Farage tastes some sweet irony

[rmanx]

The tide is turning

 

Yes it is. White extremists and right wing extremists are buoyed on by the Brexit and Trump wins. What would normally be shunned as offensive behaviour is now being legitimised.

 

Mair is the first of many. It will not end with him.

[woolley]

He really believes his Alice in Wonderland nonsense. There was always going to be a reaction to the social engineering experiment we have experienced. You cannot fundamentally change the make up of societies and expect everything to rub along fine. It's been coming for years. No surprise, except to the naive.

[quilp]

Putting on a brave, tolerant attitude, all the while hoping the crocodile will eat him last.

[pongo]

Little wonder we have crazies like Jo Coxs' killer.

That lie needs to be put to bed. He wasn't "a crazy". He was a mainstream right wing extremist. The claim that he was a crazy was a lie put around by those who sought to create a distance around him.

 

 

 

 

I despise the useful idiots and dhimmi's such as rmanx. For it is people like him who have actively encouraged the scourge of islamism and deculturalism to creep into our society.

By the same criteria as you are using in your assessment of rmanx, would you consider Jo Cox MP to have been a "useful idiot' or a "dhimmi"?

 

That's a 'loaded' question which I will decline to answer.

 

It's a straight question - only loaded by what you bring to it.

 

I'm not an apologist. I don't seek to justify religious extremism or any form of terrorism - past or present. I equally dislike religious extremism and political populism - both pose an equivalent threat to the society I value.

[rmanx]

He really believes his Alice in Wonderland nonsense. There was always going to be a reaction to the social engineering experiment we have experienced. You cannot fundamentally change the make up of societies and expect everything to rub along fine. It's been coming for years. No surprise, except to the naive.

 

Just say what you mean...Race War...the right wing wet dream.

 

They can finally exercise their impotent rage against a convenient enemy while the real enemy sits back and laughs it self the bank.

[woolley]

 

He really believes his Alice in Wonderland nonsense. There was always going to be a reaction to the social engineering experiment we have experienced. You cannot fundamentally change the make up of societies and expect everything to rub along fine. It's been coming for years. No surprise, except to the naive.

 

Just say what you mean...Race War...the right wing wet dream.

 

They can finally exercise their impotent rage against a convenient enemy while the real enemy sits back and laughs it self the bank.

 

Call it what you like. It's human nature, pure and evil. You are the one rowing against the tide. It's like walking a tightrope across a gorge, falling off and then blaming those who warned you about doing it in the first place. The right wing never wanted race war and they certainly weren't the ones who created the conditions for it.

[woolley]

 

Mair is the first of many. It will not end with him.

 

Specialist subject: The bleeding obvious.

[rmanx]

 

The right wing never wanted race war...

 

You have heard of organisations like the KKK, BNP, EDL, etc?

 

Their sole purpose is to get the great unwashed all whipped up into a frenzy of racial hatred and xenophobia.

 

You speak of useful idiots, yet you are the ones turning a blind eye to likes of these groups and refuse to acknowledge that they are a danger to our society.

[rmanx]

 

 

Mair is the first of many. It will not end with him.

 

Specialist subject: The bleeding obvious.

 

 

Specialist subject: blaming it on Muslims and Liberals.

[woolley]

 

 

 

Mair is the first of many. It will not end with him.

 

Specialist subject: The bleeding obvious.

 

 

Specialist subject: blaming it on Muslims and Liberals.

 

Fixed. You can't blame opportunists for taking advantage of complaceny.

[rmanx]

 

Fixed. You can't blame opportunists for taking advantage of complaceny.

 

 

Like I said...the only useful idiot here is you and your ilk.

[woolley]

 

 

Fixed. You can't blame opportunists for taking advantage of complaceny.

 

 

Like I said...the only useful idiot here is you and your ilk.

 

You and yours, actually.

[quilp]

As we're down to comparisons let's rake over some old ground regarding equalism...

 

We've said Farewell to Anjem Choudary, Farewell for two and a half years, anyway. Last September he was sentenced by a British judge to five and a half years in prison for encouraging people (other muslims) to join Islamic State. If he behaves himself in prison he could be out in half that time, although when he emerges, it is unlikely that it will be as a reformed character. But the law has taken its course and a rule-bound society has responded in the way a rule-bound society ought to behave-- by following due process.

 

So it is useful to compare the experience of Anjem Choudary and the way in which the state has responded to him with the way in which it has responded to another person at the other end of the spectrum...

 

It is now seven years ago that a young British man from Luton going by the name of Tommy Robinson formed the English Defence League (EDL). He did so after he and other residents of the town of Luton were appalled by a group of radical Muslims who protested a home-coming parade for British troops. There is some interesting symmetry here in that the Islamists present in Luton that day were members of Choudary's group, al-Muhajiroun. Robinson and other residents of Luton were not only taken aback by the behaviour of the radicals but also by the behaviour of the police who protected the radicals from the increasingly angry local residents.

