Chinahand Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Did Socrates exist? Or was he an invention of Plato? I don't think that is a simple argument to make, but I am sure some academic somewhere has made it, and in listening to that argument you are likely to learn something about ancient Greece and its philosophers. As with Jesus and Paul. Can we know anything more than the smallest details about what Socrates actually said and did from the writings of Plato? That is a far far more defensible academic argument. There do exist some elements to the Jesus story which mean Paul could have been learning about more than one cult while he was persecuting non-conformist Jews and these were then conflated together. Could one cult have been worshiping an Angel which they named Jesus, another cult had a memory of a holyman called Whoever who made speeches about the poor inheriting the world and who's brother now leads the cult, and a third cult could be following a different holyman who talked about turning the other cheek, with these ideas then mixed together by Paul? TJ claims such an idea is totally wrong, no way, nah, nah, nah I'm not listening. They aren't particularly parsimonious, but they aren't irrational - looking at how the Mormons and Scientologists have myth made - there are also the contradictions within the gospels and epistles which show there was confusion about what the message of Christianity was and the compromises made at Nicaea etc. Personally I think Jesus was a historical person, but I do acknowledge what we know of early Christianity could be an amalgam from more than one charismatic personality and disentangling who said what, from who claimed it was said by who is basically impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Jesus did exist which is proven by the existence of Christians in the 1st century -- before the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem in 79 CE. The Jerusalem Church, led by James, was destroyed during that time, which is when power shifted to the churches in Rome and Alexandria. Also, the early church had apostolic succession, which was passed on from apostle to apostle, all the way back to Peter, who was also the first Bishop of Rome. There is plenty of evidence of Christians at this early stage, which proves Jesus existed. Religions don't just invent themselves. This claim that a group of people just made up a historical human being, claiming he had lived only decades earlier, and invented a religion around him is the most ridiculous conspiracy theory I have ever heard. If you actually study the early expansion of Christianity across the known world, you'll see how untenable it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jefferson Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Can the moderators please bring in a rule that you have to post at least a sentence of text instead of posting a dumb meme? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Can the moderators please bring in a rule that you have to post at least a sentence of text truth instead of posting a dumb meme fallacy? Why? A picture paints a thousand words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jefferson Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Why? A picture paints a thousand words. List them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Proof that TJ exists: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Can the moderators please bring in a rule that you have to post at least a sentence of text instead of posting a dumb meme?If stupid trolls are allowed, then so are stupid pictures. Soz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jefferson Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 a_picture_is_worth_a_thousand_words_by_shadowxomega5-d50oo8p.png Likewise, a word is worth a thousand pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Trumps Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Oh God, it's Zen truth now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Can the moderators please bring in a rule that you have to post at least a sentence of text instead of posting a dumb meme? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevster Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 years of extensive research that I've done Oh please tell how you, who was always pleading poverty, funded this extensive research..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jefferson Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Oh please tell how you, who was always pleading poverty, funded this extensive research..... Sponsorships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevster Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Oh please tell how you, who was always pleading poverty, funded this extensive research..... Sponsorships. Bollox - who in their right mind would pay for you to research their crackpot ideas? - Or did you just 'do research' by watching Chomsky videos and reading books? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jefferson Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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