Mountain Watch

[Roger Mexico]

2 hours ago, piebaps said:

It seems the evidence based approach which Flint Eastwood mentions doesn't apply to making snap judgements about the causes of accidents.

Well the usual cause of car accidents is someone having an accident in a car.  And as both of yesterday's appear to be single vehicle collisions, it's not unlikely that the drivers were driving too fast for the conditions.  But maybe they were attacked by giant vampire sheep or something.

[slinkydevil]

4 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said:

Well the usual cause of car accidents is someone having an accident in a car.  And as both of yesterday's appear to be single vehicle collisions, it's not unlikely that the drivers were driving too fast for the conditions.  But maybe they were attacked by giant vampire sheep or something.

Black Sheep. One of New Zealand's finest films.
 

 

[asitis]

42 minutes ago, slinkydevil said:

Black Sheep. One of New Zealand's finest films.
 

 

Is this one we blew 33 million on ? looks a blockbuster to me !

[WTF]

43 minutes ago, asitis said:

Is this one we blew 33 million on ? looks a blockbuster to me !

it did well in wales

[Max Power]

1 hour ago, Roger Mexico said:

Well the usual cause of car accidents is someone having an accident in a car.  And as both of yesterday's appear to be single vehicle collisions, it's not unlikely that the drivers were driving too fast for the conditions.  But maybe they were attacked by giant vampire sheep or something.

Yes, but mainly lack of attention to what is going on, speed is usually a by product.

[Boris Johnson]

2 hours ago, Roger Mexico said:

Well the usual cause of car accidents is someone having an accident in a car.  And as both of yesterday's appear to be single vehicle collisions, it's not unlikely that the drivers were driving too fast for the conditions.  But maybe they were attacked by giant vampire sheep or something.

Someone went through the wall on the second Waterworks bend yesterday too. Saw it today, just beside the metal gate, its just getting ridiculous now.

People that out of control can easily take out others. We need a limit AND speed cameras ASAP

[Derek Flint]

4 hours ago, piebaps said:

It seems the evidence based approach which Flint Eastwood mentions doesn't apply to making snap judgements about the causes of accidents.

Word.

2 hours ago, Roger Mexico said:

Well the usual cause of car accidents is someone having an accident in a car.  And as both of yesterday's appear to be single vehicle collisions, it's not unlikely that the drivers were driving too fast for the conditions.  But maybe they were attacked by giant vampire sheep or something.

 

31 minutes ago, Max Power said:

Yes, but mainly lack of attention to what is going on, speed is usually a by product.

The problem is that where on other routes they have reduced casualties by reduced by speed limits, attempts on the Mountainous Road have been through hugely expensive engineering (Brandish, Windy). It worked, but the same could have been achieved by posting design speed limits on each bit and enforcing them. Savings in today’s terms, probably a couple of million. 

What we actually have now is two bends which are much faster than what replaced them .

[Roger Mexico]

35 minutes ago, Max Power said:

Yes, but mainly lack of attention to what is going on, speed is usually a by product.

If your suggesting that people are driving faster and faster because of lack of attention, then they probably shouldn't be driving at all.   And a good way to stop them would be impose speed limits.

[Max Power]

6 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said:

If your suggesting that people are driving faster and faster because of lack of attention, then they probably shouldn't be driving at all.   And a good way to stop them would be impose speed limits.

Speed is a relative term, driving too fast for the conditions may still be within the imposed limit. Lack of concentration is what I feel is the primary cause of accidents, actually being at a speed which causes you to be unable to avoid a collision, at the very moment you would normally have reduced speed or stopped. I don't think people are driving faster and faster, they are becoming more and more distracted due to cars being easier to drive.

[Non-Believer]

7 minutes ago, Max Power said:

Speed is a relative term, driving too fast for the conditions may still be within the imposed limit. Lack of concentration is what I feel is the primary cause of accidents, actually being at a speed which causes you to be unable to avoid a collision, at the very moment you would normally have reduced speed or stopped. I don't think people are driving faster and faster, they are becoming more and more distracted due to cars being easier to drive.

