Yours, is the burden of proof. I've no other comment on this thread, bored with it having heard it all before. But don't forget, even if you're not paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you. Peace and love. If this topic doesn't interest you, and it's clearly beneath you, then go read something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alibaba Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Wonder if Ken Clarke's flight was paid for by the UK taxpayer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stopmakingsense Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 I wonder if his drinks were paid for too? He looked like he'd had a few the night before. I had a couple of pints there on Sunday and it wasn't cheap. In the US they have the Logan Act but not sure if they have something similar in the UK. Bilderberg tax forms from 2007-10 are available to read. They are ran under a 501c3 tax-exempt status and receive donations from various corporations like Goldman Sachs, Coca-Cola, The Washington Post Group, Microsoft but also individual members like Kissinger, Rockefeller and the Kravis'. Their tax free foundation is called American Friends of Bilderberg and organised by James A. Johnson but they booked the hotel out this year under the 'Palm Tree Club'. Not sure if that's their regular booking name or not but I called up and confirmed it this year. Johnson has been CEO of Fannie Mae and worked with Goldman Sachs, Lehman Brothers and others. He also served as chair of the VP selection committee for John Kerry in 2004 when John Edwards was chosen. Edwards was actually at that years Bilderberg meeting in Italy and was said to have impressed them with his speech. Johnson also served briefly as chair of Obama's VP selection committee in 2008. That was the year that he and Hillary went missing for the afternoon when Bilderberg were in Chantilly, Virginia and we saw the press fooled into waiting on his plane for him only for it to take off with no Obama. His press guy . It was very shortly after that when Hillary dropped out of the race. Interesting stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lxxx Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 "World events do not occur by accident. They are made to happen, whether it is to do with national inssues or commerce: most of them are staged and managed by those who hold the purse string" Dennis Healey. This from the guy who was on the steering committee of the innocent talking shop. There's no conspiracy, it's hidden in plain view, it's just that most people are not bothered either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbie Bobster Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Johnson also served briefly as chair of Obama's VP selection committee in 2008. That was the year that he and Hillary went missing for the afternoon when Bilderberg were in Chantilly, Virginia and we saw the press fooled into waiting on his plane for him only for it to take off with no Obama. His press guy . It was very shortly after that when Hillary dropped out of the race. Interesting stuff. You're pattern matching again. This isn't the savannah; those rustling leaves aren't a predator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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