Not a tax haven.

[Rhumsaa]

Tax Haven is a Tax Haven regardless of its geographical location - "offshore" is too often bandied around to deflect attention.

 

Lets see how the UK get on with this.....

 

It's a word that has become synonymous with tax haven unfortunately

 

To argue against it is akin to suggesting cunt wasn't a taboo word until the late 19th century and previously it was a totally fine word to describe a ladies genitalia so therefore you shouldn't be offended. You're technically correct but nobody cares.

 

Of course the problem is that the City of London and Delaware are "onshore" so will never be tarred with that brush. The cunts.

[pongo]

 

Just as the IOM is an offshore British jurisdiction, so the UK is an offshore jurisdiction of the EU, currently.

Different. UK Parliament is sovereign. Tynwald is not.

 

 

There are always going to be ifs and buts, few comparisons are ever going to be completely like for like.

 

But in terms of making sense of what offshore might actually mean I think what I am saying works. Luxembourg is equally an EU tax haven but isn't surrounded by water.

Edited April 15, 2016 by pongo

[woolley]

 

 

Just as the IOM is an offshore British jurisdiction, so the UK is an offshore jurisdiction of the EU, currently.

Different. UK Parliament is sovereign. Tynwald is not.

 

 

There are always going to be ifs and buts, few comparisons are ever going to be completely like for like.

 

But in terms of making sense of what offshore might actually mean I think what I am saying works. Luxembourg is equally an EU tax haven but isn't surrounded by water.

 

Yes. A particularly pernicious one at that.

[Andy Onchan]

 

Just as the IOM is an offshore British jurisdiction, so the UK is an offshore jurisdiction of the EU, currently.

Different. UK Parliament is sovereign. Tynwald is not.

 

 

Is EU sovereign territory?

[woolley]

 

 

Just as the IOM is an offshore British jurisdiction, so the UK is an offshore jurisdiction of the EU, currently.

Different. UK Parliament is sovereign. Tynwald is not.

 

 

Is EU sovereign territory?

 

Yep. 28 different ones.

Edited April 15, 2016 by woolley

[Andy Onchan]

 

 

 

Just as the IOM is an offshore British jurisdiction, so the UK is an offshore jurisdiction of the EU, currently.

Different. UK Parliament is sovereign. Tynwald is not.

 

 

Is EU sovereign territory?

 

Yep. 28 different ones.

 

 

In which case it's exactly the same as Mann/UK.... but different.

Edited April 15, 2016 by Andy Onchan

[woolley]

No. Not at all. Parliament is sovereign. The EU as an entity is not. It is an organisation of states that has joined together to do certain things under treaties signed by those states. The difference is that what parliament gives, parliament can take away as evidenced by the forthcoming referendum.

[Andy Onchan]

No. Not at all. Parliament is sovereign. The EU as an entity is not. It is an organisation of states that has joined together to do certain things under treaties signed by those states. The difference is that what parliament gives, parliament can take away as evidenced by the forthcoming referendum.

 

You might think that but some in the legal profession, law Lords & the European Court of Justice would suggest otherwise.

[woolley]

 

No. Not at all. Parliament is sovereign. The EU as an entity is not. It is an organisation of states that has joined together to do certain things under treaties signed by those states. The difference is that what parliament gives, parliament can take away as evidenced by the forthcoming referendum.

 

You might think that but some in the legal profession, law Lords & the European Court of Justice would suggest otherwise.

 

How so?

[Barrie Stevens]

No. Not at all. Parliament is sovereign. The EU as an entity is not. It is an organisation of states that has joined together to do certain things under treaties signed by those states. The difference is that what parliament gives, parliament can take away as evidenced by the forthcoming referendum.

 

The European Union became an autonomous legal entity with its own sovereign rights following on the implementation of the Lisbon Treaty. In the EU world this comes under Article 47 and took place some time ago now. The EU can thus represent itself globally and undertake its duties and obligations as a sovereign entity.....Prior to this the EU was seen purely as a political union...