Yes; but they're also becoming more and more insulated from the speed they're travelling at, the road conditions and the other road users too. Car technology has done that.

Huge safety improvements have made incidents arising from distraction and insulation survivable. But that's not curing the primary causes of the incidents; it's masking the problem.

[Boris Johnson]

I am convinced a lot of the inattention is due to mobiles, text, Facebook, twatter, Porn Hub looking/ reading and responding etc.

And before anyone says that a speed limit would not stop that it wouldn't but if you are distracted at 50mph you have a lot more time to correct your errant car than you do at 70mph

I am currently driving over the mountain and have managed top avoid 3 nasty crashes because I am doing 50 while writing th.,uihjhufyfdfgb9uy97yhoi..oiji[

Edited August 19, 2020 by Boris Johnson

[doc.fixit]

I rather think that because all vehicles are so much faster, quieter and comfortable and better handling that it is easy to not appreciate the actual speed, especially for in-experienced drivers.

The speed at which the vehicle loses adhesion is so much higher, that the incident is therefore much more serious.

Maybe if folk drove with the windows open the speed would be more obvious? Maybe.

I was a motor cyclist first, followed by cars, (on cross ply tyres of course), then onto HGVs and PSVs. I'm not suggesting that folk should all follow that progression but just as with bikes maybe, it would be good that learner car drivers should have a similar progression to bikes, (or even pass their m'bike test first). Maybe they should be limited to low power cars for the first year of driving?

Just a few suggestions that are NOT aimed at young drivers but ALL new drivers.

Sorry NB you just beat me to it.

Edited August 19, 2020 by doc.fixit

[flaps]

16 minutes ago, Max Power said:

 I don't think people are driving faster and faster, they are becoming more and more distracted due to cars being easier to drive.

I think they are. Or at least, more drivers are going too fast. It's not just the odd boy racer dickhead now - it's all sorts of people; Mums in Range Rovers, Athol Street types, builders in vans, all sorts, going far far too fast. Speeds that would attract the attention of the police on a motorway are commonplace on our country roads. It's not just the mountain. Gansey/Fishers Hill, Poortown, Cronk-y-Voddy, Ballamodha. I'm amazed at some of our roads that have no limit at all. Many of the roads around the north have no limit, despite being lined with houses, farms, junctions etc. There's a section between lower Foxdale and The Hope that has no limit. The houses all have mirrors opposite their driveways. It must be a nightmare getting out of their own house. There's a blind dip too. So much for the "evidence based approach".

[dilligaf]

46 minutes ago, flaps said:

I think they are. Or at least, more drivers are going too fast. It's not just the odd boy racer dickhead now - it's all sorts of people; Mums in Range Rovers, Athol Street types, builders in vans, all sorts, going far far too fast. Speeds that would attract the attention of the police on a motorway are commonplace on our country roads. It's not just the mountain. Gansey/Fishers Hill, Poortown, Cronk-y-Voddy, Ballamodha. I'm amazed at some of our roads that have no limit at all. Many of the roads around the north have no limit, despite being lined with houses, farms, junctions etc. There's a section between lower Foxdale and The Hope that has no limit. The houses all have mirrors opposite their driveways. It must be a nightmare getting out of their own house. There's a blind dip too. So much for the "evidence based approach".

Was tailgated today at speeds up to 75mph, by what I thought would be a boy racer. Very tempted to brake test him, but thought better of it. Got to the two lanes at Governors Bridge, only to see that the “boy racer” was a fit young blonde. 

[dilligaf]

1 hour ago, Derek Flint said:

Word.

 

The problem is that where on other routes they have reduced casualties by reduced by speed limits, attempts on the Mountainous Road have been through hugely expensive engineering (Brandish, Windy). It worked, but the same could have been achieved by posting design speed limits on each bit and enforcing them. Savings in today’s terms, probably a couple of million. 

What we actually have now is two bends which are much faster than what replaced them .

Faster than what they replaced you mean ? They were done to increase lap times at the TT, not for safety reasons. Same as the Veranda, Wild life park, Snugborough etc etc. The list is endless.