Not a tax haven.

[one hung low]

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think you are trying to make something out of nothing.

The bottom line is that the information is all there and perfectly available.

If I want to know anything about a company I can find it. I know, because I did exactly that recently.

 

Also, I don't think it should be simple for people to access a persons data just because they are fucking nosey.

 

 

Whereas now it's like finding a needle in a haystack. And yet it allows the likes of Bell and Teare et al to say, as you did: "...the information is all there and perfectly available".

 

i think you are intentionally missing the point about this whole subject.

 

The Isle of Man is even more of a secrecy jurisdiction than it was 10 years ago. (But hey, it's just to stop nosey people)

[pongo]

This thread is getting into the realm of conspiracy nonsense IMO.

 

It's obvious that 'offshore' is gradually going to be legislated out of existence. That's the trend. But we all knew that this time last week. So nothing, particularly, has changed.

[Roger Mexico]

Craig Murray made that very point

I accept that probably not all of the people who turn up as guests on Alex Jones are conspiracy theorists. But he has always rather seemed to lean in that direction.

 

Well sometimes conspiracies do exist, and with Murray's history you'd be surprised if he didn't have a tendency in that direction though he doesn't normally side with the loonier believers. But mostly the conspiracies that do exist are what you might call 'conspiracies of interest'. This doesn't require people getting together in a big group to plan some nefarious activity, it just means that the same group of people (or organisations) have the same interests in a certain situation and will act together against the interests of the public without formal (or even much informal) coordination.

 

There's a good example of this at the moment. It's been widely known in the media for some time that the Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport (and so the person ultimately responsible for regulating the Press), John Whittingdale, had a year-long relationship with a professional dominatrix. This came out on an independent news site a few days back[1], but it is clear that attempts had been made to publish in the more conventional media in the past.

 

Now normally this is the sort of story about any other politician the tabloids would be slavering over (and the 'qualities' would primly report in full with the excuse of 'Look what these dreadful tabloids are saying'), but media silence has been complete. Is Whittingdale blackmailing the media? Are the media blackmailing Whittingdale to stop him regulating them properly? Did he pay for this young lady's attentions or did someone else finance her to entrap him? (Because frankly she looks out of his league)[2]. While I have no interest in what he gets up to in the bedroom (or dungeon)[3], the universal silence of the media about a story they would normally be all over raises these important questions.

 

Now I don't think that all the newspaper's editors and owners got together in a secret meeting to plan this, though there may have been a few phone calls to make sure everyone was 'on board'. But it still operates like a conspiracy even if it isn't one in the terms people normally think of.

 

 

[1] Personally, given that the author is called Nick Mutch, I wouldn't have published on 1st April, but the story seems well evidenced and hasn't been denied anywhere.

 

[2] In a neat echo of the Profumo Affair, there's also allegations that she has links with convicted criminals, but I think this is stretching it in grounds for concern.

 

[3] Well obviously a little because I'm Manx and gossip is what we do. But I could live without knowing.

[NoTail]

I am mightily impresses by the Icelandic response. Their rich and powerful will need to watch themselves if they are not paying the same taxes as their "common" people.

 

I see nothing, or very little, wrong with the Manx institutions/laws/regulations. I see a lot wrong with those in other territories taking advantage and thereby causing those others in their communities to fork out more than necessary to pay for the society they want.

[woolley]

 

There may be votes in hammering the tax havens as Barrie said, but that is not really important because politicians are not really important. They are short term and expendable. How it all pans out will be decided globally over a protracted period by those several strata above politicians and it will be based on their reading of what they can preserve of their privileged position for future generations and what they might sacrifice to keep the lid.

That's borderline secret-world-govt stuff IMO.

 

I don't mean in a round table hammering it out kind of way but, de facto, this is how it will happen and it will take a long time. Don't underestimate the power of networking among the powerful. Money talks.

Edited April 5, 2016 by woolley

[pongo]

this is the sort of story about any other politician the tabloids would be slavering over ... Is -- blackmailing the media? Are the media blackmailing -- ?

Your example rather proves the point. In asking whether blackmail is involved you are suggesting that it might be. The implication, in the item on the anonymous blog, is that it probably is. In that sense it's already innuendo. It's a conspiracy theory - it makes a connection between things without any evidence of there being a connection.

[woolley]

This thread is getting into the realm of conspiracy nonsense IMO.

 

It's obvious that 'offshore' is gradually going to be legislated out of existence. That's the trend. But we all knew that this time last week. So nothing, particularly, has changed.

I don't think so at all. It is not conspiracy nonsense. Not in the gerry sense of "we never went to the moon". We all know that tax evasion is going on globally and is enormous. We all know that the major powers could stop it if they wanted to but they don't. They pay lip service and they make minor changes over many years. Do you believe that this is all due to laxity and incompetence on their part? Of course it isn't. It is self-serving.

 

I don't think it is "obvious" that offshore is going to be legislated out of existence, but if it is, the same interests will be looking to carry on the activity elsewhere whilst applauding yet another blow against "abuse".

