Mountain Watch

[Roger Mexico]

17 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

But presumably these are only the ones that are reported Roger and which maybe the authorities attend? As a daily commuter and regular work user of the Mountain Rd, there's evidence of any number of "off-road excursions" during the year, flattened fences, marks in turf and on verges, demolished walls, skid marks veering off the carriageway that perhaps are never reported and which didn't make it into the official figures? That graph doesn't appear to show half as many for the Mountain as I would have expected?

Remember this is for 2020-21, so it would have included a lot of the first lockdown and the subsequent one.  Here's the 2019-20 one:

where there are hardly any gaps in the line of accident blobs that make up the Mountain Road.

In practice all such accidents should be reported to the police.  You only don't have to do this with non-injury accidents between cars, where you agree not to bother, but you're unlikely to know whose sheep or fence you have damaged to contact them, so you have to go to the coppers.

[Shake me up Judy]

31 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

But presumably these are only the ones that are reported Roger and which maybe the authorities attend? As a daily commuter and regular work user of the Mountain Rd, there's evidence of any number of "off-road excursions" during the year, flattened fences, marks in turf and on verges, demolished walls, skid marks veering off the carriageway that perhaps are never reported and which didn't make it into the official figures? That graph doesn't appear to show half as many for the Mountain as I would have expected?

There's some serious under-recording going on here. There are far more incidents on the Mountain Road than shown on this graph. Those who commute regularly see the evidence every week. Any comment Derek ?

[Non-Believer]

26 minutes ago, Shake me up Judy said:

There's some serious under-recording going on here. There are far more incidents on the Mountain Road than shown on this graph. Those who commute regularly see the evidence every week. Any comment Derek ?

As Roger says, the authorities only record what they know about, those incidents that they are called to and/or which the GMP are honest enough to report. The rest will never make it into the stats.

Plus the first graph posted is for the lockdown period with the reduction in traffic. The second is more representative of normality IMHO.

[Derek Flint]

1 hour ago, Shake me up Judy said:

There's some serious under-recording going on here. There are far more incidents on the Mountain Road than shown on this graph. Those who commute regularly see the evidence every week. Any comment Derek ?

If it isn’t a reportable RTC there’s no need for the police to know, nor attend.

[Roger Mexico]

1 hour ago, Shake me up Judy said:

There's some serious under-recording going on here. There are far more incidents on the Mountain Road than shown on this graph. Those who commute regularly see the evidence every week. Any comment Derek ?

Maybe less than you think.  As I said above the only practical exemptions are knock-for-knock minor accidents, I suspect there aren't that many on the Mountain Road because two car collisions will tend to be more serious because of the speed.  If you look at the map a much higher proportion of accidents are the more serious ones compared to say Central Douglas.  Though it wouldn't surprise me if there were quite a few minor damage ones that the landowners didn't bother to report and the drivers hadn't either.

But most accidents are likely to be reported by other drivers anyway - if you see a car go off the edge you'll ring 999.  And evidence of minor accidents will be around for weeks.  But even with the reported ones it clear just how many there are if you look at the 2019-20 map.

[Shake me up Judy]

But it's the police that are closing the road every week because of accidents up there.

[Zarley]

On the accident map, there are quite a few spots on the mountain road that look like multiple spots superimposed on each other. If they'd included a blown up mountain section similar to the Douglas section, I think there'd be many more accidents visible. Many.

[HeliX]

12 hours ago, Derek Flint said:

The mountain road is the elephant in the room. It’s the contradiction that I find hard to reconcile. Close it, marshal it, put medical cover in and make it one way, and they slap a speed restriction on (per last weeks FOM, Audi launch) open it two way for general use, no upper limit?

that simply does not stack up.

It probably sees the same amount of traffic in 2 weeks at TT as every other day of the year combined though. It's not quite apples and apples.

[Non-Believer]

1 hour ago, HeliX said:

It probably sees the same amount of traffic in 2 weeks at TT as every other day of the year combined though. It's not quite apples and apples.

But that doesn't explain the difference in the volume of RTIs between the Mountain Rd and the rest of the TT course which sees the same increase in TT traffic?

[HeliX]

8 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

But that doesn't explain the difference in the volume of RTIs between the Mountain Rd and the rest of the TT course which sees the same increase in TT traffic?

Eh? That's not what Derek was talking about, so far as I can tell?

[The Voice of Reason]

1 hour ago, Shake me up Judy said:

But it's the police that are closing the road every week because of accidents up there.

But they are not accidents. They are a result of twats not driving properly.

Everyone who uses that road ( myself included) has their own tale (s) of how they have narrowly avoided death or serious injury by idiots acting irresponsibly.

Much as I don’t want a police state I would take some comfort if I knew the driver following a foot and a half behind me at 50/60 mph, or overtaking me on a blind bend, was being recorded as doing so.

(Doesn’t help you if you’re dead though)

[Non-Believer]

2 minutes ago, HeliX said:

Eh? That's not what Derek was talking about, so far as I can tell?

There are as many, if not more, reported (alone) incidents on the Mountain Rd as there are on the rest of the TT course combined. Lob in the unreported and it would be an even greater disparity.

That situation has nothing to do with any volume of TT traffic, that's a red herring. It arises from a lack of restriction on the Mountain, additionally exacerbated by weather conditions up there.

As Derek says, the unrestricted criteria don't stack up.

[HeliX]

Just now, Non-Believer said:

There are as many, if not more, reported (alone) incidents on the Mountain Rd as there are on the rest of the TT course combined. Lob in the unreported and it would be an even greater disparity.

That situation has nothing to do with any volume of TT traffic, that's a red herring. It arises from a lack of restriction on the Mountain, additionally exacerbated by weather conditions up there.

As Derek says, the unrestricted criteria don't stack up.

I don't disagree that there are likely more incidents on the mountain than the rest of the course due to the nature of the road and the conditions. Plenty of derestricted bits that aren't on the mountain, though.

But Derek's question was how you can justify a limit during TT week and other events, but not outside of TT week. Which is what I was answering!

[finlo]

19 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

But that doesn't explain the difference in the volume of RTIs between the Mountain Rd and the rest of the TT course which sees the same increase in TT traffic?

They haven't lapped the course for years as it's 99% restricted, they go over the mountain drop down the Creg back road to Laxey back to Ramsey and over again hence the speed restrictions on the coast road.

[snowman]

A speed limit will be imposed when one of the great and good die. Until then that road is a lottery