American mass shooting

[Shake me up Judy]

Yes, but often as not the Empire and colonialism also brought rule of law and social legislation to places where previously none had existed.

[Chinahand]

@SMUJ Of course, I'm not disputing that, there were good things and bad things. I'm simply highlighting one of the bad. I hope you can see both a hang over from empire and the influence of Islamic culture in the map I put up - the Portuguese Spanish French & Germans haven't left this legacy on their colonies- why I don't know but I'd guess public schools might have some responsibility;-)

[Bombay Bad Boy]

<tinfoil> http://thefreethoughtproject.com/police-admit-officers-orlando-shooting/

[the stinking enigma]

you only have to look at the amount of bullet holes on the outside wall to guage their accuracy

[Chinahand]

I think what Obama had to say about blaming this on radical Islam was interesting.

 

Hee hee ... the professorial president goes on almost as much as I do!

And let me make a final point. For a while now, the main contribution of some of my friends on the other side of the aisle have made in the fight against ISIL is to criticize this administration and me for not using the phrase “radical Islam.” That’s the key, they tell us -- we can’t beat ISIL unless we call them “radical Islamists.” What exactly would using this label accomplish? What exactly would it change? Would it make ISIL less committed to trying to kill Americans? Would it bring in more allies? Is there a military strategy that is served by this? The answer is none of the above. Calling a threat by a different name does not make it go away. This is a political distraction. Since before I was President, I’ve been clear about how extremist groups have perverted Islam to justify terrorism. As President, I have repeatedly called on our Muslim friends and allies at home and around the world to work with us to reject this twisted interpretation of one of the world’s great religions.

There has not been a moment in my seven and a half years as President where we have not been able to pursue a strategy because we didn’t use the label "radical Islam." ...

[We] ... know who the nature of the enemy is.

So there’s no magic to the phrase “radical Islam.” It’s a political talking point; it's not a strategy. And the reason I am careful about how I describe this threat has nothing to do with political correctness and everything to do with actually defeating extremism. Groups like ISIL and al Qaeda want to make this war a war between Islam and America, or between Islam and the West. They want to claim that they are the true leaders of over a billion Muslims around the world who reject their crazy notions. They want us to validate them by implying that they speak for those billion-plus people; that they speak for Islam. That’s their propaganda. That's how they recruit. And if we fall into the trap of painting all Muslims with a broad brush and imply that we are at war with an entire religion -- then we’re doing the terrorists' work for them.

Now, up until this point, this argument about labels has mostly just been partisan rhetoric. And, sadly, we've all become accustomed to that kind of partisanship, even when it involves the fight against these extremist groups. And that kind of yapping has not prevented folks across government from doing their jobs, from sacrificing and working really hard to protect the American people.

But we are now seeing how dangerous this kind of mindset and this kind of thinking can be. We're starting to see where this kind of rhetoric and loose talk and sloppiness about who exactly we're fighting, where this can lead us. We now have proposals from the presumptive Republican nominee for President of the United States to bar all Muslims from emigrating to America. We hear language that singles out immigrants and suggests that entire religious communities are complicit in violence. Where does this stop? The Orlando killer, one of the San Bernardino killers, the Fort Hood killer -- they were all U.S. citizens.

Are we going to start treating all Muslim Americans differently? Are we going to start subjecting them to special surveillance? Are we going to start discriminating against them because of their faith? We’ve heard these suggestions during the course of this campaign. Do Republican officials actually agree with this? Because that's not the America we want. It doesn't reflect our democratic ideals. It won’t make us more safe; it will make us less safe -- fueling ISIL’s notion that the West hates Muslims, making young Muslims in this country and around the world feel like no matter what they do, they're going to be under suspicion and under attack. It makes Muslim Americans feel like they're government is betraying them. It betrays the very values America stands for.
We've gone through moments in our history before when we acted out of fear -- and we came to regret it. We've seen our government mistreat our fellow citizens. And it has been a shameful part of our history.

This is a country founded on basic freedoms, including freedom of religion. We don't have religious tests here. Our Founders, our Constitution, our Bill of Rights are clear about that. And if we ever abandon those values, we would not only make it a lot easier to radicalize people here and around the world, but we would have betrayed the very things we are trying to protect -- the pluralism and the openness, our rule of law, our civil liberties -- the very things that make this country great; the very things that make us exceptional. And then the terrorists would have won. And we cannot let that happen. I will not let that happen.

...

Our diversity and our respect for one another, our drawing on the talents of everybody in this country, our making sure that we are treating everybody fairly -- that we’re not judging people on the basis of what faith they are or what race they are, or what ethnicity they are, or what their sexual orientation is -- that’s what makes this country great. That’s the spirit we see in Orlando. That’s the unity and resolve that will allow us to defeat ISIL. That’s what will preserve our values and our ideals that define us as Americans. That’s how we’re going to defend this nation, and that’s how we’re going to defend our way of life.

[Lxxx]

Full of shit

[Rhumsaa]

Full of shit

 

I dunno

 

Sometimes Chinahand makes a couple of good points

[the stinking enigma]

that speech is straight outta hollywood

[Mr Marshal]

Great speech. He should get the Nobel peace prize for that.

[slinkydevil]

[Rhumsaa]

[thebees]

You're being ridiculous a 7 year old child cannot go to the shop and buy a gun. You can kill someone with a kitchen knife just as easily as you can with a gun, I think there is more to all of this than meets the eye. I've had to stop watching the news and reading papers, everything I watch/read is trying too hard to convince me of something or other.

[Mr. Sausages]

You can kill someone with a kitchen knife just as easily as you can with a gun,

No you can't.

[thebees]

Is that a challenge?

[Mr. Sausages]

Yes it is. You get a kitchen knife. I get a gun.