[Karellen]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think you are trying to make something out of nothing.

The bottom line is that the information is all there and perfectly available.

If I want to know anything about a company I can find it. I know, because I did exactly that recently.

 

Also, I don't think it should be simple for people to access a persons data just because they are fucking nosey.

 

 

Whereas now it's like finding a needle in a haystack. And yet it allows the likes of Bell and Teare et al to say, as you did: "...the information is all there and perfectly available".

 

i think you are intentionally missing the point about this whole subject.

 

The Isle of Man is even more of a secrecy jurisdiction than it was 10 years ago. (But hey, it's just to stop nosey people)

 

 

Does anyone have a right to privacy any longer, or does everything have to be open and transparent to anyone who cares to look?

Article 8 of the Human Rights Act states that "Everyone has the right to respect for his private and family life, his home and his correspondence".

 

So if I'm in business and own shares in a legitimate company, why should anyone (other than tax and law enforcement) be able to look at what shares in that company I might own? What business is it of anyone else, any more than the balance of my bank account. It is no-one's business.

 

And privacy is not always about tax evasion. Is the King of Saudi Arabia really avoiding tax by using a BVI company?

 

Stretching the analogy, what if I am a business person in the fictional country of Volgaria and I have earned / saved a modest pension nest-egg, denominated in that safe and secure currency the British Pound, on which tax has been paid in Volgaria, and which is earning a nice rate of interest at the Bank of Volgaria. Now lets say that the Volgarian government decides to seize all British Pounds in the country and replace them with Volgarian Pesos at an exchange rate of its choosing. Or worse, I am accused of being a Bolshevik, profiteering from my hard working comrades by disloyally holding onto a foreign currency, and I am rounded up for compulsory re-education at a far away work camp.

 

So being aware of these risks, rather than invest my hard earned Pounds in the Bank of Volgaria, I set up a company in the sunny Virgin Islands and put my Pounds into a bank account in the Isle of Man. My retirement fund will be safe, I think. Until the day arrives that information on my Volgarian residency becomes freely available to anyone with an itchy nose, or the Volgarians and Manx governments enter into a tax information sharing agreement, or until information is leaked by those clever newspaper people, putting my business in Volgaria - perhaps even my life, at risk.

 

Far fetched? Couldn't happen? Perhaps not today, but look at your history and who knows about a few years hence by when our freedoms and privacy will have been eroded by successive governments, beyond redemption .

[Roger Mexico]

Your example rather proves the point. In asking whether blackmail is involved you are suggesting that it might be. The implication, in the item on the anonymous blog, is that it probably is. In that sense it's already innuendo. It's a conspiracy theory - it makes a connection between things without any evidence of there being a connection.

 

But everything is 'innuendo' until it's investigated and verified or refuted. But if people are running round shouting "Nothing to see here!" you've got to be fairly naive to take them at their word.

 

In this case some sort of connection is indeed highly plausible. Not because the newspapers are sending notes made of cut-up headlines, but because of 'understandings'. And those sort of influences can stop things that the public would like to see happening. In the same way if say Cameron or Putin or whoever are (a) personally benefiting from some sort of arrangement and (b) allowing that arrangement to continue we are entitled to draw conclusions.

[pongo]

Do you believe that this is all due to laxity and incompetence on their part? Of course it isn't. It is self-serving.

I don't believe in they.

[notwell]

The King of Saudi news make me laugh - stop press - owner and ruler (and law maker) of tax free country is hiding money to avoid, er, tax.

You couldn't make it up.

 

Stop press - Saudi ruler has loads of assets in foreign countries.

Really. We never knew.

[NoTail]

I think the point when it comes to dictators is that they want to keep the location of the funds a secret. When they are overthrown the new bunch of thugs will not be able to trace where the money is.

[notwell]

 

this is the sort of story about any other politician the tabloids would be slavering over ... Is -- blackmailing the media? Are the media blackmailing -- ?

Your example rather proves the point. In asking whether blackmail is involved you are suggesting that it might be. The implication, in the item on the anonymous blog, is that it probably is. In that sense it's already innuendo. It's a conspiracy theory - it makes a connection between things without any evidence of there being a connection.

 

Anyone in his position would have been splashed all over every news outlet.

 

It's very odd that it isn't.

[pongo]

In this case some sort of connection is indeed highly plausible.

No. It's utterly inconceivable that the Sec of State and therefore, by implication the entire Cabinet, is being blackmailed by, or is blackmailing, the media. Especially over something as relatively trivial as a relationship with someone who is alleged to be some sort of a hooker. At best it's a resignation. Let's not forget that Osborne ended up as Chancellor despite the Mail publishing similar stuff about him. This isn't the early 60s.

 

You're in conspiracy world.

[Tweek]

Oh deer. Luoks leeke-a zee-a prime-a meenister ouff iceluond is deep in zee-a puop

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35966412