quilp Posted May 3, 2013 Share Posted May 3, 2013 Whenever there's news of this kind, faster than a speeding bullet, the same people on here get fired-up and carry on the same arguments with the same theories and reach the same (in)conclusions. It's all a bit samey, really.... It seems some of you knobs only get erect when you're given the opportunity to spout off high-calibre nonsense with small-bore effect. What have you said here that you've not said before? How far can you go on this stuff..? Oh, and well put earlier, Declan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruger Posted May 3, 2013 Share Posted May 3, 2013 I don't know you could go and ask them BB. Interesting how such a viciforus objector to to the firearms industry in America went and directly contributed to it with his own cash... someone had to pay for the ammunition expended. Dear oh dear. Still trying to cling onto the moral high ground MDO?. Well done. Some of your cash has ended up with the evil NRA because apparently its funded by the evil arms industry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruger Posted May 3, 2013 Share Posted May 3, 2013 Whenever there's news of this kind, faster than a speeding bullet, the same people on here get fired-up and carry on the same arguments with the same theories and reach the same (in)conclusions. It's all a bit samey, really.... It seems some of you knobs only get erect when you're given the opportunity to spout off high-calibre nonsense with small-bore effect. What have you said here that you've not said before? How far can you go on this stuff..? Oh, and well put earlier, Declan. Why are you here then?. Notice how Its always the same Individual doing the provoking?. If someone called your cousin a Moron amongst other things, would you not feel it worth making a case of defense?. All I've done is defend existing policy and apparently that makes you... well you already know (of coarse). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScotsAlan Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 Au contraire. People hate the NRA because the lame stream media tells them to hate it, and makes the people believe it's nothing ore than a well funded lobby group for gun manufactures. Which is frankly drivel of the highest order, it is a lobby group made up of over 5Million members of the public representing about 88Million gun owners in America. Where did this come from? Only 5 million members ? So the NRA is definately a minority lobbying body then. You can't claim 88 million Americans feel represented by the NRA. You can only really claim 5 million are. The ones who pay their dues. The other 83 million just happen to have guns. You are trying to paint a picture of 88 million gun toting Americans ready to plunge their country into civil war if Obama tries to take their guns away. But it's not is it? It's 5 million paid up, card carrying members. Sorry if I come across as personally attacking you Ruger. It's not intended. It's the line of thought you are presenting that I am attacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScotsAlan Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 Ohh... look. They are having their AGM. http://home.nra.org/ They claim to be patriots fighting for freedom. Some weird stuff indeed on there. What they are basically saying is that they are the only sensible people, that they are the real American patriots. They are the people fighting for freedom against the liberal press and a wannabe oppressive Government. It puts me more in mind on an unelected paramilitary organisation rather than a gun club who want's their members to be able to shoot turkeys and deer. If this was a well funded political party in any other country, I wonder if they would make it onto the American Governments terror list? Yeah...... " If God didn't make them equal..... Samuel Colt did" ( Sponsered by Colt Industries). If they really believe that, they should give the turkeys guns too... just to equal things up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jefferson Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 Whenever there's news of this kind, faster than a speeding bullet, the same people on here get fired-up and carry on the same arguments with the same theories and reach the same (in)conclusions. It's all a bit samey, really.... It seems some of you knobs only get erect when you're given the opportunity to spout off high-calibre nonsense with small-bore effect. What have you said here that you've not said before? How far can you go on this stuff..? Oh, and well put earlier, Declan. Maybe if brainwashed people (who aren't even American themselves) would stop calling for the revocation of the American people's inalienable rights every time the mainstream corporate-owned media spoon feeds them with another of their regular anti-gun propaganda campaigns....... With all the propaganda to take away guns from the American citizenry, it's a wonder the mainstream media are able to find the time to report on all the children being brutally slain by Obama's drone strikes. Oh wait, my mistake --- they don't report on that! People really need to wake up and stop letting the corporate media do their thinking for them. The corporate media have an agenda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScotsAlan Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 The NRA have an agenda too. I am interested in this debate because the USA are the self proclaimed police of the world. As such, I think everyone is entitled to have an opinion. They are always telling the world that their way is the best and everyone should copy them..... Otherwise they may just come and bomb the fuck out of you and your country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruger Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 The world police that is the US Federal government?, they are at war with the US constitution. It is and always will be a thorn in their side. You disapprove of the Federal government but happen to approve of it when it comes to chipping away at the Constitution?. Actually PETA are on the US terrorist organisation list because they regularly commit acts of crime and violence to try and further their cause. I'm yet to see Wayne go into the white house and gun down Obama or Biden. All they do is lobby peacefully. Hardly terrorists. Those 5Million are just the most vocal and politically active of all America's gun owners. Like many associations. In the days post Newtown, or post Obama's Newtown speech, their membership grew by 1Million because some knew they were going to need the extra support. Many more went out and spoke with their wallets by clearing out all the gun shops. The market supply still hasn't recovered. Its funny to see the left jump for joy at the Boston marathon attacks speculating within minutes that it was the "right wing" gun owners. Yes even look at the other thread, and it was mentioned on the BBC several times. How disappointed they must have been when it turned out to be more home grown Islamist terrorists (thanks to Obama dropping hellfire missiles all over Pakistan) . It's awful easy for people sitting in their Ivory towers in China and the British Isles to claim Americans are morons and that their constitution should be torn to pieces over a bunch of preventable accidents and acts of evil. But when terrorists and evil people use something else to cause carnage, they say nothing. The worst school massacre in American history was carried out by a psyco and his home made bombs. When the second largest mass murder in America (to 9/11) was carried out by a farmers fertiliser packed into the back of a van, they say nothing. When the lame stream media fail