pongo Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 (edited) Cargo Cults Maybe building a life size replica of a cruise ship out of seaweed and straw would help to attract more. Quote The name derives from the belief which began among Melanesians in the late 19th and early 20th century that various ritualistic acts such as the building of an airplane runway will result in the appearance of material wealth, particularly highly desirable Western goods (i.e., "cargo"), via Western airplanes. Cargo cults often develop during a combination of crises. Under conditions of social stress, such a movement may form under the leadership of a charismatic figure. This leader may have a "vision" (or "myth-dream") of the future Edited December 3, 2017 by pongo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the stinking enigma Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 It's time to unveil that giant seagull i say. But with a diamond encrusted 24 carat gold crown on it's head just because we can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 2 hours ago, woody2 said: you forget iomg get a set amount through the common purse agreement for every visitor, it was £50 per visitor in 2005..... Please show me where that is written. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 3 minutes ago, Barrie Stevens said: Please show me where that is written. Quote Despite this, in a Tynwald debate in December 2005, the Minister for Tourism and Leisure revealed that every visitor to Mann from the UK, even if only on a day visit, was worth £50 to the Isle of Man Treasury in additional Common Purse allowance.[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Purse_Agreement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gettafa Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 2 hours ago, woody2 said: you forget iomg get a set amount through the common purse agreement for every visitor, it was £50 per visitor in 2005..... Offer the cruise ships a tenner a head for each passenger that sets foot on Mann. Hey! £40 profit straight away. (Or has the Isle of Man already tried those sort of tactics and got sussed. Managed to get many £100millions out of it though) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 13 minutes ago, gettafa said: Offer the cruise ships a tenner a head for each passenger that sets foot on Mann. Hey! £40 profit straight away. (Or has the Isle of Man already tried those sort of tactics and got sussed. Managed to get many £100millions out of it though) i said before the only gain will be the vat, the question is for how long before the agreement is changed leaving taxpayers with a massive bill..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempus Fugit Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 14 hours ago, gettafa said: Is that cable actually used anyway? They could have used it supply electricity to the Island but doing that would have meant the crooks wouldn't have got away with all those £100millions on the New Power Station/gas pipeline. And if it supplied data we wouldn't all be getting ripped by Manx Telecom afaik - the cable is used a lot, for months at a time when the gast turbines are undergoing maintenance the Island runs solely on the interconnector cable, so it is crucial it is safeguarded. I don't know if there is much export these days, there used to be times in the day when the UK grid price was high that it was profitable to export for the peak demand, but not sure if that's still the case (will have to ask my mole !) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempus Fugit Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 (edited) dup Edited December 3, 2017 by Tempus Fugit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manximus Aururaneus Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 Some look forward, some prefer crab soup... https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/887606/scotland-glasgow-claedonian-university-moffat-cntre-superyacht-cruises Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Non-Believer Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 So there we have it then (iomtoday). After 2 FOI requests, because they refused to answer the first one (or hadn't made a figure up in time), the spend figures for visiting cruise passengers is released. £44 each. Not the £70+ that had previously been claimed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 19 minutes ago, Non-Believer said: So there we have it then (iomtoday). After 2 FOI requests, because they refused to answer the first one (or hadn't made a figure up in time), the spend figures for visiting cruise passengers is released. £44 each. Not the £70+ that had previously been claimed. Having spent several hours on pole position watching overweight yanks, which is to say most of them, dodging landing bikers to get their shuttle back to the mother-ship I would say that £44 apiece is a massiver over-exaggeration..... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Non-Believer said: So there we have it then (iomtoday). After 2 FOI requests, because they refused to answer the first one (or hadn't made a figure up in time), the spend figures for visiting cruise passengers is released. £44 each. Not the £70+ that had previously been claimed. Rather than a second FoI request, it was an appeal from the first one[1], which had asked Can you please confirm that the Department has carried out analysis to determine the current value of a cruise passenger when visiting the Isle of Man. If so please advise what that figure is and how it is calculated. This was refused initially but when it was appealed at the end of November even the crew of the Sparshop Enterprise realised there was no way it could get away with that and released the information at the last possible moment over the Christmas holidays in the hope no one would notice. It's worth looking at the full answer they gave: Quote Upon review the Department accepts that no public harm will result in providing this information and considers that it should be released. Therefore we are disclosing the following information relating to the value of a cruise passenger when visiting the Isle of Man. The Deloitte report on development of an Isle of Man cruise ship deep water berth, submitted to the Department in July 2017, states “We have calculated an average of £44.48 as the average passenger gross spend in the economy per head”. In terms of the methodology, the report states that “We have obtained the average passenger gross spends from a number of reports, including historic Isle of Man figures , other comparable islands and Rest of World (ROW) from 2012-2015, resulting in a calculated average gross spend of £44.48”. So they paid Deloittes to basically come up with a vague guess[2] - and are still trying to hide the way it was calculated. if it was based on anything at all. It's also worth pointing out that such estimates are only based on those who bother to come ashore but the figures seem to be applied to the full complement of passengers. Also not all that 'gross spend' will stay on the Island. If a tour of the Island is included (and that's the item most likely to make a big contribution), there will be a fairly hefty commission that is retained by the cruise company. So even if these optimistic figures are accurate they may be over-estimating the economic benefit. [1] Unlike most other FoI requests, the requester clearly knew what to do and demolished the attempt to evade scrutiny surgically: The DoE asserts that the information is "qualified exempt information", but do not justify why that specific piece of information cannot be released. They claim it is still being used to develop policy. But the specific piece of information requested exists, and will not change, so there can be no justification for withholding it. It is in the public interest to release it. It is not reasonable for the information to be withheld. The factors for withholding the information do not outweigh the factors for its release. Despite the assertion that the Dept requires further time to consider the information does not alter the fact of a cruise passenger spend. No public harm would result in providing this information.” [2] Which they still managed to give to the nearest penny. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dilligaf Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 I don't believe it is anywhere near £44. How much did that stupid answer cost to obtain and how much more will it cost for people to lie in support of that figure.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finlo Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 14 minutes ago, dilligaf said: I don't believe it is anywhere near £44. How much did that stupid answer cost to obtain and how much more will it cost for people to lie in support of that figure.? 44 pence would be closer to the truth. 3 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbie Bobster Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 2 hours ago, Non-Believer said: So there we have it then (iomtoday). After 2 FOI requests, because they refused to answer the first one (or hadn't made a figure up in time), the spend figures for visiting cruise passengers is released. £44 each. Not the £70+ that had previously been claimed. On 17/01/2017 at 1:00 PM, Bobbie Bobster said: I fired up the Fermi estimator and this is what I got. Average direct spend per cruise visitor seems to be order of magnitude about £100. Say indirect spend via fees, service costs etc is 50% on top of that. Assume smallish vessels, max 1,000 and 80% of the passengers visit. So that's £120k turnover per ship visit. Take the "economic benefit" as similar to the margin on the turnover at about 25%, that's £30k per ship visit. Say 50 visits per season, that's £1.5m per annum of benefit. Very quick and dirty analysis, but the direct economic benefit busienss case doesn't seem to stack up. ETA: There's probably a VAT/tax benefit in addition which might double the economic benefit, but it's still a long payback for £50mil. In the overall scheme of things, I wasn't too far out with my estimate - in the context of analysing if spending £50mil on a berth made economic sense. Makes even less sense at £44 per head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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