 

Whatever its legitimate reasons when it began, the EDL did undoubtedly cause trouble: protests often descending into thuggery, partly because it attracted some bad people and partly because "anti-facist" counter-demonstrators often ensured that EDL protests became violent by starting fights with them. But through most of the time that Robinson led the EDL, there did appear to be (confirmed by third party observers including independent journalist) a sincere and concerted effort to keep genuinely problematic elements out of the organisation. To those who said that Robinson and his friends had no right to organise protests, there are two responses. The first is that they had as much right as anyone else. And second, that the problems they were objecting to (hate-preachers and grooming gangs and so on) are real issues, which the state has increasingly realised are such in these years that have followed.

 

In 2013 Robinson left the group he started, and in the years since, has engaged in a range of activities, including authoring a book. The book chronicles, among other things, a campaign by the state of harassment, which began from the very moment Robinson formed the EDL. His own house and those of his nearest relatives were repeatedly raided by police and computers and other materials taken away for examination. Any fair reading of the book-- whose details again have been broadly confirmed by the few journalists who have been interested in the case-- suggests that there was a very clear and concerted effort to find something-- ANYTHING-- on Robinson, to get him silenced and locked-up.

 

In the end the police did find something-- a mortgage fraud matter-- for which he was eventually tried and found guilty. In 2014, he was imprisoned for eighteen months. Even after his release the efforts to find something on Robinson continued. His movements were restricted. His ability to speak and congregate were restricted. He was repeatedly threatened with a return to prison for alleged breaches of bail conditions. On one occasion, the nature of the charge was a brawl Robinson has been involved with in prison, with a Muslim prisoner who was allegedly in the act of attacking Robinson-- who had repeatedly been placed in prison wings which housed large and segregated numbers of Muslim inmates.

 

Since his release, as before, Robinson has been repeatedly assaulted on the streets, including by Luton Muslims who have faced no charges for their attacks, even when caught on camera. In February of this year, he was hospitalised after being assaulted upon leaving a nightclub in Essex.

 

Then, this August, as he and his family were attending a football match in Cambridge, they were once again the subject of police harassment. While sitting in a pub with his wife and young children, they were ejected from the pub by Cambridgeshire Police. The police did this despite the volunteered insistence of the management of the pub that the family had been doing nothing wrong and causing no trouble. Police escorted Robinson and his family from the premises, and on the video footage you can easily hear the sound of Robinson's young children crying.

 

Now, there will be those who think that such harassment of Robinson is correct-- that in order to keep the peace it is necessary to keep an eye on anybody who may have any effect to the contrary. But if that is true, it is curious that such measures were not routinely used on Anjem Choudary in all his years living freely in the community. It would be interesting to know if there are any records of Choudary and his family and friends/relatives being harassed by police or removed from establishment's while the hate-preacher was on whatever down-time he used to have. Or whether the British police ever routinely raid and search the houses of radical Islamists in the hope of finding errors in their VAT returns and the like.

 

But of course the very comparison is unfair and in many ways lazy, because Tommy Robinson has not been-- as Choudary was-- at the heart of a nexus of terrorists and terrorist-supporters going back years. Robinson has not been on friendly terms with numerous people who have beheaded civilians and carried out suicide bombings.

 

There are not any occasions, as far as I'm aware, on which Robinson has called for violence or the breaking of the law in the name of his political views. But in the eyes of the law, much of the media and a certain number of people, put Robinson in an exceptionally unfortunate position. He is not a radical islamist and nor is he from any discernible minority. He is a white, working-class man who, it appears, can thus not only be harassed by certain authorities with impunity, but can find few, if any defenders of his rights among the vast panoply of people in our societies who are only too keen to defend the rights of islamists.

 

Civil liberties groups such as 'Liberty' (sic) which are so stringent in protecting the rights of islamist groups such as 'Cage', are silent on the case of Tommy Robinson. To consider why this is so is to see to the heart of a problem that Britain has been going through in recent years and which seems destined to continue for many years to come.

 

A problem exacerbated by those whose political ethics prevent any reasonable debate or offer any possible solutions other than appeasement of the 'victimised' minority and the vilification of a plain-speaking (forgotten) majority.

[quilp]

Muslim Terrorism is not the biggest source of terrorism...

 

Thomas Mair is a symptom of something much more insidious...an enemy with a white face. Its easy to make an enemy if they look different, or a different accent. Its the unseen enemy that is the most dangerous.

Thanks for proving my point in so many respects.

[quilp]

Thomas Mair acted alone and without the encouragement of a expanded network of thugs and supremacists. It could not've been predicted.

 

His heinous crime does not reflect the aims of the ("cancer of society" [dear oh dear!]) right-wing in Britain.