to report the hundreds of thousands of crimes prevented by gun owners they know nothing. When a mad man kills 9 women in India with an Axe they say nothing. The school meat cleaver and knife attacks in China, again, nothing. But when the shit hits the fan in America because Obama tries to dismantle their constitution, guess who won't be there?. You. When the second amendment is needed, guess who won't be there?. You. "The beauty of the Second Amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." - Thomas Jefferson Say what you like about the NRA, if it wasn't for them the entire constitution would have been picked to bits by the federal government long ago. Not just the 2A. Like Bladerunner says, why do you all care so much?, why does the BBC report it so much when really very few except a rabid minority appear to care?. Why do you only claim to care about the United states 4.7 per 100K homicide rate (which is still only ranked 52nd worldwide even though they are ranked 1st for private gun ownership), when a white dude goes and shoots up a school?, because those attacks aren't even able to alter that statistic by a fraction of a percent. Nobody really cares about the black on black crime, poverty, drug wars and general inner city violence until these attacks occur. Then you jump on that statistic like it somehow* means something to you. *sp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruger Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 Au contraire. People hate the NRA because the lame stream media tells them to hate it, and makes the people believe it's nothing ore than a well funded lobby group for gun manufactures. Which is frankly drivel of the highest order, it is a lobby group made up of over 5Million members of the public representing about 88Million gun owners in America. Where did this come from? Only 5 million members ? So the NRA is definately a minority lobbying body then. Who is the opposing lobby and what is their membership?. It carries the weight in congress because it outweighs any or all opposition. I don't see how Its a minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonan3 Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 In its early days, the National Rifle Association was a grassroots social club that prided itself on independence from corporate influence. While that is still part of the organization's core function, today less than half of the NRA's revenues come from program fees and membership dues. The bulk of the group's money now comes in the form of contributions, grants, royalty income, and advertising, much of it originating from gun industry sources. Since 2005, the gun industry and its corporate allies have given between $20 million and $52.6 million to it through the NRA Ring of Freedom sponsor program. Donors include firearm companies like Midway USA, Springfield Armory Inc, Pierce Bullet Seal Target Systems, and Beretta USA Corporation. Other supporters from the gun industry include Cabala's, Sturm Rugar & Co, and Smith & Wesson. The NRA also made $20.9 million — about 10 percent of its revenue — from selling advertising to industry companies marketing products in its many publications in 2010, according to the IRS Form 990. Additionally, some companies donate portions of sales directly to the NRA. Crimson Trace, which makes laser sights, donates 10 percent of each sale to the NRA. Taurus buys an NRA membership for everyone who buys one of their guns. Sturm Rugar gives $1 to the NRA for each gun sold, which amounts to millions. The NRA's revenues are intrinsically linked to the success of the gun business. The NRA Foundation also collects hundreds of thousands of dollars from the industry, which it then gives to local-level organizations for training and equipment purchases. This shift is key to understanding why a coalition of hunters, collectors and firearm enthusiasts takes the heat for incidents of gun violence, like the shooting massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School, rather than the companies that manufacture and market assault weapons. The chief trade association for gun manufacturers is the National Shooting Sports Federation, which is, incidentally, located in Newtown, Conn. But the NRA takes front and center after each and every shooting. "Today's NRA is a virtual subsidiary of the gun industry," said Josh Sugarmann, executive director of the Violence Policy Center. "While the NRA portrays itself as protecting the 'freedom' of individual gun owners, it's actually working to protect the freedom of the gun industry to manufacture and sell virtually any weapon or accessory." There are two reasons for the industry support for the NRA. The first is that the organization develops and maintains a market for their products. The second, less direct function, is to absorb criticism in the event of PR crises for the gun industry. It's possible that without the NRA, people would be protesting outside of Glock, SIG Sauer and Freedom Group — the makers of the guns used in the Sandy Hook Elementary School massacre — and dragging the CEOs in front of cameras and Congress. That is certainly what happened to tobacco executives when their products continued killing people. Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/gun-industry-funds-nra-2013-1#ixzz2SKOW5O6z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruger Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 Works both ways. 2 second google, the gun control lobby is perfectly well funded. http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-21921875 New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg is bankrolling a $12m (£7.8m) advertising campaign for tougher gun control laws. It would still be interesting to hear of the opposing lobby and its actual membership?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonan3 Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 I'm assuming you mean the Violence Policy Centre http://www.vpc.org/aboutvpc.htm I'm far from being any kind of expert on American lobby groups - but I have to say that they certainly sound a lot less rabid than the NRA. At the same time you're absolutely right, I really couldn't care less if the Americans shoot each other in their own country; not even if they adopt a policy of 'last man standing.' - just as long as they stop promoting their society as being anything other than severely sick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilitantDogOwner Posted May 4, 2013 Author Share Posted May 4, 2013 Works both ways. 2 second google, the gun control lobby is perfectly well funded. http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-21921875 New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg is bankrolling a $12m (£7.8m) advertising campaign for tougher gun control laws. It would still be interesting to hear of the opposing lobby and its actual membership?. Big difference between the two...one is working to reduce gun related violence, and the other wants as many guns as possible of the streets to maximise profits margins... I know which one I'd prefer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScotsAlan Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 Surely the second amendment is an amendment.... So it can be ammended . I just done a quick Google and it seems other parts have been amended .. But on my mobile so won't post links. well worth a Google tho. Edit.... I mean amendments have been changed or repealed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScotsAlan Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 The 18th amendment was ditched .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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