 

The Council of Minsters/External relations has available on line a report on how the Lisbon Treaty and thus the EU as a legal entity affects the Isle of Man. Technically, it applies in the context of Protocol 3 or as they put it the requirements relating to entry of new member states into the EEC as at 1972...There are updates relating to matters nuclear that have been updated and apply to the Island I believe.

 

Although one can easily say that the Lisbon Treaty and all that follows on from it does not really apply to the Island the fact is that there is always the "fall out" from its effect in the UK. Thus to be safe one should read that the Lisbon Treaty as it unfolds affects the Island by proxy. I wrote about this at length in the "Examiner" years ago now...ahead of time probably!

 

Basically, the UK is the sovereign or as the EU calls it "the Metropolitan power" of the Isle of Man so they way EU sovereign rights affect the UK also affect the Island....That is really inevitable.

[Barrie Stevens]

No. Not at all. Parliament is sovereign. The EU as an entity is not. It is an organisation of states that has joined together to do certain things under treaties signed by those states. The difference is that what parliament gives, parliament can take away as evidenced by the forthcoming referendum.

 

Parliament can take away (EU membership) but it has to do this by acting within the EU treaties and this has required the pooling of some sovereignty...

 

Parliament is only sovereign in those areas where it has not been pooled with the EU...Which means that a lot of sovereignty is a myth and that is what the fuss is about. So far I have met few people who are sufficiently understanding.

 

Down on my manor I think people will vote (a) out of laziness to stay In (b) The active people will vote Out and might just outnumber the lazy ones who won't be bothered to get up and vote on the day..

 

Down on my manor they have moved the polling station miles away across a major road in a church whereas before it was in a school just round the corner...I have a postal vote but I bet others will say "Can't be arsed!"

[Barrie Stevens]

 

 

No. Not at all. Parliament is sovereign. The EU as an entity is not. It is an organisation of states that has joined together to do certain things under treaties signed by those states. The difference is that what parliament gives, parliament can take away as evidenced by the forthcoming referendum.

 

You might think that but some in the legal profession, law Lords & the European Court of Justice would suggest otherwise.

 

How so?

 

 

The European Court of Justice (ECJ) deals with disputes between member states & etc of the EU...It interprets treaties...Also it deals with employment issues of those employed by the EU...So the ECJ decisions apply to member states...The Isle of Man would come under the ECJ...ie the fuss about bread imports, bread prices and meat derogation etc...But I think the Ramsey Bakery bread issue went to the European Commission and they told the Island to shut up and obey!

[Barrie Stevens]

 

 

Just as the IOM is an offshore British jurisdiction, so the UK is an offshore jurisdiction of the EU, currently.

Different. UK Parliament is sovereign. Tynwald is not.

 

 

Is EU sovereign territory?

 

 

It has in recent times evolved as a single legal entity from its previous status as a mere political union..The EU can now act as one and has its own sovereign rights.

[Andy Onchan]

 

 

 

[quote name="pongo" post="1078676" timestamp="1460724404"?

 

Just as the IOM is an offshore British jurisdiction, so the UK is an offshore jurisdiction of the EU, currently.

Different. UK Parliament is sovereign. Tynwald is not.

 

Is EU sovereign territory?

 

It has in recent times evolved as a single legal entity from its previous status as a mere political union..The EU can now act as one and has its own sovereign rights.

 

And so the doctrine of supremacy would apply?

[Barrie Stevens]

 

 

 

 

 

[quote name="pongo" post="1078676" timestamp="1460724404"?

 

Just as the IOM is an offshore British jurisdiction, so the UK is an offshore jurisdiction of the EU, currently.

Different. UK Parliament is sovereign. Tynwald is not.

 

Is EU sovereign territory?

 

It has in recent times evolved as a single legal entity from its previous status as a mere political union..The EU can now act as one and has its own sovereign rights.

 

And so the doctrine of supremacy would apply?

 

Not necessarily as the EU can only do that which its member states agree it will do...When it does those things it can act as single legal entity in its own rights and within its powers it has sovereign rights...(You can Google it and get the fully details as there are some learned publications out there)